Celtic Grunge/Prog...

[TelePaul]

Heya guys. Do any of you have friends who say "Oh hey, you're into mixing, make all these sound good" and then proceed to dump a mass of unorganised session files in your lap? No? Just me then...

So my friends tracked this with some guy using a pro-tools rig, but didn't like his mix. They gave me a couple of hundred audio files - mostly snippets of punch-ins, very few complete tracks. I've been without a soundcard for months now, but I did what I could with ASIO for all - had to mix on PC speakers though!

So feel free to rip this apart...the guitar distortion was done on some kinda modeller no-doubt, as it sounds awful. From what I can gather, the drums were tracked well so some pointers on mixing them would be good. Thanks in advance.

It's called 'Tara'

www.soundclick.com/glasshouserecordings

[TelePaul]

Anybody? Don't be afraid to rip it apart.

[Greg_L]

The whole thing sounds kind of dark and lifeless and there's some weird low end resonacne thing going on - like it's in a box. Sounds wet and muddy. It may be those hideous guitars, but it also seems that way through the quieter parts. There also seems to be a mismatch of reverb or space. The vox and rhythm guitars and even the bass sound kind of wet, while the drums and lead are pretty dry and in your face.

[TelePaul]

Originally Posted by Greg_L

The whole thing sounds kind of dark and lifeless and there's some weird low end resonacne thing going on - like it's in a box. Sounds wet and muddy. It may be those hideous guitars, but it also seems that way through the quieter parts. There also seems to be a mismatch of reverb or space. The vox and rhythm guitars and even the bass sound kind of wet, while the drums and lead are pretty dry and in your face.

Thanks dude. I guess I'm gonna have to wait till I get my old speakers back. I might just tell them to fuck off, I don't really fancy a month of turd polishing.

[gecko zzed]

What Greg L said ^^.

There is a lot to do to get this into shape.

The bass sounds soggy with no real definition.

The main vocal is too distant. He is doing a dramatic bit of singing, so some verb helps, but he sounds like he's in the next room.

The guitars left and right sound brittle, too extremely panned (for my taste), and need some air around them. It sounds like I got speaker cones glued to each ear.

The guitar that floats around at the start has effects on it (reverb and chorus by the sound of it) which are mono. This has the effectof making it sound sloppy, rather than spacious. Are those effects part of the recording? If they are, bad luck. If not, try stereo effects to generate some space.

But . . . from what I can hear, the kit doesn't sound to bad to me. I'm hearing some crisp cymbals, though the rest of the kit has sunk a bit into the mix.

The lead guitar, like the beginning guitar, is too narrow, and doesn't have much character.

The low end resonance that Greg L mentioned seems to hover around a low G note (not sure what frequency . . . you need to do a sweep and see if you can tame it a bit).

Best of luck

[Waffleness]

+1 on what's been said

I like the structure of the song though. I think once its mixed better it will be good.

[TelePaul]

Originally Posted by gecko zzed

What Greg L said ^^.

There is a lot to do to get this into shape.

The bass sounds soggy with no real definition.

The main vocal is too distant. He is doing a dramatic bit of singing, so some verb helps, but he sounds like he's in the next room.

The guitars left and right sound brittle, too extremely panned (for my taste), and need some air around them. It sounds like I got speaker cones glued to each ear.

The guitar that floats around at the start has effects on it (reverb and chorus by the sound of it) which are mono. This has the effectof making it sound sloppy, rather than spacious. Are those effects part of the recording? If they are, bad luck. If not, try stereo effects to generate some space.

But . . . from what I can hear, the kit doesn't sound to bad to me. I'm hearing some crisp cymbals, though the rest of the kit has sunk a bit into the mix.

The lead guitar, like the beginning guitar, is too narrow, and doesn't have much character.

The low end resonance that Greg L mentioned seems to hover around a low G note (not sure what frequency . . . you need to do a sweep and see if you can tame it a bit).

Best of luck

All of the guitars were sent to me wet. Which sucks. But I guess this is what happens when you use modellers. The guitars and bass just seem to have been tracked so poorly.

I'm gonna persevere with the drums because I like the cymbals too, and I think I'll go from there. The snare sounds very boxy, even with alot of the underside mic blended in with it. The sub-mix needs a hump in the mid-range. some space. Oh and when mixing drums, should I pan the toms individually or will the panned overheads take care of it?

