Using my computer as a mixer/processor - difficult or easy PC?

[Phil Lawton]

Hello all

New to this forum and hoping for some good info.

OK, I have used pro-studios in my youth, but failed to get involved with the techniques of recordring. More recently (about 10 years ago) I used a friends Tascam Portastudio to record some things and want to get back into this.

My question is this - do I need to buy a drum machine/effects unit et al, or is there a way to use my PC (with the appropriate chunks of hardware/software) to produce drum sounds, route my instruments, process sounds and then record onto a standard 4-track home-studio?

Thanks in advance.

Phil

[powderfinger]

acid loops software is great for drum sounds and can double as a multitrack recorder

[stonepiano]

You could also Fruity Loops to produce drums sounds, add effects and route out to your analog 4 track. I just import wavs from fruity into a different software based multitrack recorder called Sonar but you could do it the proposed way with either Fruity or Acid.

miles

[powderfinger]

also, if you get something like sonic foundry's acid or cakewalk sonar, there is no need to route instruments back to the four track.........for example, go to my nowhere radio site and listen to 'alright with me'.......

http://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/...=1642&alid=154

this whole project was done in acid, the drum sequencing and recording.......i don't think you could do something like this in just fruity loops.....you'd have to export the drum track to the multi-track, etc........

[stonepiano]

good point. I stand corrected about the "route my instruments" part.

I'll shut up now.

[James Argo]

You can use PC for almost everything you need. It depends on what you assign your PC to do, and how much the bucks will you spend on it. Many of us don't even had any outboard gear... all's done with PC. Sure it can be. Of course you still need good set of Mic, preamps, etc, but routing FX, Drums sequencing, MIDI, looping, etc can be done with something like SONAR... right guys ?

[Phil Lawton]

SONAR? Alright, I'll give that a go, but can you all just be a little more precise? I was a bit vague in my original post, so I'll try to be a little clearer:

How do I attach a guitar/bass to the PC?

Will SONAR or any other software package allow me to add effects to these instruments, eg reverb/echo, chorus, etc?

What are the limitations of using a mike for recording either acoustic guitar and/or vocals?

Out of touch? Me ? Oh, yes.

[therage!]

Phil,

do you have a budget?

It doesn't sound like you have anything more than a consumer sound card in your PC. I would start there and at least get yourself an Echo Mia or MAudio 24/96 if that's within your budget. Then you will need a preamp. You could go with an Audio Buddy (not sure of the current price on them) all the way up to ultra expensive preamps like Avalons. Or you could get a mixer and you can get those fairly inexpensive. Then Sonar will run you a few hundred. So that's why I'm asking about what you can budget for then you can go from there.

Oh yeah, you can do effects for your instruments in Sonar. Sonar comes with quite a few plugins.

[James Argo]

Originally posted by Phil Lawton

1. How do I attach a guitar/bass to the PC?

2. Will SONAR or any other software package allow me to add effects to these instruments, eg reverb/echo, chorus, etc?

3. What are the limitations of using a mike for recording either acoustic guitar and/or vocals?

1. You can do that in so many way... for the simple, plug your guitar to your preamp, plug the preamp to LINE IN of your sound card, arm the track, set the recording level, hit the button... record. Ditto with the bass. OR, plug your guitar to amp, put a mic SM57 in front of your amp, plug the SM57 to preamp, plug the preamp to your LINE IN, arm the track, set the recording level, hit the button,... record... and a thousand more way depends on your gear, technic, room, budget, etc..etc...

2. Yess. You can do it by inserting audio plug ins in the bus. You can doit as you record it (input monitoring), or just record clean, and aply the effect later. BTW, there's a lot of effect available as a DirectX Plugins.

3. The limitations are very subjective. Depends on what mic do you use, placing, room acoustic, preamp issue, who plays the guitar, how the guitar being played, noises it will get, etc. But many proper miking technic giving better result than direct with guitars. The idea is about to capture the sound of the guitar, the way you want it to get.

[Phil Lawton]

Thanks, folks.

Looks like either a) I spend a lot of money I don't have or (more likely) b) I just buy a tape based 4-track.

This leads me onto another question for you all:

Using a tape based machine, how easy is it to use something like Fruityloops to generate drum patterns and then transfer those into a tape-based recorder?

Sorry for sounding thick, guys....as far as music recording technology goes, the 90s was something that happened to everyone else.

