Is this ready for mastering?

[imacgreg]

Ok,
Here's another tune by a local band I've been recording. Finally finished all the tracks and time to mix. I think that the band might take the mixed tracks to a mastering studio and to tell the truth, I wanna make sure my mixes aren't going to be laughed at by the proffessional ME. Any major mistakes I'm making here that I don't know of?? Oh yeah, any and all advice/feedback on the production, sound, etc. are always welcome.

Ian

Here's the link:

http://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/...d=1787&alid=-1

Thanks!

[M.Brane]

The drum sound is good but a little too "up front" IMHO. Mostly the kick seems too hot. Perhaps push it back a little with some compression and scoop out some lo-mid on it. The guitars seem a little small in the chorus. Since they are panned hard, try a little delay or verb on 'em bussed to the opposite side.

Just being nit-picky. I really don't hear anything that a good ME couldn't fix.

[sjoko2]

Drum volume is to high, guitars to thinny and low
I'd put a small amount of verb on the lead to give it some ooomph and make it come a bit more up front.

[joro]

All of the levels except for the drums seemed low but, hey....they are gonna go master it so......it's cool.....vox is cool except for the screams.......it hurts the song....ya know?

Take it easy,
Joe

[imacgreg]

Originally posted by joro
All of the levels except for the drums seemed low but, hey....they are gonna go master it so......it's cool.....vox is cool except for the screams.......it hurts the song....ya know?

Take it easy,
Joe

Yeah,
I'm not a huge fan of screams myself, but the band is really into them...

sjoko,
What type of verb would you suggest on the lead vocals? I have a small amount of plate (I think), but do you have any suggestions where to start?

M.Brane,
I do have 'verb on the guitars, but it is panned to the same side!! I'll try swapping it over.

Thanks for the feedback,
Ian

[boydrj]

The singer kind of reminds me of that guy from The Counting Crows ...

Okay, mix wise I would probably agree with the comments already posted -- those drums -- imhop --I too didn't care for the screams, but I guess that is an artistic choice.

Nice song. Good luck with getting this mastered. Once it is completely ready, it should sound pretty good.

[Beezoboy]

I agree the guitars are mixed a little low. Also, I would add a bit more reverb to to his voice. I'd also like to hear a harmony either by his voice or guitar with the lead vocals on the chorus. It could really fatten up the sound.

Really nice job on the recording though. Epecially the guitars, great tone. Nice job with the panning on this song too. It is very effective.

In conclusion: Turn up the guitar a bit...and maybe the bass too. After a few minor tweaks this is going to be one hell of a mix.

Great job though
Beezoboy

[TripleM]

I thought it was a pretty good recording. Not sure about the material thought. Screams are fine with me, I acutally like them. But when they're overused they're bothersome IMHO. I think they're overused here. But you really werent after musical opinions. Sorry.

Sounded like a slight pitch issue with the lead vocal at about 2:36.

I think the points the others have made, like the drums, are good ones. Balance the drums with the other tracks, and I think this is pretty good.

It'd be nice to get a pro's answer to your question. participant, mixmkr, Blue Bear (he's brutal though ) come to mind.

[participant]

It'd be nice to get a pro's answer to your question. participant

Me?? A pro?? (participant's face turns scarlet ) Uh.... a professional amateur, maybe Bruce and mixmkr were doing this professionally long before I ever bought a cassette 4-track...


Since I'm here: Heard this song... didn't make a comment last night; brutal opinion? The arrangement is really bare bones... very tiny (not to be confused with "tinny") guitars, bass is too trebly, and the screams sound like a young man's grizzly impersonation (they need to be redone, to more blood-curdling effect... they're almost... humorous here... like something out of a kid's book-on-video).

If the guys expect to get a commercial quality song here, IMHOP they need some more stuff in there... more guits, thicker bass, more vocals, more instruments, more, more more!

Mastering IMHOP could make this a good demo... but without much low bass energy, and some fake-sounding screams. The guy needs to scream like he's pissed, damn it


Chad

[JR#97]

kick ass drums... but like everyone else said, they're too up front. How did you mic them? maybe a little more stereo spread on the drums... particularly the tom fills.