[joeym]

Shame about the badly recorded tracks, this is a great song. Singer's really good. But apart from the drums everything sounds a bit muddy. They should let you record them, Paul. It's not really all that bad, though, would be OK for a demo. Considering what you got to work with, you did pretty well.

Cheers
Joe

[TelePaul]

Originally Posted by joeym

Shame about the badly recorded tracks, this is a great song. Singer's really good. But apart from the drums everything sounds a bit muddy. They should let you record them, Paul. It's not really all that bad, though, would be OK for a demo. Considering what you got to work with, you did pretty well.

Cheers
Joe

Hey, thanks man! To be honest, I think I could do a decent job on the guitars and bass if they let me track them. I imagine the vocals could be okay too if I mess with them some more. I don't get how the drums sound okay and the guitars just sound so much on the fuzz side.

[VomitHatSteve]

Pretty much what everyone else said.

I'm also going to add that the mix sounds incredibly quiet. It all comes through as a dull roar in the distance. I've got every volume know I could get my hands on maxed, and it's still quiet.

[TelePaul]

Originally Posted by VomitHatSteve

Pretty much what everyone else said.

I'm also going to add that the mix sounds incredibly quiet. It all comes through as a dull roar in the distance. I've got every volume know I could get my hands on maxed, and it's still quiet.

Now I'm worried...for every session file I was given, there's a duplicate file with the added word "NORM". I hope this guy didn't track obscenely low and normalise each track...

[TelePaul]

So Iv'e posted a remix at the same place. Incremental improvement I think - I've dried the vocal up and killed off some of the stupid duplicate guitar tracks (though the crap distortion remains!).

The good news is my soundcard is working again so I've a half-decent monitoring system to use now.

[Jeff_B]

im listening to the remix right now. and the vocals sound wayyyyyy better.

i would agree that the tone of the distorted guitar is a little off...

it would be nice to have alittle more pop out of the snare.

these are just my ears talking, not my experience of being a pro engineer or anything.

[TelePaul]

Originally Posted by Jeff_B

im listening to the remix right now. and the vocals sound wayyyyyy better.

i would agree that the tone of the distorted guitar is a little off...

it would be nice to have alittle more pop out of the snare.

these are just my ears talking, not my experience of being a pro engineer or anything.

Thanks dude, yeah you're right, the snare needs more ring to it. I get the feeling this song will need some radical EQing to tighten it up.

[VomitHatSteve]

Yeah, it's definitely an improvement. Most of the instruments still come through a little muddy and subdued, but You can at least hear it all now.

[TelePaul]

Hi all,

Another remix up (Tara Remix). I think it's an improvement; did a bit of re-tracking on those guitars (but the guitarist is one of those "this goes up to 11" kinda guys). Overall I think the mix sounds a little cleaner. The vocal track is an approximation, havn't decided fully on fx as I still have to piece together a pitch-perfect composite.

Thanks for all your advice so far, especially Greg L who helped me with the drums; they're relly the only part of the track I'm happy with. With your suggestions on-board, I'll upload a final version of this track next weekend along with the original mix provided by the first engineer; hopefully mine will come out on top!

Thanks all.

[joeym]

Lots better now, Paul!
Man, what a great song, I liked it the first time I heard it and you've managed to polish it real well! These guys are really good, I hope you get to record them next time. Guitars sound great to me now.

Well done!

Joe

[TelePaul]

Originally Posted by joeym

Lots better now, Paul!
Man, what a great song, I liked it the first time I heard it and you've managed to polish it real well! These guys are really good, I hope you get to record them next time. Guitars sound great to me now.

Well done!

Joe

Man thanks alot, you've no idea how much of a boost that gives me. These guys are close friends, and when they're good, they're VERY good...but when they're bad...well, things get mess very quickly. Really appreciate your kind words.

[Bguzaldo]

Definitely cleaned up well! The Rhythem guitars are still a sunken into the mix when the heavy part starts. But still a very job well done, especially thru computer speakers! Great job man, wish I could liven up a mix like you.

-barrett

[TelePaul]

Anyone else?

[Greg_L]

I don't really remember the song, but going by my own comments above, I'd say this is a pretty vast improvement. Good job.

[TelePaul]

Originally Posted by Greg_L

I don't really remember the song, but going by my own comments above, I'd say this is a pretty vast improvement. Good job.

Thanks alot dude, you really helped me through this with your advice on the drums. Thanks alot.