Help me pick a mic, please !

[mattkw80]

The best mic I have had so far is a Behringer B-1. So, it's time for me to step up, and spend some money. I'm looking to spend anywhere from $600 to $1200.

Mic will be used for vocals, guitar cabs, overheads, etc.

Looks like these are my options.... or at least, the mics I know I can buy locally.

Shure KSM44 - $799

Studio Projects T3 - $839

Rode K2 - $699

NT2000 - $599

Blue Baby Bottle - $599



I am leaning towards the KSM44 because it seems to be highly recommended.

Any thoughts?

Any other mics in the price range I should consider ?

[Seanmorse79]

M-Audio Sputnik - $699ish

I did a bunch of homework a few months ago before getting it, and was comparing this to the KSM44 and Baby Bottle, among others.

Since I bought it, I have compared it to the Baby Bottle (friend's) and the Rode (used it at another studio), and I'm glad I got it.

For vocals or overheads (mid/side), it's incredible. I doubt I'd put it on a guitar cab though.

[mattkw80]

Okay.... I'll add that one to my list !

It was better than the KSM44 and Baby Bottle ?

Originally Posted by Seanmorse79

M-Audio Sputnik - $699ish

I did a bunch of homework a few months ago before getting it, and was comparing this to the KSM44 and Baby Bottle, among others.

Since I bought it, I have compared it to the Baby Bottle (friend's) and the Rode (used it at another studio), and I'm glad I got it.

For vocals or overheads (mid/side), it's incredible. I doubt I'd put it on a guitar cab though.

[HeyHeyMyMy]

For that much coin, why not snatch up a used SM7 or RE20, and a nice used AT4050 or something like that?

[virtualvisions]

TLM103s can be had on ebay for around $800-850. Its a pretty versatile mic.

[mattkw80]

I just don't know anything about those mics........ too many options !

I really have no idea how to narrow this down!


Whatever MIC I decide on, has to last me as my main mic for the next 3-5 years.

(I just can't be dropping $600 to $1000 on mics every year)

[Seanmorse79]

Originally Posted by mattkw80

Okay.... I'll add that one to my list !

It was better than the KSM44 and Baby Bottle ?

I didn't get to do an actual comparison with the KSM44, but I did with the Baby Bottle. They're both very smooth, but the Sputnik had more air and detail IMO. That can be both a blessing and a curse.

If you end up seriously considering it, I can post samples.

[Lo-Fi Mike]

Originally Posted by mattkw80

I really have no idea how to narrow this down!

do you want solid state or tube?
what kinda pre's do you have?
what frequency range do you need?
you might wanna consider impedance.


I recommend an MA 200 , if someone told me i could only use one mic to record a session. I would choose the ma 200, it picks up everything very accurately. for audio samples visit there website



--mike--

[jonnyc]

Buy from somewhere that will let you try the mics out and return them. Maybe Mercenary Audio, Front End Audio. You really need to do some work with the mics and listen for what suits your needs best. I've heard the ksm doesn't really shine on anything but does everything well. The baby bottle is a very source specific mic with a lot of midrange, it didn't work for me but could work perfect for you. Try them all if you can.

[xstatic]

I have a few mics for sale in the free ads section. One of the ones I am selling is pretty versatile and upgradable considering the wide range of capsules available for it

[kojdogg]

Originally Posted by Seanmorse79

overheads (mid/side), it's incredible.

if it can do mid/side mic'ing all by itself, then it is indeed an incredible mic

[mattkw80]

I don't know if I should go tube or not.

My pre-amp is an ART TPS2 with variable Impedance setting.

Feequency range? I don't know.... wouldn't I want 20 to 20,000 ?

[kojdogg]

do you need multiple patterns? if you have a good acoustic environment, there are situations where you might want to use omni or some of the in between patterns. if you don't you might be better off starting out with just a good cardioid condenser (i make no secret of my appreciation of the oktavamod mics) or something like the sm7b (which is a dynamic).
the mics you named though and the other ones people have suggested are all fine mics though and i imagine would serve you well. personally i feel like the art tps is a decent pre to start with, but it might be worth getting a nice pre or two to go along with the mic.

[Micter]

If your budget is 1000 or so.....I'd look at an upgrade in the Pre amp as well as something like a K2. You'll end up with much better results in the long run. I have the DPSII which is the same pre with SPDIF outs and it is really good on certain things vocals isn't one of them. I specifically use mine as a keyboard DI and for certain guitar amps. NEVER on vocals. Hope this helps.

[gtr1960]

Not sure what all you are using it for ..but for a good all around mic that can do lots of things including vocal well .. The AKG C414 is a fine mic for most studios.. in fact look around at some pro studios gear lists, and you will see these mics listed quite often. tLM103 is a pretty good mic too.. I a/b'd a bunch of mics for another website all around the 800.00 to 1500.00 range and personally I liked the AKG C414 and the AT 4047 mics for my voice
yours will be different so like post earlier ..go spend some time singing into some mics.. guitar center will let you do this and so will other places.

