The gear I have - The tone I want - Need Suggestions!

[soundchaser59]

Here is the gear I have to work with:

5.25 Express with alnico speaker.
MIA Strat, Noiseless pickups.
BBE Boosta Grande (20db clean boost).
EHX Black Finger tube compressor.
Boss CS-3 compressor.
Voodoo Lab Sparkle Drive.
Boss Chorus and Phaser.
MXR 10 band EQ.
various alnico speaker cabs.




Here is the type of sound/tone I am trying to imitate:

The lead sound I'm after!




The guy in the clip is using a Brown Note amp, among other nice toys.......


Looking for suggestions on how to utilize my gear to get that sound! Any clues?

[Rokket]

What I'm about to say may come off as smartass, so please don't take it that way:

If you want his tone, you have to use his gear.

Plus, most of a guitarists' tone is in his hands.

Barring all that, get yourself an amp sim and see what you can do.

Sorry I can't be more helpful.

[guitar zero]

That's a classic Joe Satriani type lead guitar sound. Have you tried googling him to find out if there's some articles on the net about the gear he's using.

I did that when I was trying to find out what amp Knopfler was using. Turns out he really likes some boutique amp made in Washington somewhere. Forget the name now, but I remember it was out of my price range.

[Rokket]

Sorry about my previous post. I was going off what you had written because this stupid server that I am on will not let me download or upload anything (gov't pc, middle of the Pacific Ocean; life sucks as a merchant seaman)...

But if it is Satriani-type tone you are looking for, his rig is all effects processors. He plays mostly Ibanez guitars that they build for him, and he only has a volume knob because it's all about the effects. You will need some sort of guitar processor in your rig to comp that. Especially something with auto-wah... I don't know if you can get close with what you have listed.

Check this out:

Jim Dunlop 535Q wah pedal
- Boss DS-1 Distortion
- Fulltone Ultimate Octave
- DigiTech Whammy Pedal
- Boss OC-2 Dual Octave
- PS-5 Super Shifter Pedal
- Boss BF-3 Flanger
- Boss Super Chorus
- Boss DD-2 Delay
- Chandler Digital Delay
- Marshall 6100 Anniversary Head
- Marshall 4x12 (Celestion 25W)

Got this off a site that lists his rig setup.

Here is the link

[soundchaser59]

Originally Posted by Rokket

Sorry about my previous post. I was going off what you had written because this stupid server that I am on will not let me download or upload anything (gov't pc, middle of the Pacific Ocean; life sucks as a merchant seaman)...

But if it is Satriani-type tone you are looking for, his rig is all effects processors. He plays mostly Ibanez guitars that they build for him, and he only has a volume knob because it's all about the effects. You will need some sort of guitar processor in your rig to comp that. Especially something with auto-wah... I don't know if you can get close with what you have listed.

Check this out:

Jim Dunlop 535Q wah pedal
- Boss DS-1 Distortion
- Fulltone Ultimate Octave
- DigiTech Whammy Pedal
- Boss OC-2 Dual Octave
- PS-5 Super Shifter Pedal
- Boss BF-3 Flanger
- Boss Super Chorus
- Boss DD-2 Delay
- Chandler Digital Delay
- Marshall 6100 Anniversary Head
- Marshall 4x12 (Celestion 25W)

Got this off a site that lists his rig setup.

Here is the link

Your first reply was actually closer to the mark. My post may be misleading because the guy is not really using a bunch of other cool toys.

The guy in the sound clip is playing a guitar plugged directly into the Brown Note amp.......no fx, no pedals, no modelers, no processing, no fx loop, nothing but axe + amp. Their claim to fame is getting that sound directly from the amp. It's kinda hard to decipher the web page, so it's possible a really clean overdrive pedal is involved, but nothing more.

So that is the point of my question, I guess.........do I have to use the same amp? Or can I get close with what I have? Those are $3000-4000 dollar amps. Be a long time before I have that kind of sawbuck....

[famous beagle]

I don't know what Brown Note model he's using, but that, to me, sounds like power tube overdrive --- like a single channel amp being turned up enough so the power tubes are distorting.

I think you could get very close to that kind of a tone with a Deluxe Reverb cranked. I don't know if you're very handy with amp mods, but there are several ways you could get a great-sounding DR that's pretty affordable too.

Method 1: Get a silverface in decent condition, and perform a few simple mods to convert it to blackfaced specs.

Method 2: Get a used Deluxe Reverb reissue, and perform a few mods to get it sounding really good, such as a a new transformer, new speaker, and new caps.


Either method shouldn't run you too much over a grand, if that.

