I hate the verses...

[studiosonic]

...it's true. I'm relatively new at song writing. I'm 21 and am now trying to actually record full tracks with lyrics. The past few years I just compose little snippets of songs but never finish them. This year I want to finish an album's worth of material. The way I write, the music comes first. I get a good guitar riff or keyboard part and build around it. I can get the whole track done, and then do lyrics for the chorus, and then I come to the verses - and that's where I get stuck. My lyrics sounds crap - i feel they're really corny and I can't get a decent melody on them.

I feel my verses are limited because I try to fit them to the music already recorded. Do you think it's a better idea to get a melody and lyrics done before I start to form the rest of the track? I feel my tracks are lead more by the instruments, as opposed to them being a backing for a melody. My melodies are quite weak, but then the backing is usually a soft-rocky kinda groove with a looping guitar/keyboard part, which doesn't sounds just like a backing track.

Any advice? I'm basically creating tracks I really like - all done bar the verse lyrics/melody and then they just come to a standstill. I could start with the verse lyrics/melody first, but then I feel my tracks might not come out like they are now.

oh bugger .........

[LanaCrowley]

I think it is different for most . for me .. if I get a melody first with no lyrics .. I find it harder to put together .. for the most part I write the lyrics first then find a melody that goes with them ...

IMO it is easier to write music around words than to write words around music ...

Lana

[Jagular]

I do it both ways. Sometimes I get a hook or a melody line in my head and develop from there. Sometimes I get a chord progression in my head or a neat riff and develop it from there. I seldom (if ever) actually construct the entire song before I write the lyrics. Sometimes the lyrics or the idea or the way I want to present it call for different song structures. Sometimes a bridge is in order sometimes not. Sometimes there is no chorus, sometimes there is.

I don’t know if this helps at all, but there really is no right way to do it. It just takes practice to figure out how you do your best writing.

[limoguy]

I find most often I start writing the lyrics first. As I do, the melody usually comes to me as I'm writing. The two go together. The number of stressed syllables in the lyric gives me an idea of what the melody is going to do, and once I know that I can shape it that way.

On the philosophical level: songwriting is like sculpting something beautiful out of a lump of clay. Do a little today, leave it when you get stuck, come back tomorrow and work it some more.

On the practical side: Pat Pattison has some great books out on songwriting. Most are available on-line through amazon.com. Maybe check them out! I still learn something new every time I open them.

Don't feel bad though! I've taken many songs that I thought were complete, stripped them down to nothing and re-wrote them completely!

IMHO

Limoguy

[DonkeyZone]

just a couple of ideas....

1) after you come up with the chorus lyrics to a melody that you have set, take the lyrics and change them completely so they still fit the music, but expand on a singular idea. Since you said you can write the chorus melody easy enough, think of another melody for the chorus instead. This way, you're substituting one for the other.

Its the same thing for when you start writing verses...sometimes its easier to push your first verse down to make it the second verse, and write a new first verse. For some reason, it works.

2) If you have the whole track completed, then try this:

Write a guitar melody over what you have already. What would it sound like if you added one more part to it? That will be your lyric melody. Take that and just come up with words in the same rhythm & styling. Then, when you're done, you can erase the guitar part.

[studiosonic]

Thanks for the ideas guys. I think I'm gonna try some different ways of getting my songs done. I'll try writing some lyrics first and see where that takes me. DonkeyZone - I like the idea of playing a guitar bit over the top to help form the melody. I think I'll give that a try too!

[jtlaurie]

You're going the right path. Never write lyrics first. Always compose the song first. From there you will be able to hum a melody which you will somehow come up with a few words. From there it's all filling in the pieces of the puzzle. Try to get the chorus first so that you have a catch phrase or a them you can use to help you build you verses. Rememebr, verse 1 is the introduction to your story, the second verse is the background to your story. The chorus is the exact point you are trying to make.If you're going to write a bridge, it should represent a different angle on what your trying to say. That's all I can say. Oh, buy a Rhyming dictionary. It always helps.

Josh

[Porter]

David Gates from Bread was given music to which he wrote the words.

Personally, I write either lyrics first or lyrics & music at the same time... ie messing around on a guitar or piano, hearing 2 or 3 chords together then writing a lyric on top of them then go from there.

Porter