Tascam 234 Story...

[sweetbeats]

This is a continuation of this thread:

http://homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?t=276432

Kind of a next chapter as it were (as I received word that it is on its way), and starting the new thread satisfies my sick need to have the thread title match my other "Story..." threads...oboy.

The seller was nice enough to pack it in lots of bubble wrap as I requested secondary to cjacek's recommendation...

So I'll give a full report after it arrives.

[mastercontrolme]

Looking forward to the next installment....

[cjacek]

Yeah, me too....

[analogkid]

Stay tuned for another exciting episode of...


As The Capstan Turns





AK

[Dr ZEE]

Sweet! ,
You should start "reel-ality" tv series and become filthy rich ...heh heh

[sweetbeats]

What is that guy's prob??? The one on the left? Studer puts her red reels on and he has the gall to stand in front of her at the photo shoot...later that night, she has her revenge...with reel motors spinning in fast-wind she enters the house...he never locks the door...Studer finds him, as useal, cashed on the couch with an empty six-pack of generic beer still held together by the plastic retainer clutched in his hand...the tape hisses...the breeze from the silently screaming reels stirs his slumber...the smell...he knows that smell...the edge of the tape inches toward his neck...that...smell...OXIDE! HIS EYES FLY OPEN..."STUDER NOOOO! NOOOOOOO! N..."

Tune in next week for the continuing story of...As the Capstan Turns.

[sweetbeats]

Well, thse of you that have been anticipating this next installment are going to be disappointed right along with me. I'll be posting a link to this over in the packing sticky thread. Yup. Totally inadequately packed. Worst part is that I can tell the eBay Seller took some time and care to pack it, but the amount of packing and placement of the packing was just sorely lacking and the (former) VGC 234 has taken a solid hit to the left edge of the face.

Here is the view when opening the box...I was hopeful after seeing the box and thinking "Uh oh...that box doesn't look big enough for a cassette deck..." hopeful because I saw custom cut foam:






Lift the foam top away...uh oh again. Not the "bubble-pack" I was hoping to see:



And pull those sad air bags away and look at the unprotected corners:



At least the Seller didn't put the rack ears right on the top of the case, but they did put the documentation in between......the rare VGC brochure didn't get too dented up...:




Tip up the deck and you can see that the actual bubble-pack that was pieced together around the deck was doing very little. Much of that bubble-pack was deflated anyway:



And then I saw a pitch control knob bent funny-like through the plastic :



You can also see the impact in the left edge of the faceplate. It must have impacted something pretty hard...don't know what I'm going to do about the pitch control knob...Its the rarest pot on the deck and I'm certain Tascam no longer carries them, and it remains to be seen whether or not it is functioning at all. Such a shame...It is a very clean deck otherwise:





Right side of the face looks okay, though the main shroud is sitting funny at the top-right corner...not sure what is going on there yet:



The left rear corner took a hit also:



Back looks okay:



It still lights up but...:

1. Meter #4 jumps all around
2. Peak LED #3 lights randomly
3. Lots of pops and crackles through the headphones...bad caps? Cracked PCB?
4. Can't test transport functions since the deck is in need of a new belt
5. Can't even get the cassette door open because the tape door is jammed I'm assuming as a result of the damage to the left edge of the faceplate...)

So basically I just paid $100 for a parts deck.

I'm getting in touch with the Seller. Again, I don't think they were being purposefully negligent, but the Seller and I clearly have a disconnect in what it means to "wrap" something in bubble-wrap. Very sad end for a nice deck.

[mastercontrolme]

Too bad. I hate that feeling when I see a box that looks too small for the component. Soft foam sheets like the ones used are not good for packing, too soft. It looked like a really nice deck too. I would try to get some money back or file a claim with the buyer.

[A Reel Person]

The box and padding are totally inadequate. That's a heavy deck! That box is pretty flimsey and the foam and bubble wrap don't cut it.

Still, it doesn't look like a total loss. You could replace the belts and fix that pitch pot and probably be alright.

