Tape for AKAI MG14D, MG1212, MG1214

[Beck]

Originally Posted by slidey

BUMP!!!!! sorry guys

I'm going nuts trying to find tape for an MG14D &,......well I can't

I read somewhere that it's possible to reload the cartridges with 1/2" 456 tape......

I'd rather get a source of tape cartridges TBH

thanks anyway

I’ve heard about reloading the MK20 cassette with 456, but I’m skeptical. The AKAI MG1212 manual describes the MK20 tape as a special cobalt formulation, which would rule out 456 or any other ferric oxide tape. Cobalt was used in some brands of Type II cassette tapes, and of course Super VHS and ADAT. You might be able to fit 275 ft of 456 inside one of those little MK20 shells (which is what you would need for the specified 20 minutes @ 3.75 ips or 10 minutes @ 7.5 ips) but the bias, levels and EQ would be all wrong. I’m sure the MK20 tape is thinner and more like a short betacam or ADAT tape. The MK20 cassette shell was originally made by Akai for their VT-300 video recorder, but the tape for that was called VK30.

The only place I see the tapes is on eBay now and then.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=320179426610

There was a source in the UK, but I don’t know the name. Send studiodrum a PM… I think he might know.

http://homerecording.com/bbs/private...=newpm&u=25090

[Harvey Gerst]

Maxell "Hi E" 1/2" tape is the tape that is a direct replacement for the MK-20 tape.

If I ever get around to transferring all my MK-20 tapes to DVD's I will have a ton of MK-20's to sell.

[Beck]

Originally Posted by Harvey Gerst

Maxell "Hi E" 1/2" tape is the tape that is a direct replacement for the MK-20 tape.

EE makes sense, but man imagine what 1/2" would cost!

I've been wanting to grab some EE XLII 35-90 1/4" from eBay to try on my Akai GX-77, but I'd have to take out a loan.

[slidey]

WOW thanks for this Beck....

I have a lot of tapes that are 15-20 years in age from when my father used one in the studio between Fostex 8 track 1/4" & Adats

would it be possible to re-use the tape or does the tape degrade in the same way as magnetic???? I must have 40-50 cartridges of the stuff in my cupboard along with magnetic 1/4" reels going back to 1975-ish from my father's studio time & some have come in recently going back to the 40s & 50s.....I digress

& the tape Hi E is pricey huh......

I'm using a fostex R8 & a revox B77 for analogue purposes & I've got the MG14D sitting waiting to be put in a rack & once it goes in I aint taking it out again IT'S WELL HEAVY

[Beck]

Heya Dragon! Where is the post delete feature?

[Beck]

Originally Posted by slidey

WOW thanks for this Beck....

I have a lot of tapes that are 15-20 years in age from when my father used one in the studio between Fostex 8 track 1/4" & Adats

would it be possible to re-use the tape or does the tape degrade in the same way as magnetic???? I must have 40-50 cartridges of the stuff in my cupboard along with magnetic 1/4" reels going back to 1975-ish from my father's studio time & some have come in recently going back to the 40s & 50s.....I digress

& the tape Hi E is pricey huh......

I'm using a fostex R8 & a revox B77 for analogue purposes & I've got the MG14D sitting waiting to be put in a rack & once it goes in I aint taking it out again IT'S WELL HEAVY

What brand are the reel-to-reel tapes? If the reels are Maxell they will be fine. Other brands, maybe or maybe not.

Some SVHS type ADAT tapes are notorious for falling apart, so it depends on the brand there too.

Yeah, the EE Maxell tape is an audiophile favorite on eBay, so it's tough to get for a reasonable price... and the 1/2" EE is nearly impossible to find at any price. It would be easier to find new MK20.

I think it would be worth experimenting with loading some ADAT tape into the MK20 shell.

[Harvey Gerst]

Originally Posted by Beck

What brand are the reel-to-reel tapes? If the reels are Maxell they will be fine. Other brands, maybe or maybe not.

Some SVHS type ADAT tapes are notorious for falling apart, so it depends on the brand there too.

Yeah, the EE Maxell tape is an audiophile favorite on eBay, so it's tough to get for a reasonable price... and the 1/2" EE is nearly impossible to find at any price. It would be easier to find new MK20.

I think it would be worth experimenting with loading some ADAT tape into the MK20 shell.

BAD IDEA!! ADAT tape is designed for digital video - whole different formula than real audio tape, which is what the Akai's need.

[Beck]

This is why I think it's worth a try... ADAT tape is just high quality Super-VHS tape, which is analog. It's magnetic tape with properties that resemble high bias cobalt formulated cassette tape like Maxell XLII-S. IMO, this is really what the Akai is setup for... it's like a giant cassette tape rather than the thicker ferric oxide pro reel tapes. The best quality Pro ADAT tapes are a bit thicker than VHS and have a backcoating. At 200 nWb/m, which is what the MG14D is running, I don't think there will be a problem with print-through.

