Normalizing and overall RMS

[mwamsley]

I've made numerous DAT live soundboard recordings in the past and I am now manipulating them using CoolEdit Pro. As is the case with most of my recordings, the levels fall short of 0 db. I am trying to normalize them to get their average RMS levels (or overall volume) as high as I can. The problem I am encountering is, the music I am working with (ska) has A LOT of trumpet. The trumpet waves spike considerably higher than the rest of the music. So normalizing the WAV files only increase the levels slightly. The average RMS is about -30 db.

What tools, methods or steps do I need to take to maximize the overall volume of these WAV files?

Could I amplify the WAV files past 0 db so that only trumpet sounds would be clipped? Then could I use the clip noise reduction tool to remove clips, or will I be cheating myself and the recordings? I wouldn't think inducing unnecessary noise would be taboo!

Thanks-

Mark

[Blue Bear Sound]

Normalizing doesn't have anything at all to do with RMS levels... it deals only with peak levels.

Some form of multiband compression/limiting is what you'd need to use at the expense of your song's musical dynamics. If you must go that route, use it sparingly....

It is actually much more effective for the novice to get the tracking right, and the mix will take care of itself as far as overall levels and dynamics....

Consider using compression only on the tracks that need it during mixdown........

Bruce

[dobro]

Are the trumpet tracks separate, or part of a stereo mic take on a whole orchestra?

[mwamsley]

The recordings are all 1 track. I patch directly from the headphones out or aux. out of the soundboard at a club or venue. So, other than gain, I am at the mercy of the soundboard operator! I have no input on what they do. I do use mics, and a lot of times mics are the best way to go, but when you can get a soundboard patch you have the chance of getting a really great, clean 1 track recording. It all depends on the soundboard operator's skills. So my only method now, is to clean them up with CEP.

[secretorchard]

Open the file in Edit mode (as opposed to Multitrack view). Use
your mouse to highlight one of the trumpet blasts, including a
little bit on each side of the blast. Hit the "zoom to selection"
icon button. Now that you're zoomed in, highlight the entire trumpet blast. If you need to get in closer, hit the zoom to selection icon again after highlighting the trumpet blast. Now, after you've gotten the trumpet blast highlighted, go to Edit in the menu, and under there will be Zero Crossings. Very important step here. If you do not do this, you may get pops in your track. Now go to Zero Crossings and hit the one that says "both sides outward" or "both sides inward," depending on your highlighted portion. The idea here is to just get the trumpet blast, but to have both sides zero crossed. Once you've done this, go to Transform, then Amplify and make sure you're on the "constant amplification" tab. Now adust the amplification to something less than 100%. 100% represents the "no change" level. If you make it 90%, the amplitude of your trumpet blast will drop by 10% (100-90), or if you were to make it 110%, you would be increasing the amplitude by 10% (you don't want that). Now do this for all of your trumpet blasts that are "out of bounds." This is a slow way,
but very accurate.

Using a multi-band compressor like Waves C4, you can set the
threshold, range and gain levels at the appropriate levels and just
chop at those trumpet blasts, and even bring up the lower parts simultaneously. Hope this helps..

[camn]

Or you could, once you've highlighted that area.. use CEP's or any other Compressor you like.. (I use SF TRACK COMP) OR if you were feeling VERY advanced, and wanted a nice, smooth edit... you could FORGET about the zero crossings.. and instead create an "attenuation envelope" That is my favorite way to deal with spikes. do it under "create envelope"

xoxo

[mwamsley]

Since my recording isn't clipped yet, is it bad to amplify it so that the trumpet parts get clipped and THEN try the methods posted here. I guess it would be called voluntary clipping! I would either need to live with: 1 - It being too quiet and no clipping, or 2 - It being at a good volume but I would have to deal with fixing the clipped parts.

Thanks for all the advice!

Mark

[Blue Bear Sound]

You can't "fix" clipped parts... clipping, especially digital clipping, sounds very ugly indeed.....

You definitely don't want to clip anything to get its signal curve higher......... NOT a good idea at all............

Bruce

[secretorchard]

How, exactly, do you make an "attenuation envelope," Camn?
I went into Amplify:Envelopes (I think it was), and they have
a bunch of pre-sets for different types of envelopes you can apply,
but there's no attenuation envelope. Can you tell me how you
do this? Thanks.

[camn]

oh, yes.

highlight a peak. no need for zero crossings.

goto:
Transform > Amplitude > Envelope..

now you need to CREATE your own preset here....
assuming you see a flat line..... with an edit point at either end..

Raise the edit points at either end to 100% This eliminates your need for zero crossings.

click the "spline curves" check mark.

create two edit points in the middle....
slide one down about 50-60-70 %, and plant it over toward the left.
Slide the other down the same percent.. and hang it over toward the right.

You should have a nice, smooth downward curve.

ADD this as a preset. call it whatever.

now you have an effect that does exactly what a compressor does... only you can use it like a scalpel. No need fo zeroes, and the effect slides on VERY smooth and natural. no sudden drop in volume like in str8 volume cuts. Whenever you use it, you can slide your middle edit points around to adjust your attack and release... or whatever.

try it, youll like it.

xoxo

[Chriss]

yup.. doing the same as camn.. slow, but extremely efficient

[mastahnke]

I would just compress the whole track a bunch and then hard limit it. I think that would lessen the trumpet blasts and then boost the overall volume. The normalizer just makes the loudest part in song just under or at 0 db, the hard limiter does a better job of bringing up the overall level of the everything.

MIKE

[chrisharris]

I'd have to agree with mast...it's so easy that it's worth a try before you start dissecting about 4 hours of music. I've also had pretty good luck with using the Real Audio Compander (in the dynamics processing part of the Amplitude menu) as a preset. Then, once you've "companded" it (ie, compressed it), normalize it. I've found that this seems to give me a truer representation of the sound, as opposed to that artificial "compressed" sound that I tend to get from using the limiter or some of the other compressor presets. Good Luck

[JuSumPilgrim]

I would use both manal dB cutting on the spikes as well as compressing and limiting. Get Waves RCL. You can download a free 2 week demo. Do some soft compressing no more than 1.2:1-1.5:1 ratios, low gain, moderately long attacks, and try short release (50ms) and long release (150-200ms). Try the mastering opto presets and see where that takes you. Use that in conjunction with cool edits limiting and youre in business. I wouldnt rely on normalization to get you up to naught. Also when you get more famliar with compression, use cool edits compressor as a multicomp. Its very clean and effective at low gains.

[Kelly Holdridge]

WHOA.

All the suggestions so far involve a decent amount of work, especially if that trumpet is goin' for most of the song. I suggest "Peak Limiting," and using the presets other than the amount of gain you want added to the "non-trumpet" parts. It works kinda like the compressor, but only in areas that exceed 0dB. You won't have to select each segment of the song, too; it'll work on the whole wave, bringing up gain across the song until it reaches a trumpet area that exceeds 0dB (after the gain boost). In those areas, it will attempt to maintain the relative volume changes by keeping the attenuated signal in effect according to the presets you give it (attack and decay times).

Dig it.

[Kelly Holdridge]

Fudge. It IS hard limiting and I'm an idiot. I'd still suggest it, though.

[offbeatguy]

I'm a fairly new user of the software, so I'm still fumbling around with the program itself, but a hard limit will definitely "lower the ceiling" and push the trumpet peaks back down into the mix.