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#1
03-02-2001
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Remember that 9 Drums Tracks in 2 Days thread???
Well, I'm dumping the tracks down to work tapes......there are 4 altogether and I've gotten thru the first 3 tapes... all tracks are passing the "day after" test and they rock, big time.... I pull out the 4th tape, and notice something hanging out of the case... pull the tape out - THE FUCKING TAPE SNAPPED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ...my heart sinking very quickly..... ...until I remind myself of the safety copies I made, immediately following the sessions on Sunday and Monday night!!!!!! ADATs are pretty reliable machines, but tapes ARE NOT!!!!!!!!!!! The lesson here --- ALWAYS MAKE SAFETIES......... (or backups on computer-based systems!!) 'cuse me now while I make a safety of the safety!  Bruce 
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#2
03-02-2001
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Good job Bruce. That is also a good idea especially if a client wants to keep the tape in their possesion.
__________________
Wally Cleaver All around nice guy
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#3
03-02-2001
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Truer words have never been spoken.....er.....written!
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#4
03-02-2001
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BTW Bruce, what kind of tape did you use that snapped?? Was it new or used??
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#5
03-02-2001
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It was a fresh BASF pre-form (20-bit)...
...it had maybe 6,7 passes during the session, tops!
Does BASF (Emtech) they still have a money-back guarantee on defective tapes? Bruce
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#6
03-02-2001
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bruce you record at 20 bit? I found 20 bit on adats not as good as 16 bit. Yes the sound quality is a bit (ha ha) better, but I think it squashes the stereo image and high end. just me.
__________________
Wally Cleaver All around nice guy
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#7
03-02-2001
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Really????
I'd never heard anyone say that before - some clients brought some tapes in done at 16-bit once and I found them grainy. Mind you, it may not have anything to do with the bit-size, they weren't the best recordings to begin with!
I like the top end and imaging I get from 20.... I'll give it shot later and see if I notice what you describe... Bruce
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#8
03-02-2001
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At school my instructor played 2 tapes for me. One in 20 bit, one in 16 bit. Very similar in sound quality but reduced top end on things like cymbals, and the stereo spread was shrunk down. I was to determine what tape was what. I assumed the 16 bit lacked these things, but it was the 20! From my understanding it was a fault with the 20 bit conversion. But again, you lose a little of the quality. Let me know what you think.
__________________
Wally Cleaver All around nice guy
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#9
03-02-2001
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Well, come to think of it...
...those drum tracks I did on the week-end were all 20-bit (on an XT20), and they were deinitely neither lacking in imaging nor top-end... the cymbals and transients sounded sweet and lush!
Now mind you, if that instructor was not using an XT20 then there could have been a difference - although both 20 bit, the XT20 and the LX20 do not have the same converters... (the XTs are better...) Anyways, I'll experiement later.... Bruce
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#10
03-02-2001
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Bruce,
He runs +4 to xt's so the lx convertor play no role.
__________________
Wally Cleaver All around nice guy
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#11
03-02-2001
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Well.... just tried it....
...Steely Dan's AJA direct outs to ins (bypassing the board), once to a 16-bit tape and another to a 20-bit in another machine. It's somewhat subtle (no doubt 'cos the source was already 16/44), but the 20-bit is definitely cleaner-sounding to my ears....
Have you tried this for yourself on your own gear since that instructor's demonstration, WC? If not, you should - the intructor may have mixed up their tapes! (From a design point of view, of course, the 20-bit should yield better fidelity and imaging, barring any converter flaws....) Bruce
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#12
03-03-2001
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Bruce or Wally,you guys ever used Quantegy tapes?
If so,how do you rate them?
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#13
03-03-2001
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Never tried 'em.... I mostly use the Maxell Broadcast stuff.... I just had a few BASF that I wanted to use up...... I don't think I'll be buying them anymore....
By the way, I had a BASF tape start to show a lot of interpolation errors, and it was on a freshly cleaned unit. So I backed it up, re-formatted it, and it was worse - even having been freshly formatted! I played it on all machines and it exhibited the same problems... I called Alesis since I was now questioning the unit itself and they mentioned that a large batch of 20-bit pre-form BASF have been problematic with the formatting - I guess BASF had a formatting issue at their production plant and released a mess of badly-formatted tapes........ I have no idea whether this is true or Alesis is just blame-shifting (Alesis does that??? Never!!  )... but I have never had problems with any of the Maxell Broadcast tapes, always low error rates.......I've ALWAYS hated their cassettes years ago, I always found that they were a problem when compared to the TDKs, and now, I hate their ADAT tapes too! Yes, the pre-form is nice and convenient, but not if the tapes are unreliable - which for me, they've proven to be.......... A reborn BASF tape hater! Bruce
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#14
03-03-2001
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Hey Q
I use Quantigy. My fav right now. I've never had a problem with 'em. Also (as I'd expect) I've always had good results with Maxells. On the other had, I've been screwed on two seperate occassions by HHB tapes.
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#15
03-03-2001
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Bruce,
Today I did it with A perfect Circles "3 Libras" A pretty complex mix and yes the quality was a little better on the 20, but I noticed things being squashed in the spread, and a slightly noticeable top end loss. I wonder what happens when convert 20 to 16 bit? Damn, I'll be back.
__________________
Wally Cleaver All around nice guy
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#16
03-04-2001
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Backups is good...
Today I noticed that my MC-303 had lost all its' memory. Thats 5 songs I'll have to program all over again. And I was really happy with the arrangements on some of the songs. Sob....
I WANTED to make backups, but I don't know how. Some kind of MIDI dump is the only option, thats all I know.
__________________
Random Pavarotti Disease Victim.
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#17
03-04-2001
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Tape backups are critical...
But SEQUENCER midi dumps are a necessity!!!!!!!!!!! Sequencers and midi gear is NOTORIOUS for flaking out and losing settings/sequences/programs....
Get yourself a Midi librarian and back ALL midi data up regularly............. Bruce
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#18
03-04-2001
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That's why I love programming MIDI sequences on a PC. Much easier data entry and backup is quick and easy. I can pretty much dump my whole life's work onto a CDR....
Just remember to save your work often as you're entering it. With MS products Ctrl-S is a mantra!
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#19
03-05-2001
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Re: Tape backups are critical...
Originally posted by Blue Bear Sound
But SEQUENCER midi dumps are a necessity!!!!!!!!!!! I KNOW. But I have asked both here and on SynthSone how to take backups of it, and nobody have answered. Get yourself a Midi librarian... Like what?
__________________
Random Pavarotti Disease Victim.
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#20
03-05-2001
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There are products from Yamaha and Roland...
Check out for a Yamaha offering...
http://www.synthony.com/Products/mdf3.html
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