Informal Mic Shootout

[zbert]

For lack of anything better to do last night, we did a little shootout with what I have in the mic locker. It's not a very controled shootout but thought I'd post it anyway. The clips are of my friend playing an Ibanez acoustic and singing. Each mic was placed in the same spot and position, about mouth high, to pick up both the guitar and voice. The chain for each mic was the same. A Blue blueberry cable was plugged into a Toft ATC 2 pre. (no compression or EQ was used from the Toft). Next into a Soundcraft Ghost board, all EQ was left flat, then into an Alesis HD24. I tried to keep the recording levels equal. The room is 16' by 25'. Areas are divided up with office cubicle panels. Room is treated with 2'X4'X2" 703 panels. Four as clouds, six on the walls and two in the corners 4"thick. I think the results were interesting. I thought I'd not match the tracks to the mics just to see what opinions I'd get. The mics used (again, not in order)
1) MXL V77S
2) Studio Projects T3 with a JAN 6072a tube
3) AKG 414 U-BLS
4) MXL V67G
5) AT 4040
6) Dave Thomas modded TCM 1100 mic with Peluso CEK-89 capsule, BV-8p transformer. JAN 6072a tube.
7) Oktava 319 Michael Joly premium mod
8) MCA SP1 (cheapo mic)

http://www.babyfishmouthstudios.com/Mic%20Shootout.html

Let me know what you think. I'll post the correct order sometime Saturday.

BTW I'm not as interested if you can match the mic to the track (which is a pretty cool feat if you can) but what sounds best to you.
Thanks

[pezking]

Mic 5 sounds best to me; but I can't really tell you why. Maybe it just sounds more "life like" if you get me.

Will be interested to hear which is which.

[Big Kenny]

I don't know what to wear........

[zbert]

Originally Posted by Big Kenny

I don't know what to wear........

Well, it does say informal so I guess jeans are OK.

[Robertt8]

Originally Posted by zbert

For lack of anything better to do last night, we did a little shootout with what I have in the mic locker. It's not a very controled shootout but thought I'd post it anyway. The clips are of my friend playing an Ibanez acoustic and singing. Each mic was placed in the same spot and position, about mouth high, to pick up both the guitar and voice. The chain for each mic was the same. A Blue blueberry cable was plugged into a Toft ATC 2 pre. (no compression or EQ was used from the Toft). Next into a Soundcraft Ghost board, all EQ was left flat, then into an Alesis HD24. I tried to keep the recording levels equal. The room is 16' by 25'. Areas are divided up with office cubicle panels. Room is treated with 2'X4'X2" 703 panels. Four as clouds, six on the walls and two in the corners 4"thick. I think the results were interesting. I thought I'd not match the tracks to the mics just to see what opinions I'd get. The mics used (again, not in order)
1) MXL V77S
2) Studio Projects T3 with a JAN 6072a tube
3) AKG 414 U-BLS
4) MXL V67G
5) AT 4040
6) Dave Thomas modded TCM 1100 mic with Peluso CEK-89 capsule, BV-8p transformer. JAN 6072a tube.
7) Oktava 319 Michael Joly premium mod
8) MCA SP1 (cheapo mic)

http://www.babyfishmouthstudios.com/Mic%20Shootout.html

Let me know what you think. I'll post the correct order sometime Saturday.

BTW I'm not as interested if you can match the mic to the track (which is a pretty cool feat if you can) but what sounds best to you.
Thanks

Ok, for what it's worth (nothing really) here's what i thought of each track. keep in mind i was listening to them in order, so there's some comparison to previous tracks. it'd be interesting to see what the answers are.

1. sounded sibilant and thin with very little bass end.
2. better than 1, more mid range with little bass end again
3. better balance over all, better fullness with out hyped high end. seems to still be light on low end.
4. very sibilant and hyped high end again, very little low end.
5. sibilant, but better lower mids. still a wicked hiss on the vocals
6. sounded quieter, but flatter than most...nothing seemed overly hyped.
7. a little sibilant, but not bad. fairly full sound and fairly even over all.
8. sounds a little hollow or something. but still kind of full at the same time. probably best low end response to my ears, but a touch of sibilance here and there.

[Caotico]

Originally Posted by zbert

Well, it does say informal so I guess jeans are OK.

business casual

[drossfile]

one-listen opinions from my far-from-golden ears, so take it for what it is...

1. clear but thin
2. harsh and nasty
3. guitar sounds clean, but vox hashy--too close to the singer perhaps?
4. not as hashy as 3, generally more open and airy
5. sounds natural, open, organic. but the guitar is kinda woody/boxy rather than shimmery. maybe use this one for vox and mic #3 for guitar?
6. most rounded, even tone of the lot. warm but not boxy
7. very similar to 6, vox almost sound softly compressed (in a good way). slightly less flattering to the guitar than 6, more flattering to the vox.
8. hashy on vox again, slightly less harsh on the guitar this time though. otherwise more open than the others with the high mid hype.

any chance 6 and 7 were the 2 mics sporting the 6072a tube? if so, i'd say 7 is the tcm and 6 is the sp...and i'd have to assume that 2 is the mca cheapo...figured i'd give it a shot...

[JPXTom]

I like 8's guitar the most...vocals..im not too sure...maybe mic 1?

I didnt like 2 at all.

[Mikey77]

Firstly, thanks for taking the time to post this shootout, it's always helpful in some way even though the process is inevitably flawed in minor ways.