[jonnyc]

Originally Posted by Micter

If your budget is 1000 or so.....I'd look at an upgrade in the Pre amp as well as something like a K2. You'll end up with much better results in the long run. I have the DPSII which is the same pre with SPDIF outs and it is really good on certain things vocals isn't one of them. I specifically use mine as a keyboard DI and for certain guitar amps. NEVER on vocals. Hope this helps.

Yeah I'd say look for a good used preamp and a good use mic. Some people on this board swear preamps aren't important but they are.

[mattkw80]

Some good advice from everybody, much appreciated !

As far as knobs and switches on the thing, I think I want to keep it real simple.

Maybe a -10 switch and a bass roll off, but as far as selectable patterns, I can do without that - as I would just get confused.

I'm still leaning towards the Shure KSM44, mostly because a friend of mine who owns a studio has done shoot-outs between it, and some other $5000 mics, and says the KSM44 is everybit as good.

For what it's worth, it's even listed in a few "beginner's guides" as the mic you would want to buy, when you enter that "intermediate" level of recording.

The Pre-Amp would be another entirely different ball game for me. Can't spend any more money in that department, as I have not even used the ART TPSII to it's full potential yet.

[soundchaser59]

Originally Posted by mattkw80

The best mic I have had so far is a Behringer B-1. So, it's time for me to step up, and spend some money. I'm looking to spend anywhere from $600 to $1200.

Mic will be used for vocals, guitar cabs, overheads, etc.

Looks like these are my options.... or at least, the mics I know I can buy locally.

Shure KSM44 - $799

Studio Projects T3 - $839

Rode K2 - $699

NT2000 - $599

Blue Baby Bottle - $599



I am leaning towards the KSM44 because it seems to be highly recommended.

Any thoughts?

Any other mics in the price range I should consider ?

Everything that follows is my opinion, nothing more....and nothing less.

The sound you get with a mic is only as good as the best sound you get from your preamp. At the very least, you can make sure you dont put any chinese tubes in your ART preamp. It's not a bad preamp, judging by the spec sheet.

Whomever above said that you should buy from a place that will let you test and return the mic is spot on. The most futile endeavour I've pursued in recent years is trying to compare microphones by listening to sound clips on the internet. Wasted time. The only valid sound clip comparisons are the ones you make yourself using the mics in your studio on your gear, and then playing back the clips side by side on your own monitors. That is the only way you will be able to judge the differences at all. Listening to clips on the web will tell you nothing about what kind of sound YOU will get using those same mics.

The Mojave mic is an awesome American made piece of transducer beauty.

You will never be happy with the sound of a chinese made mic.......unless the only mics you ever try yourself are chinese made mics. The moment you hear side by side compares of tracks made with chinese mics and tracks made with non-chinese mics, you will never (want to) buy another chinese made mic. I understand there are budget forces in control most of the time, but IF money were not a concern, and you could compare any mics your heart desires, I guarantee you would never buy another chinese made mic.

The German and Australian and Austrian mics are good......but imo the American and Japanese mics are better, assuming a comparable price and spec sheet.

Never underestimate the value of a good ribbon mic. For $500-600 bucks you can get a Beyer M130 (I think that's what it is, might be M160?) that will never let you down. Even in the budget category, a $100 dollar ribbon mic like the Apex 210 will always give better results than any $100 dollar dynamic or $100 dollar condensor mic.

If your best mic to date has been a Behringer, then I assume you are recording at home, probably not for money? If so, then you should consider the caliber of your other gear as well. For example, if everything else you have says "Behringer" on it, then it will not benefit you to spend $1200 dollars on a single mic.

Couple that with the fact that no one mic is right for everything (although a few of them come close!) you can do a lot better if you lower your expectations and spend $1200 bucks on 2 or 3 good mics instead of on 1 great mic. Just the fact that you want to use mics as overheads means you should be looking for 2 mics, not 1. Acoustic guitar is better with 2 mics. You can record 2 singers better with 2 mics. etc..... As good as I think the Mojave mics are, if I had $1200 bucks I'd get two $600 dollar mics before I'd buy just one Mojave. (I always have second thoughts when I say that, though! Mojave's are nice!)

Heck, for $1200 bucks you could get two AKG C414's and cover almost any base you want to cover......and you will find a use for multi-pattern if you have it. It isn't that hard, and it adds so much to your sound canvas.

Of course, there are exceptions to every opinion....aint nuthin wrong with having an RE20 or a good old fashioned American made Shure SM7. Cant go wrong with either one of those. I've heard a ton of great things about the Heil PR30 and PR40, but I dont know where they are made. Wont stop me from trying one........ and there aint nuthin wrong with that KSM44 either! Very nice mic!

[kojdogg]

the mojave audio ma-200 is made in china

[mattkw80]

As soon as I head ribbon mic, I instantly think "sensitive mic that I'm probably going to accidentally break".

