How long before jumping ship on a tune?

[Ben Logan]

Hey Folks,

Some songs seem to leap right out of my head onto disk, without effort. That's wonderful. Little work, lots of payoff. Other times, I get a little ditty rolling. It sounds promising, but in need of work. I keep editing and polishing. Then I start to despair a bit: "Damn - I've put hours of work into this turd and it still isn't developing the way I want it to."

At what point do you just scrap a tune and move on? Or, do you stay the course until the bitter end, in hopes that your hard work will pay off in the form of a piece that you're satisfied with?

[Whatmysay]

How long is a piece of string?

No real answer for you I know

I write fast and I am also particularly aware of 2nd or 3rd verse discontinuity if I write it at another session – not so worried about middle-8s/bridges as that tend to benefit from going away from the song.

I like to get Ch (maybe pre-chorus) and 2 or 3 (depending on structure) down in first sitting.

I might come back to do a Mid-8 (if needed). Then I leave it all for a day or two and tinker with lyric and phrasing – usually only words, occasionally re-phrase whole line or even meaning. The work is then much more holistic for me and there is great continuity to the writing.

Strangly if I don’t like it I am more inclined to trash one element Vs, Ch, Mid-8 and start again – if that’s not fruitful I then submit it to my inspiration book for future ideas or record the melody/riff/progression for later lyrics – I try not to threw any good ideas out

So my process goes
Play with musical/lyrical ideas (this bit could take 20 years), think about what I want to write about/say until it all coalesce and transform into either Ch or Vs structure (sometimes start out as one then end up as other) then

Session 1: Write Vs and Ch
Session 2: Mid 8/Bridge – work out really big kinks in Vs Ch
A couple of days
Session 3: Refine lyrics – Done
If it is no good at this point I take good sections and save for future inspiration, but it will never really be the same song if they are used in the future.

But this is perhaps the rule but I have plenty of exceptions as well

As for arranging, instrumentation, tempo and recording that is another whole different process.

[mikeh]

I think this is a question that anyone who writes/records faces - and it is much the same problem as trying to decide once the basic rhythem tracks are recorded, how much production is needed, before enough is enough.

One of the most difficult decisions when recording is knowing when to walk away - either because it is not going anywhere - or -because it is "complete".

I can only speak for myself. I know I have a few songs that I think are decent songs when I play them solo on a guitar or piano - but, when I try to "produce them" I simply can't find the right bass line or drum part, etc. How much time I spend trying depends on how much I believe in the song and often may also depend on what other songs/recording projects I'm working on.

When I get to whatever point that I no longer enjoy trying to produce/record the song - or if the time I'm spending is compromising my time to pursue other music projects that deserve or demand my time - I do the following:

I record the song as I originally wrote it (just vocal & guitar or vocal & piano - using a click track for a future reference) and I leave it at that. This way I've captured at least the basic lyrics, melody, harmony and rhythem.

Sometimes, I realize that is exactly the way the song should sound. If nothing else the song is at least partitially recorded - allowing me to come back to it -if and when I choose to.

[up-fiddler]

....to what everyone else is saying but here goes........

I work on a song every day for at least 'a little' bit. It may only be 2 minutes and if it's going nowhere then I move on to something else. But the important thing is I keep going back to the song. At any given time I have 5 or 6 tunes that I am working on in this manner. When a song gets that 'dead letter' feel to it I sing and date it and then put it in my Ideas File which I keep going through the years. (I have mentioned this in previous posts.) When I am at a complete loss I go back into the Ideas File and read through the stuff that never made the cut and the snippets of stuff that I wrote. I never fail to come up with a fresh idea this way. There is always something, even in a song that was a dud, that sparks new ideas and a fresh start. In this way your previous efforts aren't wasted.....they are simply used as catalysts months and years down the road. Good luck with your tune but if needs be, then let it Rest in Peace for awhile.

[Ben Logan]

Whatmysay - your process is complex! I feel lazy by comparison. If the whole shebang doesn't sit well with me in one, maybe two writing session, I tend to just trash the project and start something new. I admire your tenacity.

Mikeh - I like this quote: "One of the most difficult decisions when recording is knowing when to walk away - either because it is not going anywhere - or -because it is "complete"." Some wise geezer said, "A piece is never finished, just stops in an interesting place." Picasso maybe?

Up-fiddler - "When I am at a complete loss I go back into the Ideas File and read through the stuff that never made the cut and the snippets of stuff that I wrote. I never fail to come up with a fresh idea this way" - Funny you should mention this, because I just found an old tune idea on my Loop Station pedal last night. I developed it into a tune I like pretty well, actually. My voice sound like ass as usual, but, nonetheless, yeah, your idea is a good one.