A VHS, SVHS, or ADAT tape won't hurt the GX heads. The worst that can happen is that it won't do justice to the sound, but then we’ll know that within the span of one tape.

I could be wrong about it matching up, but I’ve heard so many conflicting ideas about this mystery tape in the MK20 shells that I just decided to start with the specs of the machine, the capacity of the shell, and cobalt formulations available at the time, which were all video and Philips audio cassette.

[Harvey Gerst]

Well, originally, Akai had secured the rights from Sony to use the Betamax cassette shell, loaded with EE tape, but just at the last minute, Sony reversed their decision, stating that the Beta shell with audio tape would confuse their customers.

Akai had to make a last minute scramble to come up with a "Beta-like" shell that would fit their machines that were already tooled up to use "Beta" shells.

Yes, you can try the Super VHS, but I don't think you'll like it.

I had this same conversation many times before, when I was Director of Electronics at IMC. IMC was the North American distributor for Akai Pro products.

[slidey]

I couldn't re-use the existing mk20s I have that are creeping up in age....

[Beck]

Originally Posted by slidey

I couldn't re-use the existing mk20s I have that are creeping up in age....

Sure, just get a tape eraser (degausser) if you don't have one. Tape condition will depend on how they've been stored and how much use they've seen. They haven't made those tapes in so long they are all old even if unopened. I haven't heard of any problems with that tape going bad.

I was under the impression that you didn't have any MK20s, old or new.

[Beck]

Originally Posted by Harvey Gerst

Well, originally, Akai had secured the rights from Sony to use the Betamax cassette shell, loaded with EE tape, but just at the last minute, Sony reversed their decision, stating that the Beta shell with audio tape would confuse their customers.

Akai had to make a last minute scramble to come up with a "Beta-like" shell that would fit their machines that were already tooled up to use "Beta" shells.

Yeah, I remember that... they wanted the betamax tape because it was more common. They ended up going with their own video shell from the 70's that was made for their short-lived VT-300 videocassette recorder. It's almost the same size as the betamax shell and uses standard 1/2" (12.5 mm) tape like VHS and beta.

I thought the licensing issue was a typical Sony betamax thing though. It’s my understanding that Akai initially wanted to make the MG1212 compatible with high-grade chrome betacam tape, which was readily available. If they had done that I think the MG would have been around longer. The proprietary tape ended up hurting them in the long run (which wasn’t very long).

Betacam runs at almost the same speed (about 4 ips) as the low speed on the MGs, so it makes sense that a 20-minute betacam cassette, which uses thicker tape, would be a contender.

[Harvey Gerst]

Well, Akai needed 1/2" tape to run the 14 channels the machines used (12 audio + synch + timecode). But video tape is designed for helical scan heads running into the Megacycles, while the Akai's needed 1/2" audio tape running over fixed heads.

[slidey]

Originally Posted by Beck

Sure, just get a tape eraser (degausser) if you don't have one. Tape condition will depend on how they've been stored and how much use they've seen. They haven't made those tapes in so long they are all old even if unopened. I haven't heard of any problems with that tape going bad.

I was under the impression that you didn't have any MK20s, old or new.

sorry crossed wires

I have about 40-50 mk20s that are approximately 15-20 years old

[Beck]

Originally Posted by slidey

sorry crossed wires

I have about 40-50 mk20s that are approximately 15-20 years old

Ah, so you don't need tape... you just need one of these.

[Beck]

Originally Posted by Harvey Gerst

Well, Akai needed 1/2" tape to run the 14 channels the machines used (12 audio + synch + timecode). But video tape is designed for helical scan heads running into the Megacycles, while the Akai's needed 1/2" audio tape running over fixed heads.

Yep, I understand the audio and video head format issue (I started my recording career in TV A/V), but even the stationary audio heads on VHS manage something like 10kHz upper frequency response with the tape dragging along at 1.3 ips NTSC (slower than audio cassette). The Akai MGs can manage 16kHz at low speed (3.75 ips), which is nearly three times the speed of a VCR… and dbx NR takes care of dynamic range. It still seems doable to me with ultra-high grade videotape... but granted I don't know for sure.

[slidey]

Originally Posted by Beck

Ah, so you don't need tape... you just need one of these.

aha & what do I search for?? is that a de-gauser????

looks like an evil little thing that you'd find in early doctor who

[Beck]

Originally Posted by slidey

aha & what do I search for?? is that a de-gauser????

looks like an evil little thing that you'd find in early doctor who

Yep, and every studio should have one. I prefer the handheld ones myself. Look for some like the following on eBay. They all look similar to the one in the photo:

Inmac Data Strike 7180
RCA R60
Magneraser 200
Videoraser VX-1401 and VX-1601

[slidey]

awesome. thanks Beck

[slidey]

not one in UK ebay pages searches for the appropriate now saved with email notification

[slidey]

these wee buggers are almost non existant........