[stonepiano]

Originally posted by Phil Lawton
Using a tape based machine, how easy is it to use something like Fruityloops to generate drum patterns and then transfer those into a tape-based recorder?

easy? yes. You would need, hold on to your wallet, the software and a cable with the appropriate connections.

if you're using a entry level Soundcard with an 1/8" line out jack with a portastudio, you would need 1/8" phono on one end and a 1/8th to 1/4" TRS adapter. Using ebay, a 414 four track costs around $100 and you can get Fruity Loops for $99 from musiciansfriend.com.

The question then becomes what are your goals? This setup is certainly usable but lacks the nondestructive editing of a computer setup, which I believe leads to much more creative freedom. I personally have never had a porta but I can't imagine wanting to use one after using a computer based multitracker.

Miles

[Bri715]

I personally have never had a porta but I can't imagine wanting to use one after using a computer based multitracker.

Preach on. My Taskam 414 is only used for outside the house projects, and that's comming to an end as soon as I get the cash for a proper 8-12 track portable digital recording environment.

As for the home studio, I went with an Audiophile 2496 sound card (about 150 USD) and use the Tascam as a low rent mixing board. I just plug the mic into the preamp (my Amphex 107 set me back 100 USD), run the cord into the Tascam and then into the PC via RCA jacks. I then launch Acid and record directly into Acid. Any idividual effects that are needed for the tracks get added by editing the track in Sound Forge. Oh, and the drum tracks are all done on the PC via Acid, Fruity Loops or Rebirth. Fruity Loops is the best of the lot and will set you back about 50 USD. All in all you can put together a reasonably nice home recording setup for under 400 dollars (not including the PC) if you already have a Portastudio. If you don't, add the cost of a cheap mixing board into the equation. It won't sound like Mutt Lange recorded you, but it's a nice way to get back into things.

[Phil Lawton]

Bri715

Thank you for that - I feel somewhat more encouraged now. The "Mutt Lange" quality (thanks for the laugh) isn't important to me. I'm looking to get a whole load of material just recorded, nothing fancy, rather than have it floating around in my head, on bits of paper or on old two track cassettes.

The eventual aim is to transfer these to compact disc by using a CD recorder (sorry to be so lo-tech in here) and then I'll be happy.

Thanks again.

[duck]

I would scratch the Porta altogether. I have one collecting dust. A tape based recorder is high maintenance. You constantly have to keep those heads clean as well as the rollers.
Sonar is good but quite expensive. If it were me I would get an Audiophile 2496 and Powertracks Pro if I was just starting out. $200. It still beats the pants off a Porta studio in my opinion. The speed of your computer and the amount of ram is the main thing.

[James Argo]

BTW, Phill, what's your PC config ?

[housepig]

Phil -

here's some links for some stuff you might be able to use:

www.audiomelody.com --> free audio software, sorted by category
www.sonicspot.com --> free and shareware audio software
www.databaseaudio.co.uk --> more freeware
www.thepluginlist.com ---> plug in effects and instruments, you can sort to see only freeware ones.

even if you don't want to use the pc as a multitrack, you can find some good software for when you want to edit / effect / put stuff in order for burning to disc.

good luck. hope this helps. have fun.

- housepig

[Phil Lawton]

"BTW, Phill, what's your PC config ?"

Windows 98SE, 13gb hard drive and 128 mb of memory.

What's an Audiophile 2496?

Housepig - thanks for the links - I'll check them out when I can prise the kids away from the computer for more than 15 minutes.

Duck - Portastudios hold no fear for me, even with the aforementioned maintenance. The end prodcut of what I want to do won't be held under the nose of some record exec and time isn't really a factor.

How much do you want for your dust-covered model?

[James Argo]

Originally posted by Phil Lawton
Windows 98SE, 13gb hard drive and 128 mb of memory.

What's an Audiophile 2496?

...and your machine spec ? Proc, MB, sound card ?

Audiophile 2496 is one of those great soundcard. 2496 stand for 24 bit and 96Khz.

[duck]

How much do you want for your dust-covered model?

You can have it for the shipping cost.
The stereo headphone is only mono. One side is bad. Still records stereo but you would have to listen to it on something else. The heads and rollers I dont know about after sitting so long. The shipping cost may not be worth it to the U.K. from U.S. in the shape its in.

[Phil Lawton]

Duck

I've mailed you.

Regards

Phil