TASCAM 244 insanity!

[cjacek]

This is just a followup to a thread I can't find and thus a new thread!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...7092&rd=1&rd=1

Item number: 200129477092
Seller: jimjersey
Winning bid: US $308.76
Ended: Jul-22-07 18:26:17 PDT
Item location: Mendham, New Jersey, United States
History: 18 bids
Winning bidder: saminbam123( 1 )

[A Reel Person]

..................

[ksounds]

Dave is right. At that price, it's a steal. Especially when you consider what brand new 414 mkII's are retailing for and what the 244 originally retailed for. A never used 244...think about that. Although it's been sitting around for so long it may just blow up once it's plugged in. Don't electronics go bad if they sit around for soo long without being used? A pretty nice one sold for 96+shipping just behind it. At that price, the 244 is HUGE bang for buck.

[cjacek]

Originally Posted by ksounds

Don't electronics go bad if they sit around for soo long without being used?

That's precisely the reason why I said it was too much to pay, especially for a machine going well over that 2 decade mark. I also don't think it's a good idea to compare something like a 414mkII, even a 424mkIII [vs the 244], 'cause they're recent machines. Sure, the 244 was built much, much better and thus yielding a much higher price but it's still a 25 year old machine with aging electronics. Unless it's a museum piece, waiting to be placed behind glass, it's too much to pay, IMHO. Take into account additional shipping and you're approaching 400 bones.

[ksounds]

Good point cjaeck. Those were my instincts, but if it sounds anywhere as good as my 246, and it lasts for only a year, than it would be worth it IMHO. Heart breaking, but worth it.

[ksounds]

Sorry "cjacek"

[cjacek]

Originally Posted by ksounds

Good point cjaeck. Those were my instincts, but if it sounds anywhere as good as my 246, and it lasts for only a year, than it would be worth it IMHO. Heart breaking, but worth it.

Excellent point and keep in mind the 246 was released several years after the 244 so you gain that much more in service life. I talked with TEAC Japan on a few occassions and they told me that the life of capacitors, in the real world, for the TEAC / TASCAM machines is 30 - 40 years but only when a said machine is at least turned on regularly, not used mind you but just turned on. I thus make a habit to power on my gear, those ones which I'm not using, once every week for about 30 minutes. But yeah, if I can get a good 5 - 10 years from my 244 / 246, it's indeed worth it as those are killer machines.

[cjacek]

Originally Posted by ksounds

Sorry "cjacek"

No problem

[A Reel Person]

It shouldn't need any more maintenance than a comparable out-of-box unit, which is maybe a belt,... I said maybe because it's not a foregone conclusion in my mind that it would necessarily need a belt,... and maybe a minor tune-up to calibrate operating levels again. IMO that's not major.

However, I'd not overstate that this machine would need maintenance, because in most likelihood it won't. It will probably come out of the box & wrapper in factory fresh condition. It looks well kept in the bag. The equipment is bulletproof enough to withstand storage for years in moderate conditions. $300 is not overpriced. I'd rather pay $300 on that, than pay $65 for a certified beater.

cjacek, though I understand where you're coming from, I think your reasoning is overstated. I bid on this unit, if that's any indication of where my basic judgment lies. No offense, of course. Some things could wear harshly and deteriorate in storage,... not all things will as a categorical statement. I have many like new items from the 244/246 line that came out of the box like new and needing nothing in the way of repair. You gotta give me a break on the newer-is-better jive talk. Especially from you. BTW, I rememer a guy who got a NIB NOS 34B, and it was fresh as a new spring day.

That 244 likely still has that 'new car smell!'

Your points are well taken, but rather overstated. $300 is not an exhorbitant price for that unit in any comparison, but that's fodder for other posts. What do you want to compare it to? The Pocketstudio 5? The Fostex MR8? The DP-01? A 246 in similar condition?

$308 is not overpriced, for what it is. Take it from me, an Ebay-buying and vintage gear expert! I'd not pull your leg. I'd tell you if it was overpriced.

[cjacek]

You make it sound as if I waged a personal attack on you and your beliefs. I didn't. I merely stated that electronics age, whether in factory packaging or not and that paying over $300 for a 4 track cassette recorder, approaching the 3 decade mark, is too much. This is not an overstatement. I've also changed my mind with regard to many things over the years, through experience. If I were to do it again, I'd do it a bit different. I, for example, would not have bothered with a NOS 34B but would rather have sprang for a brand new unit, even if that meant having less stuff.

[A Reel Person]

I just think fwiw $308 isn't overpriced. I don't see the gloomy outlook on older gear. This one looks like a keeper.

[Wil816]

I talked with TEAC Japan on a few occassions and they told me that the life of capacitors, in the real world, for the TEAC / TASCAM machines is 30 - 40 years but only when a said machine is at least turned on regularly, not used mind you but just turned on. I thus make a habit to power on my gear, those ones which I'm not using, once every week for about 30 minutes.

When I worked at TEAC and repaired about a thousand machines, the only capacitors we ever found bad were power supply capacitors, and that was because they were not derated; IOW, they'd put a 25V capacitor in a 25V application, even pushing the rated ripple current limits, to save space and cost. Most of the small capacitors in the audio circuitry however were at least 25V if not 50V and typically ran with only a quarter of their rated working voltage on them. Those never went out. As for turning the unit on, that does reform the electrolytic capacitors, but even turning it on every few months for a minute or less will accomplish the same purpose. But once the capacitors get really old without use, the voltage must be brought up very slowly before they're ready for business again.

