Mixing rock\metal guitars, how to excite hi freqs?!?

[leserpentrouge]

Hi guys, I'm writing from an italian studio. We've recorded metal guitars with a mesa dual rectifier and 4x12 roadking cab, but we were so scared about recording too much hifreqs, now guitars sound so good but too low and full of 340Hz... I hate them.... How can I excite\enhance all the stuff over the 800hz at the best? I have a precision multiband on my UAD2 DUO and it sounds good but it doesn't give any presence to guitars because it kills low-mid freqs...
PLEASE HELP ME

[SouthSIDE Glen]

First off, are you judging the sound of the soloed tracks or as they sound in the mix with everything else? If you're listening to them outside the mix, you just might be blessed more than you think, as 90% the problem with guitars is *too much* upper mids and highs so that there no room up there for the rest of the tracks.

If you still feel the same way after listening in a rough mix, then my next question would be, when you were scared of having too much HF, did you do something in tracking to avoid them (like a death scoop EQ or something)? If so, then maybe you might want to try again but not do so much of what you were scared into doing.

After considering all that, based upon your OP, it sounds like you have the problems pretty well ID'd enough to know what to try in corrective EQ. I'm not sure what to tell you that you probably couldn't figure out better for yourself just by playing with a decent parametric.

Just be careful about that awful 2k-5k range. Yes, that's where much of the energy comes from, but it's *really* easy once the mix is put together to have way to much buildup there, resulting in a harsh sound where it's hard to find room for all the instruments and vocals at once. Again, juge the guitars as to how they sound in the overall mix, not how they sound soloed.

Spero che questo aiuta!

G.

[Sonixx]

did you take a DI when you tracked?

post a clip of your tone.

[leserpentrouge]

I've recorded 3 tracks for each guitarist: sennheiser e906, sennheiser MD441 and a Clean DI with my Api 7600 channel strip. I didn't scoop any freq, no eq on recording so I have flat tracks and in the mix they sound so low\middish without any presence on hifreqs, and enhancing 2-5k it sounds better but really far... Maybe I can find a good preset on my Izotope trash to solve this problem?!? and what you think about the number of tracks? for metal stuff it's better to mix 6 mics in a clean way o just one mic for side and mix it really hard??

thank you so much

[Ironklad Audio]

i don't know what the low end on your tracks sounds like, or what you're tuning you're in, but a lot of guys now like to stick a multiband comp on metal guitars somewhere in the 60-240hz range...it won't give you more high end, but it can seem like it by taming low end mud

it can also be effective sometimes to lo-pass the guitars around say 10k, but then boost the crap out of a high shelf EQ at 12k or so

[Sonixx]

Originally Posted by leserpentrouge

I've recorded 3 tracks for each guitarist: sennheiser e906, sennheiser MD441 and a Clean DI with my Api 7600 channel strip...

since you have a DI track, you can reamp and dial the tone to your satisfaction.

[SouthSIDE Glen]

Originally Posted by leserpentrouge

I've recorded 3 tracks for each guitarist: sennheiser e906, sennheiser MD441 and a Clean DI with my Api 7600 channel strip.
...
what you think about the number of tracks? for metal stuff it's better to mix 6 mics in a clean way o just one mic for side and mix it really hard??

While multiple mics/sources can give a great sound, it's a lot harder to try and get a great sound from scratch from multiple mics simultaneously then it is from one at a time.

I'd try to walk before you run; work on your mic placement and work on it in steps. With those 12" drivers, the difference in sound can matter in inches.

I'd start by selecting which of your four 12s to mic up close. With the git plugged in, turn up the amp volume until you can distinctly hear instrument noise. Make sure No ONE goes near the guitar and blows your eardrum out while you go up close to the amp cab with one ear and listen for which driver is giving you the most defined-sounding hiss. Select that driver to mic up.

Then it's time to select between the 906 and the 441 as the one for providing the main/majority of the sound. Take them one at a time, miking up the selected driver, and find out which one gives you the closest sound to the sound you're looking for. Try (among all other positions) keeping the mic off the center of the dustcap, pointing instead to somewhere around the voice coil, and try it both straight on and at about a 30-40 degree angle in and see which gives you the most desirable sound.

Also, what seems to be needed to be told to just about all new metal recorders; turn down the gain/amp distortion; you need less of it for recording than you think you need when playing live.

Once you have your sound dialed it as best as possible with the right mic, right mic position and right amp settings, then you can start experimenting with filling in tone with the second mic. The options here are almost unlimited, but be open to the possibility that the second mic may or may not actually help. It's not a slam dunk definite either way, only your ears will know for sure.

G.

[steve.h]

Post samples! It's like asking if your shirt needs more blue to match your shoes.. how the hell do we know without a picture!

[Sonixx]

Originally Posted by steve.h

Post samples!...

uh-oh... you're asking for trouble.

[SouthSIDE Glen]

Originally Posted by steve.h

Post samples! It's like asking if your shirt needs more blue to match your shoes.

He's not asking if his shirt needs more blue, he's stating right out that he knows his shirt is not blue enough.

Big difference. This guy has ears, he's just asking for technique.

G.

[steve.h]

Originally Posted by SouthSIDE Glen

He's not asking if his shirt needs more blue, he's stating right out that he knows his shirt is not blue enough.

Big difference. This guy has ears, he's just asking for technique.

G.

I guess I figured that if the OP had equipment/plugins capable of boosting high frequencies, but was unsure of how to use them or which ones to use, that he most likely didn't trust his ears enough to, you know, TRY different stuff and listen to the results: thus, if the OP doesn't trust his ears, why should we?

[leserpentrouge]

...I think that I'll reamp the DI track through a TSL100 with a AKG 414.... and I'll mix this new track with older tracks..... It's the only way... My API 560 eq is a good eq but a good eq can't give good presence on guitars as a 100 watt head can do... so... thank you so much...
Re amp is the way!

[Sonixx]

sounds like you feel you're stuck with your original mic'd tracks even though you have DIs available to reamp.