Singer's Forum Part II

[chessparov]

So...
Anyone wanna talk vocals?

[Chris Tondreau]

I'm always in.... though as soon as I start talking about "inhaling the voice," I'm sure people think I'm completely nuts...

Chris

[powderfinger]

anyone have some tips on strengthening the upper range of one's voice...not really extending it.........

my upper register is from a Ab to C (4th through 8th fret on high E on the guit) ......ie, i can hit notes up there, but can't (and don't need to) sing a whole song up there............any tips on strengthening this part of the range?

the A is usually as high as i need to go....some times i can just nail it w/ power, but some times i get the 'cracking, stretching for the note' sound........are there proper techniques that can get me killing these every time? should these be sung only in the 'head' voice or still with a blend? I can hit them easier with just head, but they don't seem to have the tone......

WE NEED A SINGING FORUM

[kelitupu]

Here some quick ideas/tips about how to improve your high range.

1) Relax and open your mouth more as you get into your higher register. Learn to feel tension in your neck. As soon as you feel tension (anything that doesn't feel "relaxed"), stop singing, regroup, try to regain that relaxed feeling or position, than try again -- even if it's hours later or the next day. Better not to sing at all than to sing with tension.

2) Sing scales and sing them lightly -- at first. A good scale exercise is just to sing a five note major pentachord on ma (ma-ah-ah-ah-ah...), then go up by 1/2 step until you've reached your vocal break (your passagio) where you have to go into falsetto. If you can sing the scale in falsetto comfortably, keep going. If not, go back down by 1/2 steps, then start again. The main thing is to sing the scales lightly. May feel weird at first, but trust me, the volume will come later. Opera singers can belt because they've sung these scales for years and years and have strengthened their vocal cords. Also, they've learned how to mix their chest voice with their head voice (a whole other topic).

3) Start to think about singing as you would playing any other instrument; that is, the best performances come from a relaxed place where the performer is breathing properly (deeply, from the diaphgram, w/minimal or no shoulder heaving). Keyboard players, guitar players, basically all instrumentalists are taught to hold and play their instruments in a certain way -- a relaxed way. The voice is the same way: It must be "held" or used in a certain, relaxed way.

A singer's most important tool: the breath. A cliche in singer's circles, but true. Breath people, breathe.

Well, that's my two cents.

Bye bye and happy singing

[tmix]

It would be great to me if we had a singers forum. After being away from singing for 10 years or so I've had a real strong hankerin' to start back up but good singing instructors are hard to find around here. It would be great to see ya'lls tips for strengthening my vocal chords without blowing them out, plus regaining some range. (i presently have a three note range-not too impressive!)

[Chris Tondreau]

Originally posted by kelitupu
Here some quick ideas/tips about how to improve your high range.

1) Relax and open your mouth more as you get into your higher register. Learn to feel tension in your neck. As soon as you feel tension (anything that doesn't feel "relaxed"), stop singing, regroup, try to regain that relaxed feeling or position, than try again -- even if it's hours later or the next day. Better not to sing at all than to sing with tension.

2) Sing scales and sing them lightly -- at first. A good scale exercise is just to sing a five note major pentachord on ma (ma-ah-ah-ah-ah...), then go up by 1/2 step until you've reached your vocal break (your passagio) where you have to go into falsetto. If you can sing the scale in falsetto comfortably, keep going. If not, go back down by 1/2 steps, then start again. The main thing is to sing the scales lightly. May feel weird at first, but trust me, the volume will come later. Opera singers can belt because they've sung these scales for years and years and have strengthened their vocal cords. Also, they've learned how to mix their chest voice with their head voice (a whole other topic).

3) Start to think about singing as you would playing any other instrument; that is, the best performances come from a relaxed place where the performer is breathing properly (deeply, from the diaphgram, w/minimal or no shoulder heaving). Keyboard players, guitar players, basically all instrumentalists are taught to hold and play their instruments in a certain way -- a relaxed way. The voice is the same way: It must be "held" or used in a certain, relaxed way.

A singer's most important tool: the breath. A cliche in singer's circles, but true. Breath people, breathe.

Well, that's my two cents.

Bye bye and happy singing

Welcome to the board, kelitupu!!

Great post, too. Whenever people start talking about singing, all the witch-doctors and snake-oil remedies start to come out, as singing is a very "mysterious" process - you can't actually SEE it happen, but we all know it does. It is often, then, subject to some really funny ideas. Regardless of one's technique, all of your ideas of of considerable value to ANY singer.

...except don't know about the whole falsetto thing.... maybe.... But yes, opera singers have their strength partly in mixing their chest voice with their head voice. It's not so much about strengthening the vocal cords, though, as much as it is about strengthening the breathing associated with it.


Chris

I'll post some ideas of my own a bit later...

[MISTERQCUE]

Only the Lord knows how I wish I could sing!!!
Even to test out some lyrics on some jammies I'm producing!!
I can't even sing in tune. As a matter a fact I can't even TALK in tune!!



Wassup there Chris T.!!

[djc]

Originally posted by tmix
It would be great to me if we had a singers forum. After being away from singing for 10 years or so I've had a real strong hankerin' to start back up but good singing instructors are hard to find around here. It would be great to see ya'lls tips for strengthening my vocal chords without blowing them out, plus regaining some range. (i presently have a three note range-not too impressive!)

