Floor model preamp?????

[Smokepole]

Well I've tested 5 pre's at home now and am checking the DMP3 out this week. I made a virtual track of each one to try to be able to compare better.

My question is this;

My local offered to sell me a floor model DBX 2 channel tube pre.
at $100 off. It's normally $499. It's the model that's preamps only, very few knobs, (sorry I forgot the model#).

I'm a little skeptical. It would most likely be a big overall improvement over the ones in the price range I'm looking at now, DMP3, BlueTube etc.

My big concern is that it sits there, on, all day everyday. Then again its actual use time with a mic actually plugged into it is minimal. I realize I can replace the tubes and probably would do that right off the bat. But I don't know mch about how that stuff really ticks. Can you guys give me some feedback on your thoughts?

Thanks once again
Joe

[Wide Awake]

That's probably the dbx 386 because the 586 has many knobs and is two-rack spaces. The 386 is a single-rack space.

It would not be a big improvement over the DMP3 or BlueTube, but it does have a good feature set. Some preamps sound good with certain mikes and a lot depends on what mikes you are running through it. If you are getting the dbx 386 for $400 that's not much of a DEAL, but it might be just the preamp that could make you happy. None of us can answer that for you.

I think your concern over having tubes in a product and the hassles and problems that arise are well founded. Even though I like the sound of many cheap tube preamps, a solid state one eliminates the problems of heat and of finding replacement tubes that sound the way you want. That's why for my main one I bought a PreSonus MP20. I would not keep any of my tube pre's or compressors on all day.....that would be foolish.

How much can you spend ? Do you want one channel or two ? Do you need inserts to interface a compressor ? Does a wall wart matter to you ? What applications will it primarily be used for ?

[Smokepole]

Hi Wide Awake thanks for taking the time.

Knowing that it wouldn't be a drastic improvement is pretty big in itself. The price difference is quite substantial. $129 for the BlueTube and $399 for the dbx.

I'll try to answer your ?’s as best I can.

I could spend as much as maybe $500 if I was going to be truly satisfied with the product. That is a substantial amount for me because I'm disabled and the dough isn't exactly flowing in if you get my drift

One channel or two? I could live with one. My best mic right now is the Shure KSM27. I also have a 57 and a 58. The reason I tried for two channels is that I figured with the investment of another KSM27 I could do a little stereo micing but that's not really a necessary requirement.

I'm a little lost with the insert aspect for the compressor. I have only owned one for about a week and am just coming out of the pre with a mic cable into the compressor

Wall wart will not bother me. I have one right now on this BlueTube. I did invest in some power conditioning but the wall wart still fits in the rack and everything. Looks mean nothing to me.

Application. I'm just recording as a hobby, although I will try to market some songs. I’m recording into a VS840EX almost exclusively one track at a time. Rock, country, light jazz and blues.

That Symetrix, I think it was the 528e or something sounds pretty favored by a lot of guys I just can't find one locally to try out and am a little scared whether my needs really warrant a $420-$500 pre or not.

I plan on getting the DMP3 tomorrow or monday for a test drive. I haven't actually tried it yet.

[drstawl]

Wouldn't worry too much about the floor model status as long as it hadn't been out on the floor for months. I bought a floor model and got a $100 discount. Still cranking away.

Do you need the 386's digital outs?

[Wide Awake]

The inserts are a good feature , but certainly not a neccessity. I've never used digital outs on a preamp so I can't comment.

I don't think you have to spend $400 and up to get great sound. I bought one of the first BlueTubes made and it sounded excellent and I have a $300 ART Tube Channel that is quite good. With a good mic any of the budget preamps on the market is capable of great results....I've owned enough of them to believe I can make that statement.

You have three great mikes, KSM27, SM57 and 58. If they sound good with the BlueTube or DMP3 I would keep one of those only because I doubt you would see ENOUGH improvement to spend twice as much on the dbx.

I wasn't much help, but my bottom line....any of these preamps are capable. Good luck.

[Smokepole]

drstawl, I know that that pre has been sitting there for quite a while. I don't really need the digital outs, that's one of the reasons I got away from the Digitube, I can't really utilize that feature.

Wide Awake, you have also been very helpful. I still have to give that DMP3 a try. I'm fairly satisfied with the B.T. so I'll probably end up with the DMP3 or the bluetube and stay in that price range. Your last post left me a little more comfortable with that.

Both those budget pre's are dual channel so maybe I'll take some of the money I save and put it toward another mic for stereo. But that's a whole other thread.

Thanks guys

[Middleman]

You will love the DMP3.

[chessrock]

For $200 the dmp3 is the best value in budget preamps. The dbx will not sound better, although it will give you some cool options. For one, it has good analog-to-digital conversion. Another cool feature about it's conversion is the fact that you can't digitally clip with it - so it's like having a built-in limiter if you use the digital outs.

Also, it has tewbs, so it can deliver a cool gritty effect if you drive it a little.

But if I were shopping around in the $400 range it would be a no-brainer for me. Just save up the extra $100. I don't care what you have to do to get it, but just do it. Now, spend the $500 bucks or so on the new Summit Audio preamp. I've got a feeling about this one. And I've heard some early reports on it that were pretty much raving.

Something like that would be in a whole nother class.

[Richard Monroe]

I use DBX386 for most om my instrument mic'ing, and Joemeek twinQ for vocals. The DBX rocks with transparent mics like Octava MC012 and Studio Projects C3. I like the Joemeek with large diaphragm mics with a little more color- AKG Solid Tube, Rode NTK, Octava MK319. I use the DBX when I want something to sound the way it sounded, and Joemeek when I want to add something to the way it sounded. Frankly, the "tewb" drive on the DBX is not bad. If it's the only pre you get, it's really not a bad choice, but I think what people here are saying is you could get the same options and perfectly good sound for less money, unless you really need digital out (I do).-Richie

[TexRoadkill]

Unless there is a really specific application that demands it I don't really see the point of under <$500 pres. For that price you can get a mackie or soundcraft M with arguably the same quality pres and a lot more.