Robben Ford plays Dumbles, which are pretty much the "holy grail" amp, and even he's said in an interview that the best tone he usually gets is a Tele through a dimed BF Deluxe Reverb.

Lower wattage tube amps (like, 25 and below) make it pretty easy to get really close to that Larry Carlton, Robben Ford type of tone, and they're not deafening either, yet they're plenty loud enough to gig with.

Now ... regarding your original question on how to use the gear you have to get that tone, I'm afraid I'm not at all familiar with that Boogie model. But the tone on that clip sounds to me just like a cranked single-channel amp.

(I don't think it sounds much like Joe Satriani at all. It sounds much closer to the Carlton/Ford type of tone, except maybe with a little less top-end sparkle and bite.)

[guitar zero]

Originally Posted by famous beagle

(I don't think it sounds much like Joe Satriani at all. It sounds much closer to the Carlton/Ford type of tone, except maybe with a little less top-end sparkle and bite.)

Yeah, most of Satriani's stuff is more distorted, but some like 'Starry Night' come pretty close to the sound on the clip. I agree, Larry Carlton may be a better example.

[JCH]

What kind of guitar is being played on the clip? It doesn't sound like a strat.

[eyema_believer]

Originally Posted by JCH

What kind of guitar is being played on the clip? It doesn't sound like a strat.

Yep.... sounds like double coils. And don't forget the sound you are hearing is miced, and in a mix with processing etc.... it's not just a guitar and amp you are hearing... so really, the only way to compare his rig to yours is to play them side by side.... I think you should be able to get a great sound out of that gear you have!! Actually, a better sound probably. You have sweet sweet gear, my friend. What's your address?? I'll come twist knobs while you play!!

Peace!

~Shawn

[soundchaser59]

Originally Posted by JCH

What kind of guitar is being played on the clip? It doesn't sound like a strat.

Hofner V is all I have to go on.......

[soundchaser59]

Originally Posted by eyema_believer

it's not just a guitar and amp you are hearing...

They claim it is.....guitar plugged into the Brown Note amp, no pedals, no fx, no processing, but yes it is "in the mix".....

But they claim that is the sound you get with just the guitar and the amp.

[Moonrider]

Originally Posted by soundchaser59

They claim it is.....guitar plugged into the Brown Note amp, no pedals, no fx, no processing, but yes it is "in the mix".....

But they claim that is the sound you get with just the guitar and the amp.

The advice I'll give to any guitar player is to dump the effects pedals into storage for six months. Figure out just what you CAN do with nothing but the volume and tone knobs on your guitar and amp.

Most people get so caught up with what they CAN'T do without effects pedals that they never take the time to explore what they CAN do without them.

[JCH]

Originally Posted by soundchaser59

Hofner V is all I have to go on.......

Hofner used some pretty bizzare pickups on many of those guitars at that time. None of them had any similarity to a stratocaster pickup. Due to design most of them would have a rather unique tone. Trying to emulate that with a strat could be pretty difficult.

You've got some nice gear. Getting an acceptable tone for that style shouldn't be too hard. Personally I didn't care much for the tone on the clip. I like a little more presence in the upper range, and there's not much bottom end at all.

If you like your Fender noiseless pickups thats great, but they aren't very high on my list. Sure they're quiet, but you give up a lot of the character, and vibe that make a strat sound like a strat. If you ditch all, or most of the effects in your signal chain like Moonrider suggested, and add some good shielding you'll probably discover that the original strat pickups aren't all that noisy. The first thing I want my guitar signal to see is the grid of 12AX7.

beagle's right about the amp tone. That sounds like power tube saturation. Check into an attenuator.

[soundchaser59]

Originally Posted by JCH

beagle's right about the amp tone. That sounds like power tube saturation. Check into an attenuator.

I agree also. I got really close to that type of tone and feel when I had a Subway Rocket. I dimed the clean channel, and there it was, sounded just like Duane Allman. (the amp had issues and had to go)

Done the attenuator thing already, it ruined my tone all the way around. You dont realize what it's doing to the tone until you use it for 6 months, then one day take it out and crank up the amp. Cant do that again, sold the thing.......then I bought the Mesa!

[famous beagle]

Originally Posted by soundchaser59

I agree also. I got really close to that type of tone and feel when I had a Subway Rocket. I dimed the clean channel, and there it was, sounded just like Duane Allman. (the amp had issues and had to go)

Done the attenuator thing already, it ruined my tone all the way around. You dont realize what it's doing to the tone until you use it for 6 months, then one day take it out and crank up the amp. Cant do that again, sold the thing.......then I bought the Mesa!

