Mixing - Monitor Levels

[Chevegas]

Possibly a silly question. I have come to the conclusion (after reading posts at this site) that mixing with monitors is far superior to mixing with headphones. Problem is, I live in an apartment... so my question is: "CAN YOU DO A DECENT MIX USING MONITORS AT LOWER VOLUMES OR DO THEY NEED TO BE CRANKED? I'm willing to fork out the dough to get some monitors, but how loud must they be used? Any suggestions on reasonably priced monitors would also be great!

[sjoko2]

you don't have to crank them at all.
try some JBL LSR25's

[LongWaveStudio]

they dont need to be cranked. but it's good to listen to the mix loud at some point and check that everything is correctly balanced and check the mix sounds great at a louder volume level. you dont need to mix at a loud level. anythng sounds good when it's loud....even the britney spears albums....

[sjoko2]

'cmon LWS - there must be a limit

I normally work at a pretty low level, but when I'm finished I do crank it a bit to listen, but only when I'm finished, because it basically puts you out of action for the rest of the day, weather anyone realizes it or not.

[LongWaveStudio]

sjoko,

i idndi't mean listen to it loud, and then go back to quiet and carry on mixing. i was just trying to say that you should check the mix at a louder volume (at the end). if i mix at a reasonable level and then mix loudly for a while and the mix quiet again, my ears get all messed up and adjusted to the loud mix. getting a good mix when monitoring at a loud volume isn't possible (in my world!).

hope that clears anything up...!!

[sjoko2]

There must be a limit <--------------- I ment, a volume to make Brtny sound good???

[LongWaveStudio]

LOL! i see. igot a bit confused. now i understand#! im a bit drunk aswell. could explain something.and it's also 2am here in uk!

[Gidge]

Im gonna have to check out these JBL's....$479 pr isnt a whole lot.....friends dont let friends mix drunk....LWS, for the love of God, please get from behind the mixer.....

[gezzegas]

I allways do a mix in my home studio at low volume.
After your pleased with the mix, and this could take some 2-3 hours. Leave it as it is. The next day, listen to it again and do the small adjustment required. Then you can listen to it loud just to seek if there is anything that need to be adjusted one more time.
The 3rd day do a final listening, if you then are happy burn a CD or where you want it.


Remember that your ears only last a few moments before you loose the high freq. A lot of rest is needed between the sessions.

Regards
Lars.

[Track Rat]

I have a SPL meter I picked up at Radio Shack for around $40 and it's priceless when it comes to mixing. I always mix at 80 dB A weighted. I try to mix at the same level every time. Mixing at the same level is important due to the effects of the Fletcher-Munson curve.

[Cyrokk]

...plus, mixing low allows you to work without worrying so much about the acoustics of your listening room..

Cy

[sjoko2]

TR - 80 is the maximum level before incurring damage permanently at long term exposiure
I would advice you to turn it down and vary it a bit. Definately start mixing at a slightly lower level, or when you're obver 45, you'll start living in Muffled Land!!

[Queue]

The volume attenuator on my JBL LSR25's is normally at 9 o'clock, which I presume is allowing 25%-30% of the signal to get through. Even then I adjust with the main faders up and down a bit. I do occasionally put 'em to 12 o'clock (50%), but rarely past that. (They're pretty loud at that point...)

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[Wil Davis]

Originally posted by Track Rat
I have a SPL meter I picked up at Radio Shack for around $40 and it's priceless when it comes to mixing. I always mix at 80 dB A weighted. I try to mix at the same level every time. Mixing at the same level is important due to the effects of the Fletcher-Munson curve.

I'm curious as to why you chose "A" rather than "C". I suppose at the levels your using, "B" might be more appropriate, but in the absence of a "B" setting (I have one of the Rat-Shack SPL meters, and mine doesn't have a "B" setting), I think I'd use the "C" rather than the "A" setting - at the 80 dB level, anyway. I always thought that "A" weighting was for quieter sounds - like background noise. Just curious, that's all...

Great idea, by the way - I think I'll start doing the same - thanks!

- Wil

[Queue]

I don't think he meant "Setting A" on your dial when he said "A Weighted"...

I'll let one of the experts explain "A Weighted". It's up there with Peak/RMS, dB, and other secret code that the "real guys" use to flush out us wannabees.

Queue
-fellow flushed out wannabee-

[Queue]

Altavista search provided some of these tidbits:

--tidbit 1--
dBA takes into account the unequal sensitivity of the ear, and sound-pressure level is measured through a circuit that compensates for this equal loudness. These measurements are termed A weighted.

--more here--
A sound level meter that measures the sound pressure level with a "flat" response will indicate the strength of low frequency sound with the same emphasis as higher frequency sounds. Yet our ear perceives low frequency sound to be of less loudness that higher frequency sound. The eardrum- stapes-circular window system behaves like a mechanical transformer with a finite pass band. In EE parlance, the "3 dB" rollover frequencies are approximately 500 Hz on the low end and 8 kHz on the high end. By using an electronic filter of attenuation equal to that apparently offered by the human ear for sound each frequency (the 40-phon response curve), the sound level meter will now report a numerical value proportional to the human perception of the strength of that sound independent of frequency.

Unfortunately, human perception of loudness vis-a-vis frequency changes with loudness. When sound is very loud - 100 dB or more, the perception of loudness is more consistent across the audible frequency band. "B" and "C" Weightings reflect this trend. "B" Weighting is now little-used, but C-Weighting has achieved prominence in evaluating annoying community noises such as low frequency sound emitted by artillery fire and outdoor rock concerts.

So, I spoze if he said "A" he meant "A". And you should use "A"

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I've now learned something for today, and can sleep well...

[Wil Davis]

The "A" and the "C" settings on the RS sound-level meter do in fact refer to the "A" and "C" weighting and are not just arbitrary switch positions. My question was why the choice of "A" when "C" would seem to be more appropriate, based on the information in the Glen Ballou handbook.

- Wil

[Queue]

Sorry Wil,
Based on what I read, (and quoted in my post) it became obvious to me that A and C on your meter were actually representative of A and C weighted measurements.

I meant to include that as part of my post last night, seems my ability to post intelligently decreases as the night goes on...

(I'm going to defer to the experts at this point...)

Queue