[sweetbeats]

I'm hoping the crackling in the phones is just bad caps...

Anxious to see the heads but I ca't get in there yet with the eject button jammed.

That pitch control pot is the biggest stickler for me as I'm pretty sure it'll snap if I try to straighten it...it needs to be straightened as it is bent to such a degree you can't push the knob in to defeat the pitch control.

This is going to be a story...

[cjacek]

That seller cannot be anything less than a complete idiot. Boy, am I ever pissed!

[A Reel Person]

It's hard to see, but if the pitch pot is bent it's worse than I thought. If the cassette window is jammed on the faceplate from a bend, that's not good at all. However, if the belts were known bad, perhaps the heads are stuck in the "up" position, which would prevent the cassette well from opening.

Either way, I know it's irritating.

[sweetbeats]

Yeah, the pot is bent at about 45 degrees.

[cjacek]

I know that this may not be the thing you'd do but I'd personally want to get my money refunded asap for receiving a "not as described" item and that includes the idiotic packing. Don't let the seller tell you that it's not his fault and that you should take it up with the shipping company. It's totally up to the seller, from the initial deck, in his possession, to delivery to your door, that he is 100% responsible. Add to this his blatant disregard for packing instruction [also lack of respect for his fellow buyer] and outright stupidity and he has "guilty" stamped all over his face. Chalk it up to lesson learned, that's all.

[A Reel Person]

"Hello,... Tascam?" Sourcing a replacement pitch control pot would be preferrable prior to trying to bend the old one back.

Beatz,... I know it's disappointing and I'm not making light of the hit you just took,... but I know you desire a "challenge" in technical matters. To get something that's "mint" off-the-shelf would probably just be b-o-r-i-n-g to you!

However, maybe recourse of getting a refund for this purchase might be best. I know you're already aye'deep in projects!

I still promised you those bulbs & haven't forgotten!

When are you driving back to LA County? Heh, heh.

[sweetbeats]

Just checked with Tascam parts and p/n 5200119900, "PCB Assy, PITCH CONTROL" is discontinued. Probably would cost more than the deck anyway. So I guess I see if it is still functioning and then decide whether I can suppress my OCD enough to leave the bent shaft alone. Maybe with the knob cap off I can bend it just enough to defeat the pitch control, or I guess worst-case scenario bypass the pitch control altogether. Never used one anyway...but...but its supposed to be there!

Dave, great point on the eject function...I did see that, in the manual, it states that the door will not open if the heads in the "up" position. I guess I thought that if the deck was off the heads would park. That's not necessarily true?

I don't think the faceplate was tweaked in such a way as to jam the tape door...I think I recall wiggling the door and it can shift around slightly as it should...I'll just have to open 'er up.

Daniel...yeah...its just such a clean deck otherwise...I'm hoping to work something out with the Seller...dunno..urg!

[A Reel Person]

Okay, right off,... open 'er up. Rotate the head/load sprocket by hand til the heads retract. Take it from there.

Bypassing the pitch control knob might be a good solution. It's there to match pitch, but is for most people a little used feature. So, if you record on the 234, then transfer it to the 424mkII, you could always compensate with the 424mkII's pitch control, if necessary. If you don't forsee swapping tapes between decks, users or sites, the issue of pitch control is moot.

I've gone down the way you've gone. Buy a minty item. Council the seller to pack a certain way, then BAM. Sellers in many cases don't understand what's good packing and what's not.

Best scenario: you'd get a refund and get to keep the deck as "parts". I've had 2 significant deals turn out for me that way,... and it's sweet "revenge"!

[sweetbeats]

I opened it up tonight to have a look inside.

But first here's another shot of the bent pitch control pot and the power button which I didn't notice before:






This is a shot looking down at the back left corner with the shroud removed...you can see the gold colored side rail at the top of the unit, and where it attaches to the rear panel you can see it is tweaked...in fact, the flange of the rear panel is tweaked...When I removed the shroud I noticed that it looks like the whole side is tweaked...you can see the imprint of screw heads in it. It took a hit alright. Anyway, because the side rail and rear panel flange are teaked the rail is actually pressing on the PSU PCB in an unhealthy way:



Now here's where the real fun begins...

