mic a snare

[rogernumber2]

I use protools 7.3 and have the mbox2 and I try to record a snare drum by itself and it sounds really muzzled and muted.

I just put the mic(SM 57) right up close.

what am I missing?

[Lo-Fi Mike]

Originally Posted by rogernumber2

I use protools 7.3 and have the mbox2 and I try to record a snare drum by itself and it sounds really muzzled and muted.

I just put the mic(SM 57) right up close.

what am I missing?

try backing it up a bit,
do you have another mic? (double mic the snare, top/bottom reversing phase)

once you get it in the box add a little eq, reverb, and comp. well that's what i normally do, but I'm not sure of what you are trying to do with a lone snare recording.

[Elton Bear]

Room? Tuning? Up close where???

[MidiPunk]

I'd use a condenser 24" above in non-kit situations and given info.

[rogernumber2]

just an average room in the house.

I'm doing sort of a marching band thing/ patriot music with it.

I've tried to compress it but what makes it sound best is to turn the gain all the way up and when it sounds good it clips out big time.

[rogernumber2]

Originally Posted by MidiPunk

I'd use a condenser 24" above in non-kit situations and given info.

are you saying use the mic the vocals are generally used for(the blue baby bottle I have)

[rogernumber2]

Originally Posted by Elton Bear

Room? Tuning? Up close where???

I've tried putting it all over the snare.

tuning? not sure what you're talking about

[Lo-Fi Mike]

Originally Posted by rogernumber2

I've tried to compress it but what makes it sound best is to turn the gain all the way up and when it sounds good it clips out big time.

compression will allow you to turn up the make up gain with out clipping (if you are using it right)

[charger]

If you're going for a marching band sound, you probably want to mic the bottom head as well as the top head so you can mix in more of the "snare" sound. backing up the 57 on top and using a bottom snare mic will probably give you a sound more representative of your actual snare. Throw whatever other mic you have on the bottom, then flip the phase on it.

Compressing the snare drum is probably something you should do as well, but it's a long topic. The search function is your friend.

[Gherkin]

Originally Posted by rogernumber2

I've tried putting it all over the snare.

tuning? not sure what you're talking about

Does the snare sound good/how you want it to sound when you play it?

[MidiPunk]

Originally Posted by rogernumber2

are you saying use the mic the vocals are generally used for(the blue baby bottle I have)

Yes, your best most expensive mic if I'm reading between the lines correctly. Experiment with the snare in different rooms, garage for example with harsh floor versus bedroom with soft floor. I say 24" because it's close enough to catch all the snare, yet far enough way to grab some ambiance.

I'm an absolute novice, so take anything I say with a grain of stuff.

[rogernumber2]

Originally Posted by MidiPunk

Yes, your best most expensive mic if I'm reading between the lines correctly. Experiment with the snare in different rooms, garage for example with harsh floor versus bedroom with soft floor. I say 24" because it's close enough to catch all the snare, yet far enough way to grab some ambiance.

I'm an absolute novice, so take anything I say with a grain of stuff.

why did I buy the SM 57 then? I was told that it was for instruments and the baby bottle was for vocals?

[rogernumber2]

Originally Posted by charger

If you're going for a marching band sound, you probably want to mic the bottom head as well as the top head so you can mix in more of the "snare" sound. backing up the 57 on top and using a bottom snare mic will probably give you a sound more representative of your actual snare. Throw whatever other mic you have on the bottom, then flip the phase on it.

Compressing the snare drum is probably something you should do as well, but it's a long topic. The search function is your friend.

can you explain what flip the phase means?

[fivesixonesk8er]

Originally Posted by rogernumber2

can you explain what flip the phase means?

Phase is a time relationship between two sounds. When the time relationship is coincident, the two sounds are "in phase." When the time relationship is not coincident, they are "out of phase" and their amplitudes are subtractive, and your outcome will sound dead and hollow. Flipping The Phase will solve that relationship between the two waveforms to create a nice ample sound.

In some programs it is called "Invert" (Such as Logic). Make sure if you do mic the bottom snare to only "Flip The Phase" on the bottom snare mic.

[timthetortoise]

Almost no microphones have one specific use. Condenser microphones (like the Blue) are good for picking up audio sources that require a lot of detail, which makes them good for overhead microphones on drums. Dynamic microphones (like the SM57) are good all-purpose microphones. Most people will use a SM57 or some other dynamic mic on the snare because it can handle higher levels and has a better tone for a snare sound. However, you can pretty much use any mic on anything (assuming the source you're using it on has no potential to damage the mic (example: using a ribbon microphone on a kick drum)).

[RAMI]

Originally Posted by rogernumber2

tuning? not sure what you're talking about

This might be part of the problem.

If you don't understand what someone means by "tuning" when reffering to drums, then people can spend the next 100 posts telling you what mic to use and exactly where to put it (though, I have no idea how people can even offer that kind of advice without being there) and it still won't help you.

[rogernumber2]

OK I know what tuning is. I'm not really a drummer but I do have rhythm and I can do it. I like how the drum is tuned now. Whether or not it is the proper way to tune it: don't know and not too concerned.

I was reading some other posts and I think what is missing is a preamp.

Do you guys think that is the case? I just plug the mic into my MBox2 interface, currently.

[RAMI]

Originally Posted by rogernumber2

OK I know what tuning is. I'm not really a drummer but I do have rhythm and I can do it. I like how the drum is tuned now. Whether or not it is the proper way to tune it: don't know and not too concerned.

