using reverb plug in-newbie

[MissyH]

I need help! I'm new at pro tools le. I've recorded some tracks to learn best mic placement, etc. for each instrument and voice, etc. Now I'm trying out the plug ins I believe I'll need (compressor, eq, reverb). I used the compressor fine but when I tried the reverb (dverb) included with the le, it sounded ok when I previewed the settings I had made, but when I hit process and then listened to the track it had lost all kinds of volume. What did I do wrong? Also, in what order would I apply those 3 plug ins. Thank you if anyone can help me.

[MessianicDreams]

I wouldn't AudioSuite anything to be honest, at least not until you start running out of processing power. Your computer should be able to run quite a few tracks with plugins before it runs out of power.

Create a new stereo Aux track. Insert the dverb on this new aux track. Set the input to be, say bus1-2. Then, on your guitar or vocal track (or whatever track you're trying to apply reverb to), create a send to bus 1-2.

[MissyH]

So I have 2 things I did wrong? One is using audiosuite and the other is I didn't know how to do it correctly? If I had used some other reverb (if I could've found it!) would I have run it without making an aux file? I'm sorry to sound so stupid. I HAVE been reading and studying a lot. I think I'm going to buy a book though...Thank you.

[Rusty K]

Using Aux tracks is not always necessary. It depends on how many tracks you are putting plugins on and what your computer can handle. If you are just recording a few tracks and need some verb it's ok to just insert them individually. I don't know why you would have lost vol. during processing though. I've never experienced that problem.

Rusty K

[RD423]

First of all like rusty k said you can just add the dverb to the individual track, using the plug in area (not in front of my protools right now and cant think of the exact name) I never use audiosuite, I do not like processing my waves because once u do that u can never change it after you save the session and come back to it, and what sounds good 2 u 2day might not 2morrow. And to answer the 2nd part of your question is whenever you add dverb it always automatically lowers the volume no matter if u use the plug in area or the audiosuite so all you have 2 do is 2 turn up the volume/raise the fader. One thing to do is in the d verb plugin make sure you adjust the gain from the default which i think is -4db to 0db which means you are turning it up but it will still lower the lvl some so just turn up the volume. Hope this helps

[Joseph Hanna]

Obviously there is no hard and fast rules here. I gotta say however there are some obvious misconceptions being posted.

The first is AudioSuite and how effective it really can be. You should never lose your original track while audiosuiting. You have playlists. Simple select duplicate in your playlist. Now you'll have both the original track AND the track you've processed. It is not any more process intensive and you can always return to the original track in an instant.

Why audiosuite?? The obvious answer is it saves processing power. The most powerful answer however is it still lets me mix above the processing.

For example if I want to compress a vocal. I could insert it and of course there are many situations where this is appropriate. If however I use audiosuite and compress that track the vocal remains static yet compressed. I can now mix over the top of that compressed track without the compressor "pushing" back. A very powerful alternative to insert compression. There are many other revelations that begin to show themselves the further one explores this process.

Further when it comes to inserting time based effects (reverb) as opposed to running them in an aux send and return there are clear differences sonically. When inserting a reverb one is forced to use the mixer section of the reverb itself. In most cases the wet/dry control. The outcome and mix results, where not wrong, is MOST definitely different. In most cases the aux send and return method gives the user far more control even if it's just a few tracks and in the end is not more consumptive than inserting.

[MessianicDreams]

Originally Posted by Joseph Hanna

The most powerful answer however is it still lets me mix above the processing.

For example if I want to compress a vocal. I could insert it and of course there are many situations where this is appropriate. If however I use audiosuite and compress that track the vocal remains static yet compressed. I can now mix over the top of that compressed track without the compressor "pushing" back.

But surely you could sort this out by ordering the plug-ins differently?

If i've understood you correctly, you're saying that the problem with using a comp as an insert is that if you (for example) boost a band on the EQ, the audio will hit the comp harder.

If the compressor is first in the signal chain, then it doesn't matter what you're doing down the line.

[Joseph Hanna]

Originally Posted by MessianicDreams

you're saying that the problem with using a comp as an insert is that if you (for example) boost a band on the EQ, the audio will hit the comp harder.

No no First I would never argue that there is a problem with using a comp as an insert. It is what it is and can be very effective when used in that manner. Audio 101.

More than that my example was offered in an attempt to illustrate how powerful audiosuite can be as I saw a trend here to simply dismiss it.

Originally Posted by MessianicDreams

If the compressor is first in the signal chain, then it doesn't matter what you're doing down the line.

Yes obviously that is the case. My point was more from a gain perspective than adding EQ. I can for example compress (audiosuite) a vocal region and still remain free to automate the vocal line (volume) without hitting the compressor any harder. Parallel compression is very trendy right now and certainly this technique has some of those element contained. It is a very effective tool and only one of MANY that is provided with audiosuite

And yes if a compressor is first in the audio chain obviously anything downstream wouldn't affect the compressor.

[MessianicDreams]

Originally Posted by Joseph Hanna

My point was more from a gain perspective than adding EQ. I can for example compress (audiosuite) a vocal region and still remain free to automate the vocal line (volume) without hitting the compressor any harder.

Maybe I'm still looking at this from the wrong angle but...aren't the inserts pre-fader in PT?

[Joseph Hanna]

Originally Posted by MessianicDreams

Maybe I'm still looking at this from the wrong angle but...aren't the inserts pre-fader in PT?

Well yes...but in my world (which is post) I might have 20 stereo tracks of music and 75 tracks of SOT and VO. That would require more plug-in's than my system would allow.

Further and more importantly "on set" audio guys are notoriously bad technique wise. Dialog often starts hideously loud and trails to nothing. By breaking down separate dialog lines into regions it allows me to address each phrase (and often each word) with different compressor parameters. I guess one could argue that automating the compressor parameters would be possible that still would be more time consuming and would presuppose my system could handle 100 Massey 2007's.

That said and again my attempt was to merely point out that audiosuite is a powerful tool if you let it work for you.

[MessianicDreams]

Ah, I see where you're coming from now. Makes sense! I had no idea some of the post work was so in depth!

interesting stuff!!

[MissyH]

Thanks, everyone. I was having trouble understanding about aux inputs sooo I decided I needed to read some more. I had read evrything I had so I checked amazon and bought a book - Pro Tools for Musicians and Songwriters by Gina Fant-Saez. It has been invaluable since I AM coming at this as a musician. The book now has little post-its stuck all down the side and has helped me regain some semblance of sanity.
I have nothing to do with the book-I just thought someone else might be where I am.