I wanted to try and get the cassette door open to look at the heads. A Reel Person was right in that the heads were not in a parked position and therefore the door could not be opened. I figured out what to rotate in order to allow the door to open. Heads are okay, I think, more on that in a bit...Anyway, there is, of course, a mild mess in there from the belts having gone bad, the remains of which had been removed except for the requisite smears. I turned it on to check the capstan motor which seems okay, but I kept hearing these wierd quiet little chirpy creaks...I tracked it down to the cam motor, the one that actuates the heads...I'm pointing to it:


It keeps wanting to go, like its jumpy...doesn't know what to do, and the pitch control...instead of on and defeat, I've got, like, two pitch control ranges...sweet. Push it in and you've got low-range pitch adjust...pull the knob out and you've got high-range adjust. Well, so much for that. Every rubber thing has gone to goo; obviously the two belts, but the rubber "tires" on the reel motor and idler (I think I saw two of them), and the pinch roller...yuck...pushed on it and its like soft modeling clay...see here in this pic of the heads:


But to my eyes the heads do look pretty good...such a shame...comments?



But its going to be a project at best which is really sad. I heard back from the Seller, but I'm keeping the discussion between us private for now. I will say that, in re-reading the auction detail about the deck's condition the Seller indicated there was no "dirt" or noise when turning pots and listening in headphones, so that tells me there has been damage to electrical coomponents since it sounds like firecrackers going off when I listen, and there is a ton of "dirt" when actuating pots...

[sweetbeats]

I will say this though...just took a peek at the schematics. This thing is ripe for mods IMHO...The audio path is all 4560, 4558 and 386 chips. Some 2134's in there instead might make a noticeable improvement...

[A Reel Person]

A) Another user found out for me that Terry's Rubber Roller Restorers will restore a cassette or Portastudio pinch roller, as long as you remove the HUB of the roller entirely from the BRACKET it's mounted on,... by using a pin punch to remove the axle.

B) The rubber TIRES for FF/RW will need to be replaced, and that's a significant teardown of the mech to remove the associated motor and clutch. It's an hour or two of fiddling for an adept person, like you. The tires I found were best were 0.56" (OD), can't remember the other dimensions, but this sized tire will s-t-r-e-t-c-h with some effort onto the clutch assembly. Quantity 2. I had some beautiful pictures of the FF/RW motor, clutch & tires,... before my last bad hard drive crash, about 18 months ago.

That the rubber is completely shot is not something the previous user "did", or did not do. Blame Mother Nature. You knew that. Actually, I've read that these parts were made from a rubber that was not 100% cured, but I'd have to search for that story or info. I feel for'ya that it's much more of a project than you wanted. Is it asking so much for something to work right out of the box these days? I'd seek a refund if the seller's agreeable.

I have like 5 of the 234 units, for the most part all in better condition than that one. (No smashers, but at least one taken apart for repair and never put back together). I think 2 units working currently, as I've refurbished them previously. I have one 234 that's apparently clean, but the capstan belt had deteriorated and "snapped up" & rolled up entirely onto the motor pulley. Sits there like "molding clay", like you said. Gonna require dismounting the mech and cleaning the pulley before reinstallation.

[A Reel Person]

That machine, as heavy as it is, got a classic "corner drop". That usually means trouble, any way you slice it.

You could possibly use what you have for a MAJOR refurbishment project. The seller bears fault for the unit getting damaged, IMO. Poor packing produces these results repeatedly, over time.

I think the heads look alright, FWIW.

[cjacek]

I, I, I feel really, really sad, can't look at those photos, Cory.., been there before....

[cjacek]

Cory, as one friend to another can only say, I'd not make this into yet another project. Get yer money back, keep or sell it off for parts and don't look back. Refocus on your other projects.