I didn't mind the thin guitars.. but something needed to add some thickness.

The bass lines were cool. But there seemed to be a bit of muddiness going on... no real low end.. I would have liked to hear a little more definition out of the bass to make up for the thin guitars.

The vocals were very energetic. I liked the side-fill screams. What kind of mic? It felt like you were about 2 feet away from it..
Mix wise, I wanted to have the vocals screaming in my face instead of hiding behind the drum kit. What kind of reverb settings? Maybe set the reverb to be right in my face (pre-delay).

[imacgreg]

Wow,
Some great feedback here, I'm stoked. I'll start from the top:

boydrj,
Yeah, someone else has said that he sounds like the guy from Counting Crows. I'm not really into his screams, but his singing voice is pretty decent.

Beezoboy,
I'm going to try and thicken up the guitars and voice with some better verb. The guitars were PRS and Les Pauls through Mesa Boogies and Marshalls (I prefer the Marshall) Thanks for the comments.

TripleM,
I also noticed some pitch problems, but I wanna ask the band before I go crazy with autotune. Thanks for checkin' the tune out.

participant,
Very interesting comments. I also agree about the fake sounding screams, kinda weak, I guess. It's hard for me to judge screams (make it more "bloodcurdling??) I agree about the bare bones, kinda goin' for the live band thing here, I do think it would help to have the guitars pumped up a little. Definately gonna pump up the bass as well. Thanks.

JR#97,
The drums were miced like this:
Kick-D112 inside
Snare-sm57
OH's-Marshall 603's
Rack toms- Senn E604
Floor Tom- Senn 421

All mics going through Millennia Media HV-3 mic pres except for the Kick which was through a homebrew Neve 1272.
I too think that my bass is a little muddy, I'm going to spend some more time on that. The vocals/screams were through a Marshall 2001 modded with the Scott Dorsey mods. Thanks for the comments.

Ok, tonight, I'm gonna try and remix a bit with all your suggestions and repost. Any thoughts from mixmkr or Blue Bear?? (you can be brutal, I need to learn...)

Thanks all,
Ian

[B.SABBATH]

I don't think this is ready to be mastered, but I also don't think anyone will laugh at the engineer..


IMHOP, there is a bit too much air.. What I mean by that is, maybe it's because the drums are a bit too loud or something, but there needs to be 'more sound.' Maybe if you bring the bass and guitars up a bit, that might help, but it just sounds like something is missing to me.. The guitars are doing a lot of high rhythm stuff, and there is 'no ass' to support it..

Then again, I know nothing..


I liked the screams..

[imacgreg]

Would some of you guys mind naming what monitor(s) you've been using? I would kinda like to see what systems this has been played on in relation to your feedback. Thanks,
Ian

For the record I'm using paradigm mini monitors to mix.

[powderfinger]

not to many poeple said this, but i think the vocals might be a little low............they sound fine, but could have a little more presence and volume...........try bringing out some of the crispness in the guitars too..............i really like the song........the talking verse is kinda cool

[M.Brane]

Originally posted by imacgreg
Would some of you guys mind naming what monitor(s) you've been using? I would kinda like to see what systems this has been played on in relation to your feedback. Thanks,
Ian

For the record I'm using paradigm mini monitors to mix.

Don't laugh too hard:

Near: JBL HLS810's powered by Harman/Kardon A-401.

Room: Altec Concepts " " Carver PM-1.5

[imacgreg]

Ok, so I took a couple days and remixed the tune. I've done quite a few different things, monstly little changes, but I'll try to remember the major changes I made.

Used a bass enhancer on the kick (but toned the kick down overall). Gives a little more thump, but less conflict with the gass guitar (hopefully).

Gated the snare mic. Wow. I didn't know so much of my cymbals were coming through the snare '57. That might help with the stereo imaging of the kit as well as the kit overpowering everything else.

Beefed up the guitars and bass. What can I say, I cranked em a little and panned the gtr reverb returns to the opposite side that the guitar is on.

