CD Volume too quiet!!!

[Gregwor]

So I put a stereo track into CEP directly from my recorder. I originally maxed out the level to 0dB or whatever.

I burned a CD without touching the wave and it is really quiet compared to 'pro' CD's. So I tried amplifying them, but it caused distortion on heavy dual/triple vocal parts.

I tried using the button that finds it 100% mark, which usually amplified by around 105%. However, this is still super quiet.

Is there anyway to boost my levels up to around 6dB without adding distortion/clipping?

This seems to be my only concern with CEP.








bye the way.....I found that I needed to save the waves as "Windows PCM" files, or else white noise was added......wierd.

[Separated]

Hey!

I assume you are using the "Normalize" function to get your audio's max levels at 0db. What version of Cool Edit are you using? In CEP 2.0 you can use the "Hard Limit" function under "Effects>Amplitude" to boost your audio without clipping. It's pretty cool. You basically set a level (ie 0db) for your audio to be limited to....then you set the amount of boost in DB's that you want to use. You have to be carefull, if you use too much boost then you can hear the limiting. But it works very well! Hope that helps.

-Chris-

[Gregwor]

I am using the plain old CEP. I have used the normalizing feature and it does nothing in helping me achieve greater volume.

I know that it is something in the program itself, because it isn't maxing out my EQ meter thingy on my stereo like other high-class records.

I figure I should be able to change a setting somewhere that will remove or raise the threshold line because it seems that when I amplify like 200% or so, and I click the zoom out button to show greater smpl meter, all the waves passed the threshold line (0dB) are gone.....even though they should be through the roof!

Any wave passed this threshold line, sounds 'clipped' or 'distorted'....even though they technically shouldn't be. Please help out if possible.....any thoughts?

[laptoppop]

Normalize changes the amplitude of the signal such that the peaks of the signal are maximized. Along the way to doing this, it will raise the rest of the signal as well...if it can. It treats all of the signal the same, and thats why there's a clipping problem.

The basic problem is that there is too much variation between the peaks and the rest of the music. You want to raise the overall volume that you experience. If you just amplify the signal, the peaks go too far and you get clipping.

What you need to do (and what is done on commercial records to make them SOUND louder) is to "compress" the music. Note: there are several different types of compression - audio compression like I'm about to talk about, format compression (like MP3) where you change the music to save disk space, data compression (like ZIP files), etc.

In audio compression, the music is amplified so that the peaks are not changed, but the quieter parts of the signal are made louder. This gives the overall impression of a "louder" sound without clipping.

In CEP 2, there are several compression options - I would expect there to be some similar ones in CEP. They may be grouped together under "dynamics".

-or-

Some programs for mastering can automate much of this work for you. Commercial mastering labs go to a lot of effort to get the volume up to where it competes with the other songs out there. One of their tools, for example is special audio compression where the different frequency bands are compressed independently.

If your version of CEP accepts directx plugins, you can check out the demo of the mastering plugin Ozone from Izotope.com. In any case, theres a great PDF file on the Izotope site about mastering that will help you understand this volume issue clearly.

Good luck!
-lee-

[dobro]

"I figure I should be able to change a setting somewhere that will remove or raise the threshold line because it seems that when I amplify like 200% or so, and I click the zoom out button to show greater smpl meter, all the waves passed the threshold line (0dB) are gone.....even though they should be through the roof!"

Nah, don't believe what you see on the screen. Believe what your ears tell you. That stuff on the screen is just approximate (except maybe for the clip indicator which I believe all the time!).

So, how to get louder mixes: compress, normalize, like people have said already. And if that doesn't work, you're stuck. It means you should be tracking stuff hotter in the first place.

[Gregwor]

Do you have any compression settings for me to try out?

I figure I don't want to compress too much, but rather expand quiet abit right???

Does anyone have the original CEP anymore that can recommend which compression to use? Thanks. Greg.

[dobro]

How much you compress each track depends on the nature of the tracks - there are no standard settings.

[Gregwor]

As I described in the first post....I don't have each instrument on their own tracks. I originally put the songs on the computer out of my recorder (Yamaha MD8) as a stereo track.

Should I still compress it?

I am so tempted to just tell the band to take the CD to get it mastered.....but then will make me look like a fool.


If you can recomend some compression for an 'overall' song that would be great. Thanks.

[Separated]

Hey!
There really is no reason your CD can't be as loud as any other CD out there. Have you double checked your mixing levels to see if they are right? Are you using any compression to control the dynamics at the mixing stage? I'd be interested in seeing what your waveform looks like in CEP...do you have an mp3? Another good thing to do is to load a "professionally" recorded song into CEP and then compare thier waveform to yours. I had problems when I first started with "quiet cd's". That's when I found the Hard Limiter. Izotope Ozone has a "Loudness Maximizer" which is basically the same thing as CEP's Hard Limiter (some would probably argue with me here). Like someone said, you can look into plug-ins.....you can even use VST plug-ins using spin-audio's free dx to vst "wrapper". Check out free plug-ins here-------> http://www.xelenio.com/plug-in/ . Also, if you haven't already done so, i would definitely recommend cep's own forum at http://www.syntrillium.com. There's TONS of info here! Good luck!

-Chris-

[dobro]

"I am so tempted to just tell the band to take the CD to get it mastered.....but then will make me look like a fool."

Well, considering how little you know about mastering, it seems to me that if you take it on yourself you're gonna wind up looking like a fool anyway. Trust me on this one: if you're asking the sort of questions you're asking about compressing an entire mix, then you're in no position to do a good job of it, probably.

Anyway, if you opt to get somebody else to master it, consider this also: not everybody who advertises mastering services is actually able to master. Get second and third opinions about any outfit you're considering giving real money to for the sake of getting your tracks sounding as good as they can be.