Do I Need A Seperate Mic Pre-Amp If....

[samich17]

i have a Fostex XR-5, which has a mic-pre amp built in? if it is recommended that i get a seperate mic pre-amp, what would you suggest in the 2-300$ range..

thanks a lot

[Stealthtech]

Dont quite get it.........if you have a built in preamp why would you need another ? Unless your getting another mic

[samich17]

well, i was hoping that someone familiar with the Fostex XR-5 could give me their opinion as to whetehr or not it'd be a good idea to get a pre-amp specifically for microphones or if the Fostex was suitable..it works for me, does what i want, but i am always up for upgrading possibilities..

[Stealthtech]

I see, well my philosophy is if it aint broke dont fix it
Unless you feel its not living up to your expectations

[samich17]

it isn't broken, but i am still "green" and need advice from experienced engineers..i used to think my 40$ carlos acoustic 6 string was the greatest sounding guitar until i started recording with a Martin...see what i mean?

[Stealthtech]

Yes I do know what you mean. Im definately not a mic guy.
I bought a shure ksm27 recently and Im still not sure if this is a descent studio mic. yet....sounds and records well though.

You need the Gidge man to comment on this one. He seems to know quite a bit about everthing.

[Nutdotnet]

Originally posted by Stealthtech
Yes I do know what you mean. Im definately not a mic guy.
I bought a shure ksm27 recently and Im still not sure if this is a descent studio mic. yet....sounds and records well though.

You need the Gidge man to comment on this one. He seems to know quite a bit about everthing.

Gidge is THA MAN!

[TexRoadkill]

Samich- I dont have a lot of experience with dedicated pre's but a mackie 1202 or 1604 would be a great mixer to use with your 4track.

You would get a lot more flexibility and clean pre's for the same price, used anyway. 10 years ago I was doing home recording on keyboards with a 1202 and a good casette deck and it was pretty clean.

[samich17]

thanks tex...i guess my question for you would be: if you were in my shoes (had a 4 track with a bult in pre-amp) would you bother getting a seperate pre-amp for microphone? would there be really any benefit considering the 4 track has moderate equalization abilities? thanks a lot for responding

[TexRoadkill]

If you want me to be completely honest the mixer quality on most 4 tracks is pretty crappy. BUT I have never used your model.

I've heard your stuff and the recordings suffer from the common ailment of home recording murkiness. My first setup (1988) was a casette 4track and an EV ND257 mic (like a SM58). I did some electric guitars at home and thought it sounded okay.

I got the chance to hook it up to a decent 24ch fostex mixer at a church to record drums and vocals and was amazed at the difference in sound quality. After the 4 track broke I got an expensive sony casette deck and the mackie 1202.

I had to play live guitar with midi sequences and the recordings were still 10x cleaner sounding. The casette "masters" were used for 16mm film soundtracks for film festivals and nobody suspected how crappy my setup was. Although being mastered to the soundtrack on a 16mm film print is worse than casette.

I worked on the film Mars Attacks and the sound engineer used a mackie and a dat for all of the location audio. And he could use whatever he wanted. A mackie is a guaranteed clean strong signal path at a cheap price.

[crosstudio]

i've heard the ART TUBE MP (around $100) used to record some Roland V-drums and it was pretty good.

You can get the ART Dual MP for around $250 or so. I not saying that I swear by them, but it was pretty good.

now it's not an avalon or whatever, but it will be an improvement over the pre-amp in your 4-track. unless 4-tracks have made serious improvements since my porta-one days in the 80's.

[Gidge]

are you still using the XR-5 to record?....if so, what sources do you record (vocals, drums,etd.) so how many preamps do you need?....what mics are you using?........

[samich17]

Gidge - i don't use the XR-5 to record anything..i just line in with it ie. guitar, bass and vocals (Audix OM6, designated for vocals) and go from the XR-5 into my sound card (Sound Blaster Live!) i should have my Echo Mia in today, so i think that should make a nice difference. i record with Cool Edit Pro. i don't know if i need a seperate pre-amp...i was just curious if a seperate pre-amp would make the vocals sound better, but if the pre-amp in the XR-5 is suitable then i won't bother.