[sweetbeats]

Reel, thanks for the info...I suppose Tascam may have info on the dimensions for those tires...Parts Express has lots of that stuff...the Service Manual for the 234 is, oddly enough, much harder to wade through than the likes of my 48 or 58...its just not laid out so step-by-step. The writers of the 48 and 58 service manuals really did a great job. Anyway, those tires are not even listed as individual parts at least not that I've found yet...part of the idler sub-assembly and the reel motor...but, as I said, maybe Tascam can fill in the blanks on those dimensions.

And yeah, I know its not the Sellers fault that the rubber went to goo, and yer right...Tascam sourced their rubber from another source and the rubber wasn't cured long enough and so it turns to goo...rubber sourced from different/original sources is fine...the solenoid cushions on my 48...its funny...2 were goo, one was not. So yeah I know it is not the Seller's fault and yet the implication in the auction detail is that the deck is ready to go save for the belts needing installed. I don't expect the Seller to know everything, but when you put it all together (the unmentioned/unknown issues, the inadequate packing and subsequent shipping damage), it makes for a stronger case IMHO. Anyway the Seller and I are communicating. He says one of his 234's came to him in the same box undamaged, and that he has another 234 that came in a box with no padding and it survived. So, that is his good fortune but my stance is that that is not what I requested as far as packing precautions.

Cory, as one friend to another can only say, I'd not make this into yet another project. Get yer money back, keep or sell it off for parts and don't look back. Refocus on your other projects.

Yup...yer right...I know you are...and you've said that before...and yet the madness continues...you're going to give up hope on me at some point I'm sure.

I'm struggling with several things at this juncture:

• The 234 is so cool! The ultimate in 4-track cassette recorder/reproducers (aside from the 134 I suppose) and I'm impressed with the guts...and the fact that it can function completely on its own with the basic onboard 4x2 mixer, but will also interface direct with outboard gear...this is a downfall of the 424 IMHO...it is nice that it has the direct out jacks, but there is no real way to bypass the input section (and to Tascam's credit that makes perfect sense...why add cost to the price-point for a feature that doesn't make sense when the 424 already has its own mixing section). And 4 analog VU's on a cassette deck... I've been messing with the open reel units so long its like a new novelty to fiddle with the same components on a smaller scale...cute little capstan motor...I'm definitely ill...sheesh
• The unit featured here came with a full set of documents in good condition...how much would that cost on the open market?
• I'd really like to own one of these things long-term, and this unit does have usable parts in it for sure, especially critical pieces like the heads, capstan and reel motors...

Maybe I'm going way astray...I've got these big intensive projects all over the place related to relatively complex higher-end pieces of gear (the 58 and the M-___ for example), and having a simple unit to use is a draw...I'll tend to get complicated to the nth degree and the 234 (and M-308B) are grounding in a way, though both are "projects" for sure. Hm. Is it sick though that the M-308B actually feels like a small project after the M-520 and now the M-___??

Enough already.

Waiting for the Seller to respond...

[cjacek]

Originally Posted by sweetbeats

So yeah I know it is not the Seller's fault and yet the implication in the auction detail is that the deck is ready to go save for the belts needing installed. I don't expect the Seller to know everything, but when you put it all together (the unmentioned/unknown issues, the inadequate packing and subsequent shipping damage), it makes for a stronger case IMHO. Anyway the Seller and I are communicating. He says one of his 234's came to him in the same box undamaged, and that he has another 234 that came in a box with no padding and it survived. So, that is his good fortune but my stance is that that is not what I requested as far as packing precautions.

The seller's either on crack or a complete moron, at the very least clueless and fails to take any responsibility, from the rather loose [and misleading] description, to the laughable packing and failing to yield your precise instructions as to the former. The dude is at fault and if he doesn't see that clearly then I'd take it to PayPal but please don't be so nice about it, Cory. You're too damn nice!

One needs knowledge and some intelligence but, unfortunately, this seller has shown none. It's not being mean but rather stating facts.

Point him to this thread. I'd like to have a little chat with him.