Yeah, we need a vocal forum. I've been singing since I was 7 years old in the church choir, and I still don't really do it correctly.
VOCAL FORUM VOCAL FORUM VOCAL FORUM

[scottboyher]

I second the vocal forum!

[bdbdbuck]

HEY SCOT...aren't you the one that ran sweetnubs off? Sure do miss him!

[bdbdbuck]

hey sorry guys...almost forgot why I was postin..10-4 on the vocal forum! God knows I need as much help as I can get.

[scottboyher]

Originally posted by bdbdbuck
HEY SCOT...aren't you the one that ran sweetnubs off? Sure do miss him!

OOOH I hope I didn't run Nubby off! I don't need that on my conscience...

[therage!]

Nice post kelitupu!!

The singers forum idea is great. Has anyone asked Dragon about it?

[Chris Tondreau]

Being a singer is a very physical thing. Given that, you are in a much different situation than virtually any other musician. No matter what else you play, you can still get out there and perform pretty much at the top of your game on two hours sleep, battling a flu, and hung over beyond belief.

Singers, on the other hand, cannot. Your health plays a role, as does how much sleep you have had. Both of these things contribute to your overall energy level, which is in my experience, one of the single most important things that will determine how well you sing on a given day.

Smoking and alcohol dry out the throat - avoid these if you want to sing your best.

Technique will ensure longevity in terms of being able to perform over the course of a night, or over the course of a lifetime. Whenever you feel tension in your throat, you're hurting yourself.

Chris

[VOXVENDOR]

Originally posted by Chris Tondreau
Being a singer is a very physical thing. Given that, you are in a much different situation than virtually any other musician.
Chris

Yeah tell my Hand that



Joe

[Bigus Dickus]

Originally posted by Chris Tondreau
No matter what else you play, you can still get out there and perform pretty much at the top of your game on two hours sleep, battling a flu, and hung over beyond belief.

Try convincing wind instrument players of that.

[Chris Tondreau]

Okay.... it's settled, then. It seems its officially "beat up on Chris day." Go ahead then, if you must. I can take it,....



Chris

[darrin_h2000]

Sometimes when im belting out a really loud vocal, I cant help worrying if Im using too much eyeliner and hairspray, like whats a singer to do?

[Chris Tondreau]

Like pretty much anything else in life.... if you think you are - then you probably are....



Chris

[Garry Sharp]

How do you know when there's a singer at the door?



You open it and she doesn't know when to come in.

[chessparov]

What "legit" singers call a "mix" is a blend of true head tones
(not falsetto) to sing high notes.
The opera singers like Placido Domino call it falsettone.
Under my old maestro's supervision, he had me singing up to
A natural above middle C, VERY high for a lyric baritone,
using this technique.
On my, however, it's work to sing above an F or F sharp.
That's the value of proper technique though, then you make
everything relatively automatic and can concentrate on delivering
the song.

Anyone else who's taken lessons?

Chris

[powderfinger]

What's the proper technique when singing for the nasal passage? I've heard different theories about how keeping the nasal passage closed vs. opend can effect tone and range.

[Chris Tondreau]

There are loads of different techniques that people use to sing. Using the Bel Canto technique (that involves "inhaling" the voice... sounds stupid at first, but it actually makes a lot of sense when it's explained), the nasal passages MUST be open. Since air is directed onto the hard palate from outside of the mouth, meeting up with a stream of air coming up from the lungs, the only place for air to escape is through the nasal passages.

Chris

[smellyfuzz]

Sorry guys.

I do not in any way support a singers forum.

Here is why;

1) Singing can not be taught, learned, tweaked, polished or any advancement at all from books, tapes, or web-sites.

2) Singers in training need to have some one correcting there every note in order to insure proper placement and to protect the vox.

3) There is more bad advice & bad methods then there are good ones. This comes from every one who can or can not carry a tune seems to feel that automatically they are qualified to give singing advice. Even in the past few post I see advice that I would say is COMPLETELY WRONG.

4) People who once sang in High School Choir and got some couching from there teacher are not trained singers.

5) People who have been singing all of their life are not trained singers nor are qualified to give singing advice.

6) Most musicians think singing lessons are a waste of time and money.

7) Most musicians do not know what singing lessons are for. (no it is not really to learn how to sing.)

8) Not every bad singer will benefit from lessons

9) Not every good singer is trained.

10) Finally, Trained singers, although I know few, would probably disagree on methods, technique, & style causing even more confusion for the novice.


Sean


http://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/...d=1691&alid=-1

[GordWait]

Even if I agreed with every point you make fuz, there is no harm at all in having a forum for singers where at least, points of veiw like yours could be represented.
Already I have come away with a useful bit of knowledge from the ongoing singing discussions (make sure I'm not at all dehydrated - best advice I've had in years - and I suppose obvious in hindsight).
I agree I'd be much better off if I could find a great vocal teacher and had the time for it, but I'm a hobbyist musician,
and enjoy the amount of singing I do.
A few tips from others on here can
be very helpful.
If I made the claim I wanted to be the next Opera star, then a forum would be a waste of my time yes...