[TexRoadkill]

I understand now. I thought you were still recording with the 4track. Definately get a mackie then. You will be better be off with that then any cheazy TubeMP type pre. Especially if you need to use the same pre for guitars, vocals and keys.

[crosstudio]

i have the mackie 1604vlz pro, and i'm pretty darn happy with it.

in addition to the pre on the mackie that i use to record vocals, sound canvas, and drum machine tracks, i use a sansamp classic, and a sansamp bass DI.

but since you said $2-300 price range, i didn't mention it.

[samich17]

crosstudio - thanks for the suggestion...i took a look at the mackie 1604vlz pro, looks nice, but no way can i afford $1,000 and besides, i don't need such a big console..16 inputs is completely unnecessary for me...i use 1 maybe 2 at a time...can you suggest something else in the Mackie family that'd be more suitable? something in the 3-400$ range.. thanks again for responding

[Gidge]

unless you will be doing live drums, a Mackie is overkill...id go with a standalone preamp....a new preamp will do WONDERS for your sound over the 4 track preamps.....

some preamps i always recommend

Midiman Audio Buddy $79
Delta DMP3 $185
Joe Meek MQ3 $189
Joe Meek VC6Q $299

[samich17]

gidge - thanks a lot man..i'll definitely have to look into gettinga seperate pre-amp then..anything to improve on my mic sound. just checked and found out my Fostex XR-5 dates back to 1995...a bit out of date was good back in the day, but holds me back from getting the sound my music deserves, but you have to hand it to me, if you listened to my cuts...i've been able to get a pretty damn good sound for the equipment i've been using..thanks again.

[samich17]

gidge - i am looking at the Joe Meek MQ3....looks good..will i be able to go into my Echo Mia with it and will i be able to plug my martin acoustic electric into it? or would you still recommend going into the 4 track with the guitar? thanks for the tip.

[darrin_h2000]

Go for 2 channels you will want to close and distance mics on guitars. I wouldnt be satisfied with one. Two pres would work just as well If the joe meek what you want.

[dobro]

Yeah, if you're tracking to hard disk, then get one or two preamps unless you're doing drums, which requires more channels (ie a mixer). Those channel strips with a preamp, EQ and compression are lovely to work with. But like Darrin said, two channels are way better than one. Being able to put two mics on a guitar offers you loads more possibilities with sound. And two of 'em would cost more than $300. But if you just go for two straightforward preamps, you can easily do that for $300.

[TexRoadkill]

I would still take the mackie over cheap preamps any day. The cheap preamps are a nice addition to a mackie but I would never call a Mackie1202 overkill for any situation. It only has 4 mic preamps so it's actually not enough for most drum mic setups.

If you get a Meek or one of the others you will be stuck with that sound on everything. Not necessarily a bad thing but you will be limiting yourself.

I would recomend everyone get a clean, neutral signal path first. Then start adding components that give you different colors when your ears are better trained.

If you want any kind of flexibility in your setup a mixer is a better first choice IMHO.

[samich17]

tex - i think everyone would like to have a Mackie Mixer, but you have to take in account that i have very little money and i would never use a Mackie to its full extent. i am a small time songwriter/mixer. i use one, maybe two, tracks at a time. ie. guitar and vocals..i don't need 16, 12, or even 10 channel to work with. Right now i am using a Fostex 4 track from 1995. It has a built in pre-amp, but it isn't very good..I think the Joe Meek MQ3 would be a nice addition to my setup...i agree that every signal should be clean and clear at first and then effects and/or compression added later. With the Joe Meek, i wouldn't have to start out with compression, but it gives you the option to start with one. Plus it is only $200 in comparison to the 1-$1,200 for a Mackie...believe me, after i finish my apprenticeship and become a certified mixing engineer, i probably will invest in a Mackie Mixer, but right now, it'd be dumb. I do, however, appreciate your advice. thanks a lot.

[TexRoadkill]

I hear ya Samich. FYI a 1202 is only about $300 new and less used. That's the only reason I was pushing one on you

Follow your heart. or maybe your ears. Well probably your wallet, than your ears than your heart.

[Gidge]

the Mackie 1202 goes for $399 new.....