Well, if you don't know and you're not too concerned, don't expect to ever be happy with the sound. All the pre-amps in the world won't help you if you're "not concerned" with how the drum is tuned. That IS your source.

The one thing you're "Not concerned" with is the most important part of your sound. You asked for advice, but it seems you only want to believe that some magical piece of equipment will save you from a im-properly tuned drum.


Learn how to tune it. Period.

[Greg_L]

Lol. The Mbox interface is the pre-amp. The pre's are built-in.

You can't half-ass drum recordings. Period. Getting a good recorded drum sound is not eay to do. Also, sticking 2 mic's on a snare is a nice luxury to have, but by no means is it necessary. If you can't get a decent sound with one mic, adding another will most likely blow your mind.

Bottom line - you have to experiment. Minute changes yield different results. Mic positioning, angle, distance, etc all plays a part in finding the sound you want. Listen to the vast variety of recorded snare sounds out there on CD's and stuff. They're all different. First thing you do is learn how to tune a snare and get it sounding how you like it. The diamter, depth, shell type, and heads all play a role in how it's gonna sound. Get whatever you have sounding the best you can. Then once you have that, you can start the tedious process of finding the sweet-spot for the mic. You must experiment. Only you can find the right combination of snare sound and mic placement. We can't tell you what to do. If this is too much for you, go buy a drum machine.

[Rimshot]

Originally Posted by Greg_L

Lol. The Mbox interface is the pre-amp. The pre's are built-in.

You can't half-ass drum recordings. Period. Getting a good recorded drum sound is not eay to do. Also, sticking 2 mic's on a snare is a nice luxury to have, but by no means is it necessary. If you can't get a decent sound with one mic, adding another will most likely blow your mind.

Bottom line - you have to experiment. Minute changes yield different results. Mic positioning, angle, distance, etc all plays a part in finding the sound you want. Listen to the vast variety of recorded snare sounds out there on CD's and stuff. They're all different. First thing you do is learn how to tune a snare and get it sounding how you like it. The diamter, depth, shell type, and heads all play a role in how it's gonna sound. Get whatever you have sounding the best you can. Then once you have that, you can start the tedious process of finding the sweet-spot for the mic. You must experiment. Only you can find the right combination of snare sound and mic placement. We can't tell you what to do. If this is too much for you, go buy a drum machine.

When I first started recording, I used overheads, mics on every drum, two on my snare and two on my kick and a room mic as I had been advised to do. I got good enough results but then discovered that it was overkill and all of those mics were unnecessary . I now use
a pair of SDC overheads a good kick mic and a good dynamic on my snare. I play a 6 piece kit with 4 cymbals and hats and I am getting as good results with this simple set-up as I did with all of those mics. That's 4 mics instead of 11.

[Lo-Fi Mike]

given all the replies i think this might be your best option.

1) download a drum-trig plugin
2) download what you think is the ideal snare sample
3) record your unsatisfactory snare sound.
4) replace your snare hits via drum-trig.

personally i think you should listen to the comments and give more concern with the actual source sound, but i think you just want some quick fix that will yield an OK result. If so then i think the above will be your best bet.
hear are a few links to get you on your way.

http://www.stormrecordingstudio.co.uk/


this snare sounds good, but they want you to register before you download, there are other sites that will just allow you to download em.
http://freesound.iua.upf.edu/samples...gle.php?id=439

remember to thank and/or donate the creators of all freeware and sample.

[Supercreep]

Originally Posted by rogernumber2

OK I know what tuning is. I'm not really a drummer but I do have rhythm and I can do it. I like how the drum is tuned now. Whether or not it is the proper way to tune it: don't know and not too concerned.

I was reading some other posts and I think what is missing is a preamp.

Do you guys think that is the case? I just plug the mic into my MBox2 interface, currently.

If you aren't concerned, why the hell should anybody else be? Listen to what Rami is telling you. Start at the beginning.

In terms of importance to obtaining a good sound:

1) talent
2) gear
3) room
4) microphone
5) preamp

It's a fool's errand to be worrying about 4) and 5) without addressing 1), 2), and 3) first.

[rogernumber2]

OK the snare is brand new and it sounds great.

what I don't know is why my reason sampled drums are so much louder and clearer than my recording of just a snare by itself with the mic really close (an inch or two away).

why's there no volume?

Obviously, I want it to sound better. Are you saying that adjusting the snare with a drum key is going to take care of this no volume problem?

it seams to me, to be a micing issue or maybe the room. anybody got an info on rooms?

I don't know, you guys are the experts. If you say it's a tuning issue I'll look into it.

[MidiPunk]

Should we assume the level indicator is into the 'yellow zone' while hitting the drum with average hits?

You're trying to record a marching snare with the standard kit snare config, which assumes overheads. This is why I suggested a condenser a couple feet away.

Run "normalize", bring up the volume on the track, etc.

[RAMI]

Originally Posted by rogernumber2

OK the snare is brand new and it sounds great.

what I don't know is why my reason sampled drums are so much louder and clearer than my recording of just a snare by itself with the mic really close (an inch or two away).

why's there no volume?

Obviously, I want it to sound better. Are you saying that adjusting the snare with a drum key is going to take care of this no volume problem?

it seams to me, to be a micing issue or maybe the room. anybody got an info on rooms?

I don't know, you guys are the experts. If you say it's a tuning issue I'll look into it.

So, you're saying it sounds as good as your sampled tracks, but just lower??? So, turn it up. If it really is simply a volume issue.