That's why I was suggesting a low wattage amp like an 18 or 20 watt. You can dime them without peeling the paint off the walls, but it's still loud enough to gig with.

[eyema_believer]

Originally Posted by soundchaser59

I agree also. I got really close to that type of tone and feel when I had a Subway Rocket. I dimed the clean channel, and there it was, sounded just like Duane Allman. (the amp had issues and had to go)

Done the attenuator thing already, it ruined my tone all the way around. You dont realize what it's doing to the tone until you use it for 6 months, then one day take it out and crank up the amp. Cant do that again, sold the thing.......then I bought the Mesa!

I've been getting a great tone out of my Express 5:25 with a simple compressor up in front.... try the clean channel on 25w mode, with the compressor gain pumped up until the thing starts to really sing.... I'll see if I can get a clip of mine tonight for you.

~Shawn

[Thurgood]

I hate to be the one who says larry carlton but....... sounds like old school boogie sound big midrange peak hefty amount of gain. Crap for chords but otherwise. You have some cool gear. try the eq in the effects loop.

[famous beagle]

Originally Posted by Thurgood

I hate to be the one who says larry carlton but....... sounds like old school boogie sound big midrange peak hefty amount of gain. Crap for chords but otherwise. You have some cool gear. try the eq in the effects loop.

The Carlton sound is a Dumble, not a Boogie.

[Thurgood]

Cool beagle. When I visited with him (before a show) he was using Dumble amps. Nonetheless, and a object lesson to a budding gttr'ist at the time I cop'd a pretty good "clone" of his tone witha Mark 3. Just an observation. I do believe that the tone presented sounds a bit like a small amp, compressor and eq after preamp section. Ahh, the quest for tone. Be well all.

[famous beagle]

Originally Posted by Thurgood

Cool beagle. When I visited with him (before a show) he was using Dumble amps. Nonetheless, and a object lesson to a budding gttr'ist at the time I cop'd a pretty good "clone" of his tone witha Mark 3. Just an observation. I do believe that the tone presented sounds a bit like a small amp, compressor and eq after preamp section. Ahh, the quest for tone. Be well all.

Yes tone is good.

[Thurgood]

yep. in my humble opinion a mid boost and mild overdrive may work. Not sure. does sound like small spkr. but eq could account for that. Options?? Always searching for cool stuff.

[eyema_believer]

I checked the guys web site, and the clip you've posted indicates he's using a zendrive in front of the amp.

Here's a little something I threw together tonight with my Express 5:25, with a Behringer CS100 compressor in fron of it, which is a clone of the Boss CS3. This is the clean channel, on 25w mode. It doesn't nail the tone exactly, but I think I could get closer if I wanted.

http://www.box.net/shared/static/mssx1w9wkg.mp3

Whaddya think??

Peace!

~Shawn

[famous beagle]

Originally Posted by eyema_believer

I checked the guys web site, and the clip you've posted indicates he's using a zendrive in front of the amp.

Here's a little something I threw together tonight with my Express 5:25, with a Behringer CS100 compressor in fron of it, which is a clone of the Boss CS3. This is the clean channel, on 25w mode. It doesn't nail the tone exactly, but I think I could get closer if I wanted.

http://www.box.net/shared/static/mssx1w9wkg.mp3

Whaddya think??

Peace!

~Shawn

Yeah sounds pretty close. Great playing too! That's a big part of it, the touch.

[soundchaser59]

Sounds pretty good! What did you use more specifically? Amp settings?

I'll experiment with whatever you give me....

Yeah!! Great guitar riffs! Nice stuff! Thanks!

[eyema_believer]

Originally Posted by soundchaser59

Sounds pretty good! What did you use more specifically? Amp settings?

I'll experiment with whatever you give me....

Yeah!! Great guitar riffs! Nice stuff! Thanks!

Hey thanks!

OK!
This was the clean channel, and the amp was set on 25w. The contour was off, the reverb was off. The compressor is a clone of the Boss CS3 you own. I do not know how close it is to the CS3, but the controls are the same, and I've heard people say that Behringer uses the same components as the boxes that they clone. I used my home-built Tele, but I plugged my Strat in, and it sounded basically the same, except a little thinner. I would have used it to record this, but my hand cramps after a few minutes of playing lead on it, because the silly neck is so thin compared to my custom Tele. This was miced with an SM57, and compressed a tad more in my DAW with my Waves API 2500 compressor, and then some reverb and 2-tap delay added in the DAW as well. The poor pics taken with my phone should suffice to show my settings

Peace, and let me know how it comes out!

~Shawn