automated mixer for Tascam MS-16?

[vostok88]

Ok, I got a question here that I really need help with (if it's even possible) and I'll try to state it as 'simple' as possible:

- I've got a Tascam MS-16 (16 track r2r, 1" tape) and a Tascam DM-3200 mixer. As you probably already know, the Tascam DM-3200 mixer has fully automated faders. My main question is: Is there any possible way to get the MS-16 r2r to 'sync up' with this automated mixer somehow, so that I can take advantage of the 'automated faders'?

- again, I don't even know if this is possible or not - but just wanted to ask you guys to see if it was. I know a lot of you would probably say to 'just use an old, analog board & mix the old fashion way'. But still........

I do have an old analog board as it is, and would like the 'option' of either using it & mixing 'manually' - but would still like to be able and use the Tascam DM-3200 for the more 'tougher' mixes, that really require the 'automated' faders (for memory purposes - not because I'm lazy!

Is there ANY way to do this, and if so - how difficult is it to do?

- (thank you for your time & input as well.)

[sweetbeats]

Hm...

So you're wanting to be able to have the DM-3200 respond to control signal from the MS-16?

You can do this with a simple SMPTE to MTC converter like a JL Cooper PPS-1 or PPS-2 or PPS-100...lots of other offerings out there. You stripe your 16th track with SMPTE and then port track 16 out through the sync box and then take the MIDI output from the sync box into one of the MIDI inputs on the DM-3200. From there you'll need to know how to configure the DM-3200 to respond to incoming MTC but (depending on what functions on the DM-3200 can be automated based on incoming MTC, and I'd be surprised if the list of functions isn't comprehensive) you should then be able to record fader movements, mutes, solos, even effect parameter changes based on the position of the tape just like you would do if doing the same thing with the DM-3200 and a DAW.

Hope that helps.

[dodgeaspen]

Follow Sweets advice, he knows what he's talking about.

[witzendoz]

Hi,

You need a smpte time code generator of some kind, there will be loads of old cheap smpte devices capable of doing this on the second hand market. You then record smpte from the generator onto track 16 of the MS-16.

Connect track 16 out to the time code input of the DM-3200, when you play the MS-16 the DM-3200 will lock to the incoming time code (this may have to be turned on in the menus somewhere) and the time code will give the DM-3200 the location point for the automation.

Cheers

Alan.

[Dr ZEE]

What Alan said above.
Vostok, I assume you have the manual, if not , there's pdf here, d-load the top one in the list: http://www.tascam.com/products/dm-3200;9,9,36,19.html, it explains how to set-up/select time-code source and the rest of the stuff...
*************
hmmmmmmmm, looks like this "fully" automated machine is too advanced to provide a user with a primitive and too simple internal SMPTE generator's output. But. hey, they assume (or hope??), that nobody spins reels anymore...heh heh

[vostok88]

Yeah, I hear you on that one DR. Zee - I don't think many of these companies now expect hardly anyone to spin reels any longer either. But that's exactly what I'm trying to do here. Basically trying to blend the 'best of both worlds' here

Well first off, thanks to each of you for your input & advice. What you say makes pretty good sense to me so far, and I can't wait to try & get this to work (hopefully

Couple of more questions though:

Is there any 'recommended or 'preferred' SMPTE time code generators in which to purchase?

About how much does one of these things go for now (ebay)?

- and also (just to make sure I have this correct) - I would basically record a SMPTE 'tone' code onto say, track 16. But do I run the output of track 16 'back into' the SMPTE box -or- into the DM3200? (one of you said back into the box, and another said directly into the DM3200) And also, when you record this 'SMPTE code' onto track 16 - do I need to record it from the very beginning of the tape - all the way to the very end?

And one more thing (just in case I were to ever need to do this) by 'striping' the MS-16 tape with the 'SMPTE code' - would this also work for 'syncing up' to a DAW program and it's tracks as well? (or in other words, if you were to record say, 1/2 your tracks into ProTools, and the other 1/2 onto the MS-16 unit - could you still 'sync' them all together with this 'striping method'?)

(I really hope that made sense & didn't make me sound like a complete idiot )

- thanks again guys for your help on all of this.

[sweetbeats]

dodge, thanks for the vote of confidence, but actually I'm only half right about half the time...

Witzendoz and ZEE have got the goods.

I see now that the DM-3200 has a dedicated timecode input. Cool. So you can forget the sync box like they are saying, but also, yeah, you'll need something to generate the timecode you are going to stripe to track 16. So you may end up getting an old sync box anyway since, as witzendoz is saying, those typically have an onboard timecode generator. Seems silly that Tascam went to the trouble of putting a timecode input on the DM-3200, but no generator.

Yeah you can have the MS-16 be the master and slave the DM-3200 and then slave the DAW to the DM-3200 via MTC, but keep in mind the MS-16 is then essentially your wordclock generator...Lots of people do it, but I'd rather have my digital system locked to a stable digital wordclock, not timecode on my mechanical open reel deck which is why I slave my decks when possible (i.e. when the capstan can be servo controlled by an external synchronizer...your MS-16 has this capability). I'm opening a can of worms now so I'm going to bow out.

[Dr ZEE]

Originally Posted by vostok88

Is there any 'recommended or 'preferred' SMPTE time code generators in which to purchase?

About how much does one of these things go for now (ebay)?

-.

You may want to try searching for an obsolete hardware piece aka "midi interface" , one of those that are out of order and no support, company out of business and nobody wants them
I am using my old Opcode MusicQuest 8port/SE , it can do smpte out as stand alone, without computer attached, just push program button, select smpte/frame and then push smpte button. Those specific units are kind of rare on eBay, but there are others that I assume can do similar trick, made by Opcode and MOTU and maybe some other. You also need to make sure that that function works in "stand-alone" mode for a specific model, or ask the seller the question about it.
Here's example I've found on eBay as we speak, but the auction almost over, also it's in as-is condition:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Opcode-Studio-64...mZ250466390591
the units like this must at least have two "audio-jacks" (usually on the back), that are SMPTE in/out. Sometimes those jacks marked as Timecode, or LTC or even simply "audio" (if I am not mistaken...???). Again you want a unit that can do this operation without a computer connected.

Search eBay for "opcode" , or "motu midi" etc... if you find something you can ask a question , so somebody who knows/had this specific unit can advise you. You can find a unit like this for cheap, but again, it will be usually AS-IS , so there is a chance that you may get a non-working unit.

[Dr ZEE]

here's a screenshot pic of the back of the unit (from that eBay item I've mentioned), that's what you are looking for , then make sure that the unit can be operated without computer (as TODAY! you don't want to deal with this, take my word for this one heh heh )
.....

[witzendoz]

Hi,

I did an ebay search (USA as I did not know which country you are in) and come up with a few, this is just a guide, shop around and also pick a device that may do something else that you need around the studio, i.e midi.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Studio-4-Opcodes...ht_7816wt_1167

http://cgi.ebay.com/MOTU-Micro-EXPRE...#ht_572wt_1167

http://cgi.ebay.com/JL-Cooper-PPS-2-...ht_3698wt_1167

Found this on UK ebay, I have one of these actual units, don't use it any more but was always reliable.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/vintage-XRI-sm...3A1%7C294%3A50


Funny enough, I am now doing in my studio what you are doing in reverse, I run a Tascam MX2424 digital recorder and run the smpte from this into my analog console to sync the onboard automation.

Cheers


Alan.