[Dr ZEE]

Originally Posted by A Reel Person

I just think fwiw $308 isn't overpriced.

"think it isn't" and "It isn't" are not the same things, regardless whether thinking is done by an expert or by just a thinker.
It all depends.
I would not by this machine for ten bucks , regardless the condition, well, unless I was shopping for parts , like VU-meters or something. But I would not sell a machine like TEAC A-3340 (just as example) for $1000. But that's just me, I have my preferences, needs, standards, demands and values.
Pricing for old/vintage gear has no objective base, and so nether do thoughts ala "overpriced", "underpriced" , imo.
The sort of "objective meter" is maket "data". One can simply find out how much this or that thing can be sold as for today, based on few random facts of sales that happen to occur during last few months. Those sales all were made based on various subjective factors, so there you have it - your average value price is just as objective as is the taste of a bite out of small bowl of salad that was served out of large can full of random subjective acts, well mixed together.
Speaking of "never used old stock" vintage equipment. The chances are that the winning bidder for such gear is a person who are not looking forward to using it to begin with, but rather is looking forwad to simply having it and occasionally looking at it. Having the one that was never used - that's the sh*t to die for and so paying a good buck for it is no big deal He/she collects. He/she also is an "experts" as well, but of course.
Aren't we all?... occasionally

/later

[A Reel Person]

This being never-used NOS takes it outside of average comparisons.

It was worth whatever the winning bidder paid for it, in objective terms.

[A Reel Person]

Originally Posted by Dr ZEE

The chances are that the winning bidder for such gear is a person who are not looking forward to using it to begin with, but rather is looking forwad to simply having it and occasionally looking at it.

I disagree with this assumption.

[Dr ZEE]

Originally Posted by A Reel Person

It was worth whatever the winning bidder paid for it, in objective terms.

"was" - yes.
"is" - that's a different matter.
**********
Also "having" and "Looking" is a form of using. Depends on who you talk with.

[ksounds]

I like to use the advanced search button on ebay to get a pretty good idea of what the current market value is for anything I might be selling or buying. I think the average price of the completed sales for said gear is going to give you a pretty good idea of what you can expect to buy or sell your item for. If something is mint in box, I think it's fair to say it will fetch considerably more. Hey, just like the tascam 244 we're talking about here. Average used price is around 100 bones plus shipping for one in good condition, one that was NIB went for 300 bones. I also disagree that whoever bought it will just sit there and maybe turn a pan pot every now and then, or maybe move a volume slider. I wanted it. I knew it was going to go for more than I have to spend right now, plus I didn't need it. If I would have had the extra cash, I would have paid what it went for, and you could bet your ass I would be using it. I think the idea of using one of the greatest 4 tracks ever produced, for the first time no less, almost 25 years after it's release, would be quite gratifying. More so than just looking at it. I bet there are many more out there just like me. From the previous post, Dave, I bet , is one of them.

[Dr ZEE]

Originally Posted by ksounds

I also disagree that whoever bought it will just sit there and maybe turn a pan pot every now and then, or maybe move a volume slider.

Right.

Originally Posted by ksounds

If I would have had the extra cash, I would have paid what it went for, and you could bet your ass I would be using it.

That's why you don't have that extra cash to begin with. People who would actually use a highly collectable item commonly can't afford such items.

Vintage NOS items are like virgins after thirty-something. The longer it stays that way less chanses that it will ever happen.
Why is it so? I have no clue. Human nature in all its colors , I guess.
Like, let's see, something like:

Originally Posted by ksounds

I wanted it. ... plus I didn't need it.

that is a sort of thing, I guess
/respects

[cjacek]

Originally Posted by Dr ZEE

Vintage NOS items are like virgins after thirty-something. The longer it stays that way less chanses that it will ever happen.

Hehe LOL!!

[ksounds]

That's why you don't have that extra cash to begin with. People who would actually use a highly collectable item commonly can't afford such items.

We're talking 300 bucks here. It's not the mona lisa. I would hardly call this a highly collectible item. I've made many a purchase where I didn't have the extra cash, but that didn't really matter. In fact, I'm dealing with that dilemma as we speak. If you want something bad enough...I just didn't want it bad enough.
And, I bet my left nut that any woman would give her right tit to have sex with a half way attractive 30 year old virgin male. They would be lining up around the block in fact. Why, cause there just ain't that many of them out there.

[ksounds]

And, I bet my left nut that any woman would give her right tit to have sex with a half way attractive 30 year old virgin male. They would be lining up around the block in fact. Why, cause there just ain't that many of them out there.

Now marriage is a different story.

[cjacek]

LOL! Let's keep it nice and civil, guys!

[SteveM]

Originally Posted by ksounds

And, I bet my left nut that any woman would give her right tit .

Sounds like a pretty fair trade.

[cjacek]

Speaking of "virgins", you guys should check out the movie "The 40 year old virgin", if you haven't already. Bloody good movie!

[Dr ZEE]

Originally Posted by SteveM

Sounds like a pretty fair trade.

heh heh , nice "outa' context cut. good one, LOL
, now, how about this:

any woman would give her right tit to have sex

heh heh heh. speaking of rare things on the "market"
***********

Let's keep it nice and civil, guys!

but what about fun, then ?