Also I have been wanting to hear the Oktavamod 319, and also the SP-T3 which I guess is also a mod of some kind. Did you do the T3 yourself??? Is it hard to do for a novice??? Is it a big change from the factory mic???

My personal picks were Mics 4 & 8, with 5,7, & 3 runners up. I'm hoping 4 or 8 is the T3. Thanks again and I look forward to finding out which is which.

[giraffe]

yea thanks for taking the time, these things are always neat.

[zbert]

The correct order of mic to track is...
1) Studio Projects T3 with a JAN 6072a tube
2) Oktava 319 Michael Joly premium mod
3) Dave Thomas modded mic with Peluso CEK-89 capsule, BV-8p transformer. JAN 6072a tube.
4) AT 4040
5) MCA SP1 (cheapo mic)
6) MXL V77S
7) AKG 414 U-BLS
8) MXL V67G

Still would like to know your favorite.
Thanks

[drossfile]

7 is my all-around favorite.

[twostone]

Hey cool love the mic shoot out way better then the micpre shoot outs never could tell what micpre's sounded best but at least with the mics you can really tell which mics stands out and which one really sucks. The first mic IMO really sucks I would be ashamed to even record anything with it pretty horrible mic might be good as a prop mic at a live show ya know throw it up in the air beat the shit out of it stomp on it throw against the wall then let the fans rip it to shreds my fav mic was #5 the El cheapo was a definite winner for me the rest I'm sure might could be use for other instruments or whatnots but wanna thank you for taking the time out to share right on my SE bro.

[chessrock]

Interesting to note ... that MCA (#5 cheapo) is basically a Marshall mxl-990 with a different housing / different name.

.

[noisedude]

Number 7 (C414) was the most natural sounding all-rounder, but for a one-mic take it was too dark-sounding overall for my tastes (I like a little more high-end detail in a vocal).

Most of the rest were quite boxy sounding. Number 3 (Dave Thomas hybrid thingy) was my second favourite for the overall sound.

My favourite for vocal sound was number 1 (T3) - which is funny because it didn't exactly shine overall, whether for its faults or for bad placement - there was a little sibilance but otherwise crisp and unnecessary low end rolled off quite naturally. Obviously this is what also robbed the guitar of its sound, but who is ever relying on a one-mic take really?

This illustrates the differences in the sounds we are looking for. Whilst 'twostone' here is not keen on the T3, I recognised in the mp3 the crisp, modern treatment of vocals that I love mine for. Wouldn't often pick it on acoustic guitar though.

[ittam]

Yes, I also liked theThomas mod.
The problem here was the loudness
of the different mic samples being so different
to easyly compare.
Most of the mics had a sibilance problem with this
performer, but every mic expects to be posioned differently
to their full capability.

Matti

[craigmorris74]

The 414 and Dave T mics sounded really good.

[ittam]

And the Oktava wasn´t bad at all for a
different colour; so those 3.

Matti

[chessrock]

Listening mostly at the vocals ...

It's like every one of the mics listed causes me a certain degree of pain and/or discomfort when I go through each sample.

But I'd have to say that the AKG causes me the least amount of pain and/or discomfort ... relatively speaking.

The 4040 almost sounds decent, but it's just a bad match for the voice. It's like most of them are just way too scooped out in the midrange, so the voice never really gets a chance to peak out ... while the 4040 just isn't quite scooped enough. It's almost there, though. The AKG is about the best compromise, and probably about as good as one could expect.

.

[zbert]

Thanks for all the comments. I think this test would have been be better served if each mic was carefully placed for vocal and then guitar. I also think I would have been better off using EQ to make each mic sound as best as it could to the source. I don't think some of the mics sound as good as they usually do under better placement circumstances. Live and learn. If anything I think the V67g is a good deal at $99 new and has a place in your mic locker. The MCA SP1 would be a very good starter mic at $59. I know it has the same capsule as the 990 but this mic sounds better. I'm guessing because of the basket.
I'm glad I was finally able to get the 414. Really is a good souning mic and I can see why it's "an industry standard". And of course Audio Technica makes a quality product. I also have the 4033 which I use all the time with the 4040 as drum overheads. This pretty much leaves the tube mics which suffered the most from my little test. I think it has everthing to do with bad placement. I use the T3 and V77 all the time with much better results than what came out here. Maybe on another off night I can try this again.

[bubbagump]

Originally Posted by zbert

I also think I would have been better off using EQ to make each mic sound as best as it could to the source.

Likely a bad idea as you want all things equal in a test like this. EQ would just give us a false sense of each mic. It is like if you gave professional taste testers a bottle of ketchup to go with everything they tasted. I have to agree with the above... the 414 was the best to my ear with the 4040 coming in second. That cheapo sounded pretty reasonable soloed, but in a mix I think it would be very kludgy.

[tango]

Mic1 - Unaturally bright. Initially sounded harsh but less obvious as my ears adjusted to it.

Mic2 - Bright and slightly sibilant. Midrange emphasised at expense of lows?

Mic3 - Dull.

Mic4 - sibilant.

Mic5 - Lows good but in-your-face sibilant.

Mic6 - Quiet but reasonably balanced.

Mic7 - Nicely balanced

Mic8 - Sibilant & distorted.

[Robert D]

Good job on the consistancy of the performance for each take, something they did a bad job of in the listening sessions and so important for these things to be meaningfull. Levels could be matched better though, also quite important. Thanks for posting it. In my quick listen at work, the 4040 was the most pleasant to listen to.