in ear moniters

[SilusX]

Hey folks,

I am in the market for in ear moniters for my live gigs. I am looking to spend around $1000.00. I would apprciate any comments or suggestions : )

Thanks,
Dave

[Light]

I don't know your exact situation, but I would probably recommend against it, for only $1000.00. There was a thread about this a few months ago, where I listed some of what I would consider the pros and cons.

http://homerecording.com/bbs/showthr...threadid=61159


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

[SilusX]

Thanks for the tip Light, I did go read your post and it was very helpful. I have given this much thought and here is my take on it, I do a 1 man solo acoustic gig just vocals and guitar. I always run my own sound and have a decent board(mackie 1642). So my choices are a floor moniter maybe powered maybe not. I am trying to keep my System down to a managble size( I haul and set up my own gear) What I am looking for is more of a maufacturer comparision it seems like the choices are Shure, Sennhiser(spell check please : ) ) Samson, and I saw Carvin was mentioned in the other thread. Any help or recomendations would be appriciated.

Dave

[jrosenstein]

I'll start off this post by saying I've neither owned nor used in ear monitors for gigging. But just something to throw out there .... I listened to a pair of Etymotics recently, and they sounded SWEET. And i think they quote something like 23-24db isolation. If you need wireless this might not be ideal (or maybe you could set yourself up with a transmitter -- like I said, i haven't dealt with on-stage in-ear setups). But here are the etymotics:

http://www.headphone.com/layout.php?...tID=0020100000


Just a thought.

- jacob

[Badger]

My band uses In ear monitors. Here is our current setup

My rig, one of these
http://www.rolls.com/new/pm350.html




it has three inputs, a line in from the board for the monitor mix, a line in from my keyboard, and an XLR in from my microphone. It has individual volume controls for each one, so I can tweak my own monitor mix on the fly. It even has an XLR out for my keyboard so it can act like a direct box. This is one of the coolest things ever....maybe Im just easily amused. it was about 60 bucks, IIRC.
For headphones I use Etymotic ER6's . I highly recomend these, they cut out most outside noise, they sound great, and they are quite reasonable. Ear molds are available, but I have not needed them. They also supposedly cut out at 120 DB, which while not particulary good for your ears, isnt going to deafen you instantly. I dont know how well this works, and I hope I dont find out.

My bass player, gtr player and drummer all use Carvin PM100 wireless ear monitors. 3 recievers, one transmitter. Purchased on ebay for 225, so it was 75 bucks a piece for them. They work ok, they probably dont get loud enough to use if you have a lot of stage noise. We are a blues band, so we dont play that loud. They work fine for us.

The carvin ear monitors appear to be rebadged Nadys. These being used, did not come with the stock ear buds. From what I read on the net, the stock ear buds suck anyway. My drummer uses shure E1's, the GTR and Bass player just use consumer earphones, but plan on getting etymotics or E1's soon.

A limiter would be wise. I plan on getting a Behringer Multicom for this purpose, but until then we are just extremely cautious.

[Light]

Originally posted by Bdgr
They also supposedly cut out at 120 DB, which while not particularly good for your ears, isn’t going to deafen you instantly. I don’t know how well this works, and I hope I don’t find out.

At 120 dB OSHA states that significant hearing lose begins after only 7.5 minutes. Of course, this is for prolonged exposure to 120 dB. If you are hitting peeks of 120, you are almost certainly averaging 110 dB, which will cause damage after only 30 minutes. Also, remember that these levels are cumulative. ANY exposure to high sound levels causes some damage. You should NEVER use in ear monitors without a limiter in line, and if your transmitter has one, add another of your own.

Also remember, OSHA is talking about SPL at a distance. The levels coming out of in ear monitors is much more serious, and much faster. The speaker is very close to your ear, and there is no where else for the pressure to go, because the ear pieces are blocking the pressure in. When your ear is open, IE when you do not have ear plugs in, the excess pressure can escape (a little, not much). The same is true, to a lesser degree, with headphones. I would never want to have more than about 80 dB present at my ears when using in ear monitors, which is not very loud. This is why the custom ear molds are such a good idea. They keep out more outside noise, so you can keep the level of your in ears lower.

Bdgr, I am glad your band is comfortable with the system you are using, but I would highly recommend you get a limiter in line between the mixer and your ears. It will save your ears.

BTW, Dave, I think you could be a good candidate for in ears. Just remember to get a limiter in line, before your transmitter. Spend some money on this, because this is the most important line of defense for your ears. Do not skimp, it is not worth it. Do not trust the limiters built in to the transmitters, but use them as a back up. My guess is that your stage volume is not very high, so may be able to get away with not using custom ear molds, but it would be a good idea none the less.

