Grand Pianos

[amt7565]

Are there any folks here who own and play grand pianos? I am in the market for a baby grand and I am looking for some ideas. Looking at the Yamahas and Baldwins. I loved the Steinway Bostons, but they are new and a bit out of my price. Any suggestions for pianos with good touch and playability? I found the Baldwins to be very easy to play.

please post.
thanks.
AMT

[DavidK]

I dont own one but I have played hundreds. Orchestras generally use Steinway, Baldwin and Yamaha. I like the Yamaha grands myself, they are very bright and can cut through an Orchestra. I am in the minority, most of my colleagues dont like them.

[dgatwood]

Originally Posted by amt7565

Are there any folks here who own and play grand pianos? I am in the market for a baby grand and I am looking for some ideas. Looking at the Yamahas and Baldwins. I loved the Steinway Bostons, but they are new and a bit out of my price. Any suggestions for pianos with good touch and playability? I found the Baldwins to be very easy to play.

The Bostons would have been my advice, too. I wouldn't describe the Boston as "new", though. I got mine when I was a senior in high school, and I'm 30. It came out in the early to mid-1990s. Sure, there aren't any 30-year-old Bostons, but you can probably still find some used ones if that's what you're looking for.

Kawai also makes some decent grands. I don't personally like them quite as much as the Boston, but they're decent. You'll frequently see Kawai grands for sale used because they have a program where they will lease them to universities on... I believe a three year rotation. At the end of those three years, the schools get new pianos and they do a giant used piano sale at the school to clear out the old ones.

Kimball used to make a Bosendorfer clone back in the late 90s that was nice, too. Yamaha I like in the really long concert grans, but I wasn't particularly enthralled by their smaller studio grands. Your opinion may vary.

Steinways built in Germany are nice. I find that the right age for a Steinway is 60-70 years, though at 30 or 40, they start to feel good. All the recent Steinways I've played have too hard a touch for me and generally too stiff an overall feel. YMMV.

If you want to try a piano that will make you want to buy a chainsaw, dynamite, and/or a fire axe, though, play a Young Chang. When you hit a key, you'll get to feel it twice... once as the key goes down and once as the hammer recoils and hits the underside of the key.

Speaking of fire axes....

http://users.catastrophe.net/eric/ar...ikes.Bach.html

[noisewreck]

You should also check out the Petrof pianos. They're not that well known in the US because they are made in the Czech Republic, so for years they couldn't export their stuff to the west since they were behind the iron curtain. But these are great pianos, extremely playable and responcive with usually a nice round tone. Next to them the Yammies sound like tin cans. The Baldwins are OK and easy to play for the most part, but don't respond to nuances of touch as readily as Steinways and Petrofs do.

[rgraves]

Originally Posted by amt7565

Are there any folks here who own and play grand pianos? I am in the market for a baby grand and I am looking for some ideas. Looking at the Yamahas and Baldwins. I loved the Steinway Bostons, but they are new and a bit out of my price. Any suggestions for pianos with good touch and playability? I found the Baldwins to be very easy to play.

please post.
thanks.
AMT

If you are planning to use this for recording, I would recommend against getting a baby grand at all. Actually, even for general playing a baby grand is a comprimise. You are compromising the sound quality of a normal grand for the smaller size.

I would recommend to shop around for at least a "studio" grand (5' or longer).
As far as brands, it really depends on your taste and you should simply try out as many pianos as possible before choosing. Also, your taste will be widely influenced by what type of music you are planning to play.

Yamahas and Baldwins tend to play and sound entirely different. I personally do not like Yamahas very much at all. I would agree with the other poster that said their concert grands are nice though, but still I would choose a different piano over them, just because they are generally too bright for my taste. OTOH, if you are playing rock, or want your piano to cut through other instruments and such, Yamaha might be a good choice.

The baldwin generally has a softer tone, maybe even a little dull in less expensive, not well taken care of pianos. But I think the baldwin is more pleasing to play solo piano works on.

My personally preference would be a Steinway, but the cost is often prohibitive, so I do not own a Steinway.

Some of the Chinese and Korean pianos (Young Chang, Samwick, Pearl River) are a good deal for the price, and again depending on what you want to do with it. If it's just for practice, and enjoying by yourself, I would get one of these, they sound good and play well at a low price. Not the best option though for recording and attracting clients who know about pianos.

I would simply check the used market, especially now there are many people willing to sell their nice pianos at a discount due to not many people being able to afford luxury items such as a piano.

