New to makeing beats , HELP!!!!!

[Chris Jahn]

ok this is gonna be long so hang tight. I love hip hop, but come from a rock background, and thats what i understand in terms of recording.

I want to play around with makeing beats and have some stupid beginer questions.

SAMPLERS-why use them in 2007, or ever, it seems to me that a "sample" is just a recording in ANY format, so why in the past did they use them with there extremly short sampling times instead of a mic and a tape deck? and presently why at all? It seems to me that with ANY decent digital recording program you can just import a cd, or vinyl and chop up the track anyway you want, and its WAY less complicated, is there something about samplers thats better or differnt that makes them used to this day?

Beats-same as above but in regards to drum machines, why use one when you can just use a midi keyboard trigger on countless drum plug-ins ,they are really really complicated and cumbersom, so WHY?

Loops-the only way i know how to make something repeat is to chop it up and paste it in time with the beat, but is there a way to say "highlite" something and just have it repeat in time and then apply music under it, like in mixing you can making somthing loop while you dial in a sound, but you cant record under it while looping (i use logic by the way so this might help with an answer)

Thats it for now, im sure more questions will come as i get answers

[dnkygirl]

Originally Posted by Chris Jahn

ok this is gonna be long so hang tight. I love hip hop, but come from a rock background, and thats what i understand in terms of recording.

I want to play around with makeing beats and have some stupid beginer questions.

SAMPLERS-why use them in 2007, or ever, it seems to me that a "sample" is just a recording in ANY format, so why in the past did they use them with there extremly short sampling times instead of a mic and a tape deck? and presently why at all? It seems to me that with ANY decent digital recording program you can just import a cd, or vinyl and chop up the track anyway you want, and its WAY less complicated, is there something about samplers thats better or differnt that makes them used to this day?

Beats-same as above but in regards to drum machines, why use one when you can just use a midi keyboard trigger on countless drum plug-ins ,they are really really complicated and cumbersom, so WHY?

Loops-the only way i know how to make something repeat is to chop it up and paste it in time with the beat, but is there a way to say "highlite" something and just have it repeat in time and then apply music under it, like in mixing you can making somthing loop while you dial in a sound, but you cant record under it while looping (i use logic by the way so this might help with an answer)

Thats it for now, im sure more questions will come as i get answers

As with all techology.. it changes. I agree with you on why use them now, but the musicial instrument manufacturers have just started to really get on board with making less hardware and focusing more on software. Back in the day sampling really was the only way to get a clean and pure digital sound into your music.

There was no DAW... only hardware that did all the recording. I still see a use for samplers... for live shows... you can easily dump and split up the keyboard to trigger your sounds.


I think in the next 10 years as far as keyboard gear goes you will start to see less of it... and more rack like devices with software interfaces... I'm sure they will start to go more the route like the neko.

[Fieva]

dkny is right. Back then beatmakers had to use what was available. Midi controllers and software plugins weren't available or even thought of yet. Now that technology has given musicians that to use, more people are using them. Some still prefer to go the hardware route, others prefer software (rather it's plugins or full fledged software like Reason or Fruity Loops).

As for samplers, many times these days (because of technology), you can throw the sample in your software like Cubase, Nuendo, Pro Tools, Logic, or Live and just chop the parts you want, integrate them into the song and throw out the rest.
But like mentioned earlier, back when it all started, if you wanted it, you had to do it through a sampler, because a mic and tape deck wasn't going to get you the quality you wanted.

As for looping beats, Acid is the first thing that comes to mind when looping individual sounds for beats, but it takes time to learn how to do it and not make all the elements fit. Some of us who use software use Reason or Fruity Loops to make the beat and then put the beat in the software leaving just the vocals that needed to be recorded over it.


Fiev.

[Chris Jahn]

Thanks, i understood, that the choices available in the past were limited, but if you look in modern "industry" mags they are still packed with adds for samplers and beat machines, so i was thinking that there was mabye some inherant quality to them that plugins and dumping cds into your program dont have??? or mabye people are just stuck in there ways, as we all know hip-hop can be very stuborn in the "keeping it real" department!!!