[knownuttin]

386? Don't bother. 586? Maybe.

The DMP3 will not disappoint for the $.
-kent

[keilson]

I'm currently using a behringer board. Would my untrained ears be able to tell the difference between the berhinger preamps and the DMP3? Thanks.

[Middleman]

TexRoadkill,

I would argue that the DMP3 sounds better than the Soundcraft pres. I am selling my small Soundcraft as it does not provide the warmth and frequency equality across the spectrum that the DMP3 provides on vocals and guitar. I also do not need a mixer as I only record one track at a time. The two channels on the unit both XLR and 1/4 inch are all I need.

keilson,

The DMP3 is substantially better than the Behringer boards. I have both and its the difference between pro sounding results and amatuer sounding results. There is less EQing to be done after the fact with the DMP3. The unit goes from very clean to minor warmth.

I sound like the king of low end stuff but hey, I beleive in maximizing the results and minimizing the expenditures.

Smokepole,

If you are a songwriter and not interested in live drum or band recordings the DMP3 with an RNC compressor is the best alternative under $500. This is for natural sounding vocals, ballads, country or pop. If you want the Lenney Kravitz, American Woman sound (or close to it), blues or rock then Joe Meek is an alternative pre.

If you are an engineer and need more versatile solutions I would vote a Mackie board and the RNC for compression. Killer combo.

I have searched far and wide in the under $500 catergory for the best signal chain. I have bought and returned lots of stuff and this is what I have determined. There are new pres coming to market shortly however, and all of this could change in the the next few months. There are many low cost pres said to emulate high end gear coming.

[TexRoadkill]

middleman- Which soundcraft board do you have?

[chessrock]

Originally posted by keilson
Would my untrained ears be able to tell the difference between the berhinger preamps and the DMP3? Thanks.

Probably not right away. It'll be pretty subtle untill you start layering a lot of tracks.

[keilson]

Middleman, can I run the DMP3 through the line inputs on the board, bypassing the preamps?

[chessrock]

Not middleman, but yup. You can.

[Middleman]

TexRoadkill

I am selling the Powerpad which is the low end but their site says the following:

"Powerpad achieves DAT-quality sound by utilising componentry common to larger Soundcraft desks, including high quality mic preamps that take up to 16dBu of input level. An impressive EIN figure and high RF rejection to EC standards ensures clean, noise-free mixes."

keilson

You have 3 choices:

1. DMP3 direct to sound card - My favorite for cleanliness.
2. DMP3 to channel in 1/4 inch if you need to mix its volume with other instruments.
3. DMP3 to line/accessory in 1/4 inch - you could do this but why? Adds more noisy electronic pathways to the mix. Unless, you are going to treat it as outboard gear not sure what the results would be though.

[Smokepole]

You're right, You're right and You're right. Now I'm going to repeat it like I was told.

DMP3. DEEEE-EMMMMM-PEEEE-THREEE

I wanted to compare them for myself, all part of the learning process, so I did. In the five cheap pre's I tested myself it really was the cleanest most transparent.

My local told me if I bought it I would not be able to return it because there was software in the package. I just had to try one anyway on all you guy’s recommendations so I bought one anyway figuring if I didn't like it I would sell it on E-Bay or something. It ain't going anywhere; they'll have to pry it from my cold dead fingers.

(And there ain't no software either)

I also learned that the BlueTube and the DigiTube have two completely different sounds. I originally thought the DigiTube was a BlueTube with an EQ and digital outs. The two I had sounded completely different.

Thanks, I'd have never even tried that model without you guys sharing your experience.

Joe

[Middleman]

Smokepole

Glad you agree. It really does have a great sound and polishes up the old vocal tracks.

[TexRoadkill]

Originally posted by Middleman
TexRoadkill

I am selling the Powerpad which is the low end but their site says the following:

Just for the record you can't compare that to the M series. It's entirely different. The M series has the same pres as their $7000 Ghost board.

I'm not dogging the DMP3 but I did want to clear that up.

[keilson]

I am using a Behringer board into a Motu 24i. I am micing a Marshall DSL401 Tube amp with an SM57. I keep getting a very harsh guitar sound. Kevin Becka of Homerecording at About.com and he said "The M-audio (DMP3) should be better (than the Behringer preamps), I think that's where you're getting your problem when recording. The harsh sound is happening AFTER the amp. You'll need to upgrade your signal chain to get better results. Do what you can and improve as your budget allows." What do you guys think? Will this fix my problem? I don't wanna end up spending a few hundred on a preamp unless it will actually fix this problem.

Thanks.

[keilson]

it'd be great if someone could post some clips comparing the preamps in boards and stand alone preamps.

[Lame Thrower]

I have a Behringer board (MXB1002), and I just got a DMP3. As soon as I have a little free time, I will post some comparison clips. Can anyone tell me how to put 'em up somewhere for free?

I've only had a chance to try it out for a few minutes, but it seems quite a bit cleaner to me. I don't know if it will solve your particular problem keilson. It's hard to judge without hearing the sound you're getting now, but it sounds like every other piece in the signal chain is up to snuff, so it's probably either the Behringer or a technique issue.

[Wide Awake]

Originally posted by keilson
it'd be great if someone could post some clips comparing the preamps in boards and stand alone preamps.

Comparisons using MP3's is rather useless in my opinion because the sound quality is too compromised. The only way to evaluate is to use it in your own studio for weeks or months. The real test comes when you start mixing the recorded tracks and that's where a quality preamp will show it's worth.