[ofajen]

Originally Posted by amt7565

Are there any folks here who own and play grand pianos? I am in the market for a baby grand and I am looking for some ideas. Looking at the Yamahas and Baldwins. I loved the Steinway Bostons, but they are new and a bit out of my price. Any suggestions for pianos with good touch and playability? I found the Baldwins to be very easy to play.

please post.
thanks.
AMT

I'm in the market, too. Fortunately for me, I live less than one mile from the shop of one of the more skilled piano voicers in the country, with a particular specialty in Yamahas. He keeps several of the same model on the floor with different tones, just to show what can be done. It's amazing how versions of the same model of piano can sound so different, depending on what's intended. I would also say that there appears to be consensus among the techs in my area that no one competes with Yamaha on initial consistency or precision of manufacture, though at least one tech feels that Kawai is easier to voice to a more "singing" tone, if that is what you like.

OTOH, to make a broad statement about one competent brand based upon a random piano is dangerous, IMO, since the pianos can be voiced in different ways. I recommend that you connect with a skilled piano tech in your area and discuss your needs. Perhaps they know of good sources and can help you get a feel for the sound you like and then find a piano that meets those needs, or maybe one that can be voiced to your preference. I also suggest you take your time and play a lot of pianos before you buy one.

Cheers,

Otto

[noisewreck]

Originally Posted by rgraves

If you are planning to use this for recording, I would recommend against getting a baby grand at all. Actually, even for general playing a baby grand is a comprimise. You are compromising the sound quality of a normal grand for the smaller size.

I'd tend to agree with this. I'd get an upright before a baby grand. Unfortunately the uprights have a very different touch, so it's a tradeoff no matter how you look at it.

[ofajen]

Originally Posted by noisewreck

I'd tend to agree with this. I'd get an upright before a baby grand. Unfortunately the uprights have a very different touch, so it's a tradeoff no matter how you look at it.

Excellent point. The typical advice is to get at least a 6' grand or don't bother. Personally, I'd rather save up my bones than settle for an upright, just because of the touch on the soft notes and trills. OTOH, space and/or cost may shift the balance to the upright for some folks.

Cheers,

Otto

[dementedchord]

if this is for a serious student stay away from uprights... the physics of the action is way different... as to the others... if your recording you'll need a 6' or brtter to get any bass response (it's largely a function of string length)... for the budget minded KAWAI is by far the better.... the attention to detail is excellent... all the keys are weighted (accounts for consistency of action top to bottom) most only weight the whites for instance until you get to the big ones... ie.a steinway "M" isnt just a small "D"... for the prverbial steal look for a used kimball "Viennese edition" for a while they owned boesendorpher and these were boesy's built in indiana....

[dgatwood]

Originally Posted by dementedchord

for the prverbial steal look for a used kimball "Viennese edition" for a while they owned boesendorpher and these were boesy's built in indiana....

Yep. That was the one I was thinking of. Couldn't remember the name of it.

Agreed about getting a studio over a baby. That might be imprecision of terminology, though. I've heard a lot of people use "baby grand" to refer to anything smaller than a concert grand, while technically a baby grand means 6 feet or less. The definitions vary depending on who you ask, of course, to make matters worse.

My naming scheme is as follows:

under 5': Furniture grand piano.
5'-6': baby grand piano.
6'6-7': studio grand.
7'6-9': concert grand.

Give or take a few inches here or there.

[dementedchord]

Originally Posted by dgatwood

My naming scheme is as follows:

under 5': Furniture grand piano.
5'-6': baby grand piano.
6'6-7': studio grand.
7'6-9': concert grand.

Give or take a few inches here or there.

that's not bad but the"standard" i think is
below 6'=baby
6'-7'=grand
7'+^=concert

[amt7565]

Thanks Folks. Very helpful comments.

I liked the Steinway and the Bostons alot. The Baldwins were also nice, but never cared for the Yamahas. I am still to decide.....I will continue to shop around and see what appeals to me most.

[ozraves]

If you want to save money, then you probably need to stick with the Yamaha and the Kawai. You want ones made in Japan that were for the North American market. I know in the Yamaha pianos there are ones out there that were made for the Pacific market that aren't as good as the ones for North America.

That's my advice.

[erosconpollo]

Originally Posted by noisewreck

You should also check out the Petrof pianos. They're not that well known in the US because they are made in the Czech Republic, so for years they couldn't export their stuff to the west since they were behind the iron curtain. But these are great pianos, extremely playable and responcive with usually a nice round tone. Next to them the Yammies sound like tin cans. The Baldwins are OK and easy to play for the most part, but don't respond to nuances of touch as readily as Steinways and Petrofs do.

Yes, Petrofs are lovely pianos -- 'extremely playable' is so right. Steinways can be beasts to play.

[DAS19]

I played a yamaha upright that I really liked it had a bright tone like a grand but was an upright.