I've never used one, but always hear about someone breaking one, or frying it etc.

Your "get 2 mics" idea has got me interested.


Some friend's of mind just released an album in which they only used a AKG 3000, and their recording sounds awesome.

As for trying the different mics - that is tough in Canada. We only have one major chain on stores that's large enough to carry that many expensive mics at once. The chain is called "Long and McQuade". The folks that work there are impatient, and extremely unfriendly. (I've been to 4 Long and McQuade stores in Ontario - and this is the attitude in all 4 of them). I walk into a Long and McQuade, and can spend 45 minutes browsing, and not one person will come over and speak to you. Anyway, my point is - I may not have an opportunity to anything before they are ordered, as I am ordering from a smaller store.

I have to base my desicion on the advice from this forum.

[kojdogg]

well, the upside is that if you buy used from a reputable seller on these messageboards or off of ebay, you can try it out and, if you don't like it, you can generally sell it at a minimal loss as long as you've taken good care of it. the loss becomes basically like a rental fee. i've tried well over a dozen mics in the last year and a half or so that way.

[chessrock]

I think it depends mostly on what you're trying to do, and how serious you want to get with this stuff.

If you want a gimmicky, toy microphone that looks kinda' funky, then go with the Baby Bottle.

On the other hand, if you want a cheap, disposable toy mic made in China with a few bells/whistles, then you might consider some of the other ones you were considering.

But then if you actually want a real mic, that will serve as an actual audio tool for serious, real-world audio projects ... then get the ksm44.

.

[mattkw80]

Thanks Chessrock.

I think that settles it.

KSM44 is the most consistantly recommened choice.


Do you own one ?

[pohaku]

Ribbon mics are dynamic mics. A cheap ribbon certainly isn't necessarily any better than a cheap dynamic. If I was building a mic collection, though, a ribbon isn't necessarily where I would start out. I'd pick up a good LD condensor or high quality dynamic for vocals, and a pair of good SD condensors for instruments and overheads.

The KSM44 or AT4050 are very competent mid-range LD condensors that are both multipattern and thus broadly useful. Each has its boosters and detractors, but they are pretty equivalent mics in that they are relatively flat and unhyped. If you have two, they can be used for overheads as well. The AT4050 will be a bit cheaper than the KSM44. Buy used if you can. The AKG C414 is a widely used mic that, IMHO, isn't necessarily any better than the KSM44 or AT4050 (unless you get an older one, but those cost a lot more $$). There are multiple versions of the C414 and they do sound different from each other. An alternate consideration, and what I'd consider to be my desert island mic, is the Shure SM7. This dynamic mic keeps getting picked over much more expensive condensors for vocals in my last projects. Mine got used so much I bought a second one. About $316 new from/through Amazon and $200-225 or so used. Does require a decent preamp though. If you want a better condenser than the AT4050 or the KSM44, I'd look at a used Soundelux U195 or a used Gefell UM70 (or its variants).

There are lots of good choices for SD condensors. If I was going to pick up a pair, I'd look closely at Beyer MC930s (@$765 new for a pair at B&H - hard to find used). I'd also consider AT-4051s (@$250 each used) and Josephson C-42s (@$700 a pair used). Short of getting into Schoeps, Neuman KM84is, or high end Gefells for significantly more money, one of these would do you very well for a very long time.

For about $1000-1100, you should be able to pick up a pair of very good SD condensors and a decent LD condensor or a really good dynamic like an SM7 or RE-20.

If you do want a ribbon, I'd suggest looking at the Beyer M160 or one of the AEA mics (R84 or R92). If you can find a used Beyer M500 for a decent price, it can be a wonderful vocal mic on some voices as well. I've picked up one of the cheaper Chinese ribbons (Avantone CR-14), and while it is an interesting mic that does have its uses, it is still not in the same class as my Beyer or AEA mics. The Peluso ribbon has also had good reviews, but I haven't used one yet. Again, ribbons are very nice, but they aren't where I'd start to build a mic cabinet.

Finally, while having a decent preamp is always a good thing, I don't know that I'd recommend splitting your funds further to buy what would still be, at best, a mid-level preamp. You aren't working with an Audio Buddy currently, and until you are realistically looking at dropping at least $400-500 per channel (with a few exceptions, like a VMP-2 or a Sytek), it is questionable how much "improvement" you will really see. It won't always be the case that you can afford to really upgrade all your components at once. I'd go for the best mics you can afford on this pass and then save until you can get a much better preamp. Buying lower quality mics and a so-so preamp now will just mean that you will be looking to up grade both, again, in short order.

[soundchaser59]

Originally Posted by kojdogg

the mojave audio ma-200 is made in china

Unfortunate.......

the reviews I read last year must have been wrong..... or hyped....

Cant find anything other than forum talk to confirm or deny..... photos would be nice, or a mic in the hand so I coudl see for myself.

The only thing we know for Shure is the Shure says "Made In USA" on it......

Darn it. I'm still liking the KSM44 recommend.