bad recording rescue

[chinglnc]

Hi Guys,

I desparately need some helps here, I'd done recording for some amateur band, musically is not good, sound/tone wise is not good, and this is something that beyond my control, but I really want the mixing part to be as good as possible.... is there any place in this site that I could upload the mix so that I can get some guidance how to rescue the mix?

Problems- Drums and Bass are not tight, tone doesn't sound right, and the timing is pretty out as well
Guitars- tones wise arent brilliant, I layered a couple of tracks, however, it was played "differently" each time (different timing, tones), make it extremely hard to mix

Please help

[Farview]

Well, there is the mp3 clinic forum here.

But, if it is as you describe, there won't be much you can do. It's kind of like saying "I have 4 pieces of construction paper, Elmers School glue, assorted rocks, and a dead squirrel. I want to build a formula-one race car, can anyone offer any suggestions on how to go about this the right way?"

You can't fix everything in the mix, there are no miracles. If you start out with complete crap, the only thing you can possibly end up with is less annoying complete crap.

It would be faster, easier, and smarter to start over again and pay attention to the tones and the performance.

The performance is the biggest part of it. A marginal recording of a brilliant performance will win out over a great recording of a marginal performance.

[roflcopter]

Originally Posted by Farview

A marginal recording of a brilliant performance will win out over a great recording of a marginal performance.

this is a very good point. i'd never looked at it like that before.

[chinglnc]

there is no way to re-record it again.....

but I'm aware that some experience engineers are able to "tranform" a bad recording into a good one..

wondering is it more like skills wise or equipment or plug in?

i need to rescuse especially the drums, bass and electric guitars..

[Farview]

Originally Posted by chinglnc

but I'm aware that some experience engineers are able to "tranform" a bad recording into a good one

That is somewhat of an overblown myth.

Yes, you can edit drum parts so they are in time. However, it become nearly impossible to do if the part wasn't performed to a metronome in the first place. You also have the problem of the other instruments being recorded with/to the crap drum part. If you fix the drums, the other instruments are still playing along with the non-fixed drums. So, at this stage of the game, you can't really fix the drum performance.

You can replace the drum sounds with samples, but it will just be a crap performance with shiny samples. Drumagog does this the best, assuming you have a separate mic for every drum.

Again, you can try to edit the guitar parts so they are in time with the drums, but without a grid for reference this will be almost impossible. Also, if this was a live performance and you have drums bleeding into the guitar mics, you can't edit the guitars because the drum bleed won't line up with the drums anymore.

You can try to EQ and compress the guitars into something, but there isn't any magic that's going to make it sound great. Most of what makes a guitar sound bad is the player using the wrong type or wrong amount of distortion. There is nothing you can do about that after the fact.

With Bass again, it's EQ and compression.

When someone talks about rescueing a crappy mix, there had to be something about the recording that wasn't screwed up that made it worth turning into something. What you have is a bad performance with bad sounds recorded badly. There is nothing to work with.

[chinglnc]

btw...the file has been uploaded here..

any advice?

http://www.sendspace.com/file/dkpq8o

[chinglnc]

Originally Posted by Farview

That is somewhat of an overblown myth.

Yes, you can edit drum parts so they are in time. However, it become nearly impossible to do if the part wasn't performed to a metronome in the first place. You also have the problem of the other instruments being recorded with/to the crap drum part. If you fix the drums, the other instruments are still playing along with the non-fixed drums. So, at this stage of the game, you can't really fix the drum performance.

You can replace the drum sounds with samples, but it will just be a crap performance with shiny samples. Drumagog does this the best, assuming you have a separate mic for every drum.

Again, you can try to edit the guitar parts so they are in time with the drums, but without a grid for reference this will be almost impossible. Also, if this was a live performance and you have drums bleeding into the guitar mics, you can't edit the guitars because the drum bleed won't line up with the drums anymore.