As for the looping, is there a differance in these other programs (acid, frooty loops etc...) that makes it easier or better, makeing loops, meaning, in my mind with my knowledge of recording programs (which is limited to logic and some pro tools) "loops" would be made by cutting and pasteing, cut up a drum beat for instance, and then pasteing it repeatedly matching the end of the first line with the begining of the last etc... is there some other way its done??

[Mindset]

Originally Posted by Chris Jahn

Thanks, i understood, that the choices available in the past were limited, but if you look in modern "industry" mags they are still packed with adds for samplers and beat machines, so i was thinking that there was mabye some inherant quality to them that plugins and dumping cds into your program dont have??? or mabye people are just stuck in there ways, as we all know hip-hop can be very stuborn in the "keeping it real" department!!!

As for the looping, is there a differance in these other programs (acid, frooty loops etc...) that makes it easier or better, makeing loops, meaning, in my mind with my knowledge of recording programs (which is limited to logic and some pro tools) "loops" would be made by cutting and pasteing, cut up a drum beat for instance, and then pasteing it repeatedly matching the end of the first line with the begining of the last etc... is there some other way its done??

Actually Pro Tools does let you loop. I can't remember the shortcut for it though. So does many other programs, just as long as you have the loop ready. Remember what a loop is. You can either use premade loops, which someone already did the cutting for you, and you just paste it and loop it, or you make your own. You can take a loop from reason, import it in cubase, and just drag it out, or paste it down or whatever.
Some people like the hands on, others prefer software. Then you got quality differences. The sounds of a Motif, are different than the sounds found in Reason. I don't sample that much, and when I do, it's through software. However I figure that each device excels at what it does.

[X man Da Legend]

Originally Posted by Chris Jahn

ok this is gonna be long so hang tight. I love hip hop, but come from a rock background, and thats what i understand in terms of recording.

I want to play around with makeing beats and have some stupid beginer questions.

SAMPLERS-why use them in 2007, or ever, it seems to me that a "sample" is just a recording in ANY format, so why in the past did they use them with there extremly short sampling times instead of a mic and a tape deck? and presently why at all? It seems to me that with ANY decent digital recording program you can just import a cd, or vinyl and chop up the track anyway you want, and its WAY less complicated, is there something about samplers thats better or differnt that makes them used to this day?

Beats-same as above but in regards to drum machines, why use one when you can just use a midi keyboard trigger on countless drum plug-ins ,they are really really complicated and cumbersom, so WHY?

Loops-the only way i know how to make something repeat is to chop it up and paste it in time with the beat, but is there a way to say "highlite" something and just have it repeat in time and then apply music under it, like in mixing you can making somthing loop while you dial in a sound, but you cant record under it while looping (i use logic by the way so this might help with an answer)

Thats it for now, im sure more questions will come as i get answers

I see where your coming from but its hard to explain unless u have tried the tools yourself. Software can be a bit bland for some. I personally don't like working much in DAW software Id much rather work in Reason which I treat just like a hardware sampler. The streamlined workflow just makes music so much more fun and easy for me atleast. Ive used hardware samplers and I got the same feeling there as well. To be quite honest the only reason I use Reason in the first place is because its easier to store everything on the computer and edit everything from the source than it is for a hardware sampler. Also think about the history of hip hop. These were poor kids from New York who didnt have much of anything especially money. So they used what they had to create music and it became tradition. Now everyone uses samplers if for nothing else drums. Samplers are fantastic devices imo. I don't know if Id ever want to create music without having access to one in one form or another. As far as drum plug ins go. They are so clean and bland and just outright disgusting in my personal opinion there is no real purpose in drum machines or drum plug ins. They just don't sound that good to me. Theres nothing like a sampled drum sound. Plus it gives my production a sound of its own that makes it mine. Nobody else has my drum collection and my drums will never sound like anyone else material because I sampled them from several sources, tweaked them and mixed and matched them with other drum sounds from my kit.