Messed with EQ on the bass guitar, I'm really bad at fixing low-mids. Someone help me!!

Brought the vocals out a bit.

Any new ideas? Did I do more hurt than help?? Both versions are located here:

http://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/...d=1787&alid=-1

Thanks a ton!!
Ian

[Gregwor]

I think the first version had a 'better' sounding kick. It is alittle too quiet now. I think somewhere in between is where it should be...volume wise. I think this recording could appreciate some 'round-sounding ticky' kicker, if that makes sense. It needs to thump and be in your face. The rest of the drums sound beautiful. The guitars sound wicked now. In the chorus, where they sound like they are really going to kick in....they don't....and they should. If you have the available tracks, see if the guys will be willing to double track those parts, and have the guitars 'step in'....kinda like a solo would.

The screams at the end of the song are good. They have the quality as if he is going to cry...and that's what the songs going for. Have you ever heard a band called Thursday? They have the same idea behind their screams. I really dig this band. They sound like a band called By A Thread. Actually, By A Thread is playing here in Edmonton tonight!

This recording sounds wicked. One other thing I don't like is your bass tone. If you can follow this, I think it needs to be boosted in between mid, and low mid. I think basses with that tone rule for this style of music. It should sound bright, almost like a guitar, yet hold the 120Hz punch. Other than that, this is kicking ass. What is the band called, and do they have a web site or anything? Where are they from. Let me know if your going to try my ideas or keep it as is. Good work.

[M.Brane]

Originally posted by imacgreg
Used a bass enhancer on the kick (but toned the kick down overall). Gives a little more thump, but less conflict with the gass guitar (hopefully).

I think you went a tad overboard here. the kick is too weak now.

Gated the snare mic. Wow. I didn't know so much of my cymbals were coming through the snare '57. That might help with the stereo imaging of the kit as well as the kit overpowering everything else.

I liked the snare better without the gate. I noticed the drummer is not very consistant with his snare hits. Maybe a little comp is needed for that.

Beefed up the guitars and bass. What can I say, I cranked em a little and panned the gtr reverb returns to the opposite side that the guitar is on.

Sounds better except the delay on the R is a bit distracting on the intro. Maybe tone it down a bit there.

Messed with EQ on the bass guitar, I'm really bad at fixing low-mids. Someone help me!!

The kick/bass relationship is one of the most important yet trickiest parts of mixing. I find it helps to rough mix with no EQ then make subtle fixes. Avoid soloing the bass. Listen to it in the context of the mix and cut offending freqs rather than boosting good ones. One trick is to use a parametric with a high boost. Sweep your freq until you find the bad stuff then switch to a cut at that spot. Listen on more than 1 set of monitors and 'phones ( I know some frown on that last one).

Brought the vocals out a bit.

I won't comment on this because the singer reminds me of The Cure and I really don't like them guys.

[imacgreg]

Ok,
Yeah, after listening to the second mix I was like, "what the hell was I thinking??"

Gregwor,
I asm going to spend like forever to get the kick and bass working better, I really need how to mix the lows. I might have some double tracked guitars, I'll see if I can add a little in here and there. Yeah, I have a Thursday CD, and the singer to this band is always wearing Thursday shirts.
I'm not a big fan of most emo, but i can appreciate what they are doing. The band is called Five Minute Ride and they are from the Sacramento, California area. They have a website, but I don't think there is much on it and I wouldn't know the address. They play local shows and stuff.

M.Brane,
Definately went overboard. I do have a Waves RCL on the snare, but only compressing a couple dB. More maybe?? Interesting about the gate, I wasn't as impressed with how the snare sound changed as the overheads. The hi-hat kinda went back to where it shoulda been. I'll rethink that one, tho. Yeah, that delay kinda gets me too, I'm gonna shorten up the time a little or take it off completely.

Thanks for the re-listen guys,
Ian

[TexRoadkill]

I listened to the remix. I would try more compression on the drums overall. The dynamics are a little loose and it would help to give them and the overall groove more punch. Good vocal sound but I would add a little more ambience, especially on the yells. Sounds like it's coming together pretty well.