You can try to EQ and compress the guitars into something, but there isn't any magic that's going to make it sound great. Most of what makes a guitar sound bad is the player using the wrong type or wrong amount of distortion. There is nothing you can do about that after the fact.

With Bass again, it's EQ and compression.

When someone talks about rescueing a crappy mix, there had to be something about the recording that wasn't screwed up that made it worth turning into something. What you have is a bad performance with bad sounds recorded badly. There is nothing to work with.

you were right, the performer has chosen the wrong sound....I had compressed/eq a lot to cut the uneccesary noise/sound.. but still...arrghh...

the original sounded much worst than this mix...

what can I do next??my pc is running out of cpu power due to over-used of compressors and eqs in each tracks!!

[kubeek]

I think that low passing everything that can stand it, dipping some of the lows, and some serious eq to overheads/cymbal mics can help a lot.

About the cpu, you could freeze the tracks that are nearly done, and maybe get later to them.

[chinglnc]

Originally Posted by kubeek

I think that low passing everything that can stand it, dipping some of the lows, and some serious eq to overheads/cymbal mics can help a lot.

About the cpu, you could freeze the tracks that are nearly done, and maybe get later to them.

yeah..i had freezed most of my audios and yet not really into mixing stage yet....i used quite a lot of eq and compressor just to cut down the unwanted rumbling noise....

what should i do for the overheads/cymbals? boost high/mid/low or ?

[Farview]

That really isn't that bad.

Guitars: Put the midrange of the guitars back. Use a low cut at around 150hz. Turn off the compression.

Bass: Add some 800hz to offset the low end. Add some compression after the EQ at about 3/1 and set it so you get about 3db into the reduction.

Kick: Add 9db of high shelf at 8k. Take out 9db of 800hz with a medium bandwidth. Compress after the EQ at 4/1 about 4db into the reduction with a medium attack and fast release.

Snare: Add 200hz, 2khz, and high shelf at 10k. Compress after EQ at 4/1 medium attack and fast release.

Overheads: high pass filter at 300hz and add some high shelf at 6k

Toms: Add 100hz and 3k. Suck out 500hz.

See where that gets you.

[D_Vincent]

Not sure if this free plugin will help the guitar tracks however its worth a try...I downloaded it the other day and it seems to be helping my guitar tracks.

SimulAnalog Guitar Suite plugin includes...

- Boss DS-1 (Distortion stompbox)
- Boss SD-1 (Super Overdrive stompbox)
- Tube Screamer (Overdrive stompbox)
- Oberheim PS-1 (Phaser stompbox)
- Univox Univibe (Modulations stompbox)
- Fender Twin 1969 (Guitar amplifier)
- Marshall JCM900 Dual Reverb (Guitar amplifier)

Download here
http://www.simulanalog.org/guitarsuite.htm

Sounds better than I thought it would.

Everything sounds really, really dull though. Vocals are too far back also. Mix isn't bad.

I think there is room for improvement and you can get a much better sounding mix with some EQ.

Looks like Farview gave you a good starting point...

[chinglnc]

hi guys,

Thanks a lot for the advice.

I did a bit changes and now it sounds like this .....

http://www.sendspace.com/file/j7w487

but there is this little cliches/noise in the guitars....i tried to eliminate it by eq and compressor....but it will affect the overall sound of the guitar...

any idea how to retain the guitar sounds and get rid of the noise?

[Farview]

I'm not sure what you are refering to about the noise in the guitars. That's pretty much what that sort of guitar sound is like.

Did you close mic the guitars? They sound pretty far away.

[chinglnc]

if you listening by headphones...you could actually hear the little little "noise" floating around.........

I used SM57 for the close mics, and Neuman slightly further away.....

hmm..perhaps i should boost the level for SM57 instead of Neuman......

[Farview]

Don't worry about the little noise. Yes, use the 57 to get the guitar sound and add the Neumann in later for a little ambience. (and I mean a little)