As far as brand, I do not have much of an opinion. It would be best if you could try them out, as this would give you the best idea of how they sound, and which ones you like the most. I would also like to see you try them because many people decide the hate the feel of in ear monitors. I always have bands try them a few times before they make a decision. It is usually good to have stage monitors for the first few shows as well, because if you decide you don't like them, or if something goes wrong, you have a backup.

http://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owad...ARDS&p_id=9736



Light


"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

[Badger]

Originally posted by Light
[B]At 120 dB OSHA states that significant hearing lose begins after only 7.5 minutes. Of course, this is for prolonged exposure to 120 dB. If you are hitting peeks of 120, you are almost certainly averaging 110 dB, which will cause damage after only 30 minutes. Also, remember that these levels are cumulative. ANY exposure to high sound levels causes some damage. You should NEVER use in ear monitors without a limiter in line, and if your transmitter has one, add another of your own.

Believe me, I am not pushing them any where near that hard. One of the reasons I am going with ear monitors is so that we dont have to be exposed to the high sould levels. When I mentioned the 120 db thing, I was saying that if someone kicked over a mic, or something else unexepected happened, it couldnt peak up instantly to the point that it would instantly deafen me. I do plan to add a limiter eventually though

The Carvins dont really put out enough to be a real hazard. In fact, that is the number one complaint, they arent very loud. They do have a limiter, but again I plan on getting a multicom so I can use a limiter on thier channel, my channel, and have a couple of compressor limiters left over.

This is why the custom ear molds are such a good idea. They keep out more outside noise, so you can keep the level of your in ears lower.

The etymotics shut out quite a bit of noise without the molds. The molds would be more comfortable, however.

[SilusX]

Thanks again everybody for your replys one of the great things about this board is the quality information that people share.

Light:

My stage sound is very quiet I run my Martin into a Boss GT3(used as a Pre Amp and effect) direct into 2 channels of My Mackie 1642. The past 4 years I have been gigging without stage monitors. Most of my gigs are small to medium affairs playing anywhere from 20 to 200 people. Mostly at Restaurants,pubs,coffee houses and bars. I have been slowly upgrading my rig over time, my most recent purchase is a pair of Mackie SRM450s. I am going to purchase some kind of stage monitor in the next month I am just getting as much info as I can before I pull the trigger. After reading your responses I am definitly going to get a limiter if I go with the in ear system. I see where Shure makes a a wired version of the in ear and I am leaning heavily towards that . It seems to be a little cheaper then the wireless and I usually sit on a stool when I gig. Anyways thanks again for your help I will post and review when I decide on the system I want.

Cheers,
Dave

[RSMITH123]

I'm kinda late, sorry.

I have used a monitor set up mixed with phones/earbuds throughout the band with a Furman 16ch monitor mixer system where every member fixes thier own mix. We used it for 2 days and we are, for the moment, using a 7 monitor mix system based around a modified 24-4 with 12 wedges on stage.

I totally fell in love with the control. If you are a 1 man band, don't let anything stop you. In fact, the only thing that should slow you is the decision to use headphones-wired or earbuds-wired or wireless. Some of my people prefered headphones as I prefered earbuds, even hardwired $25 ones.

When you do it, your house mix always benefits.

I will probably buy the 600$ shure system for myself and upgrade the buds to their best ones later. I'm the only one going wireless at the moment.

2cents

[Badger]

Give the etymotics a try for the earbuds...A lot of places have a liberal returm policy if you dont like them

[ALBERTPIKE]

One advantage of earbuds is controlling feedback, but if your stage is quiet and your gigs are fairly low volume, this is not such a problem. Plugging both ears will shut out ambient noise, including the sound from your guitar. Some acoustic players find this disorienting -- those using earbuds sometimes just plug one ear. For much less than $1000 you could buy a nice full-range acoustic amp and use it as a monitor (for example, SWR California Blond). For your smaller gigs, you could get by using nothing but the amp -- run your Boss, etc, into the amp. Most of these amps have a built in mixer with mic inputs, direct out, effects loops, and many helpful features for acoustic players. Just an idea.

[SilusX]

Hey Folks,
Thanks for everyones posts, I think I am going to get the Shure PSM600 hardwired in ear system. I am not sure on the Ear buds yet there are a couple of choices out there. I am leaning towards the Shure E5s I just think they are a little spendy.I am still open to ideas and suggestions and I post my purchase and a review.

Dave

[AriC]

Hey SilusX !

I use Etymotics 4S/P . They do very well two things: 25 db insulation and sounds marvelous. It's really a reference ear-bud.

ETY also have a ER 6 model that is less spendy but also is very good.

You may find tons of info at www.head-fi.org

a forum like this one about headphone listening. I'm sure you will find what you want.

Best

Ari