TSR 8 track volume differences

[pappy999]

I have my new/used TSR8 working pretty well after giving it a good cleaning and using new tape. I was recording today and noticed a playback problem on track 5. The volume of the track was almost null on playback. I was taping over a prevoius performance. Does this have anything to do with this problem? How many times can you tape over audio before you notice problems?

[Golden]

Interesting... my TSR-8 has a problem with track 5 as well... It plays at a very low volume as well...

hmmm...

I consider my TSR-8 a great 7-track machine...

The thing is, I got my machine off ebay, which was a mistake. The TSR-8 is 70lbs... Mine arrived a little banged-up... It still works, but it has it's troubles. Right now, I'm using my 8 as a sampling/effect unit...

[The Ghost of FM]

Originally Posted by pappy999

I have my new/used TSR8 working pretty well after giving it a good cleaning and using new tape. I was recording today and noticed a playback problem on track 5. The volume of the track was almost null on playback. I was taping over a prevoius performance. Does this have anything to do with this problem? How many times can you tape over audio before you notice problems?

A health tape can be recorded over hundreds of times or more with no audible effects of problems.

Your machine may need calibration and a close inspection of the cleanliness of the head itself to ensure that there is no residual dirt on there left from a previous bad tape that may have been used on it. Even it it outwardly looks clean, I would suggest a rigorous re-cleaning with 99% pure isopropal alcohol and q-tips or for a stubborn bit of dirt, even try some methanol and q-tips. Methanol is highly flammable and burns invisibly so keep all open flame sources away from your work...this means no smoking!

If after a proper cleaning the problem is still there, look into calibrating the deck to make sure all the internal levels are set up correctly. The manual can step you through the procedure or an experienced technician can perform this job, usually for an hour's worth of bench time.

Good luck!

Cheers!

[Slowrider]

Like Ghost says..and watch out for the little Q-Tip shreds. Hard to see, but they can get wrapped around your capstan. I didn't like the foam tips.

[jpmorris]

I've got a problem with track 5 playback on my backup machine, but I haven't had time to find out why yet. I haven't used it in anger so far.
I'll have to try swapping/reseating cards, maybe borrow one from the spares machine.

I mention this because other people have a problem with track 5, and that makes me wonder if there's something weird about it that makes it particularly susceptible to problems.

Of course it's probably coincidence...

[evm1024]

I'm assuming that you do not have a MRL tape and thus cannot verify if the problem is in the record or playback circuits.

One trick is to record a tone (1khz is fine) at 0 VU on all tracks and then swap the tape reels left to right. Thus playing the tones backwards. This will move recorded track 1 to playback 8 and so on. 5 will be come 4. Does the reduced level stay on 5 or did it move to 4?

If it stays on 5 then suspect playback. If it travels to 4 then suspect record. If it appears on both then suspect the head.

YMMV in this simple test....

[Beck]

Did the track playback normally on the first take?

When you have a misbehaving track in the middle of the head it’s usually either dirty or the channel card needs reseating. It's all been said above... just adding my vote.

[pappy999]

How difficult is it to reseat the channel cards? Can I do it myself?

Are there any tascam techs in the Western NY area (Buffalo)?

[Beck]

It's not difficult. Remove the bottom and back panels and have a look around. You'll see if you want to give it a go or not.

Look here for TASCAM service centers near you.

http://www.tascam.com/service_centers.php

[SteveM]

Originally Posted by evm1024

I'm assuming that you do not have a MRL tape and thus cannot verify if the problem is in the record or playback circuits.

One trick is to record a tone (1khz is fine) at 0 VU on all tracks and then swap the tape reels left to right. Thus playing the tones backwards. This will move recorded track 1 to playback 8 and so on. 5 will be come 4. Does the reduced level stay on 5 or did it move to 4?

If it stays on 5 then suspect playback. If it travels to 4 then suspect record. If it appears on both then suspect the head.

YMMV in this simple test....

A trick I learned was to move the pin connections for the heads over one seating. So if you move them over one to the left, track 5 now becomes track 4 on recording or playback (6-5, etc..). I think this should tell you if the problem is in the head or the playback card.

BTW, what does YMMV stand for?

[The Ghost of FM]

YMMV = Your Mileage May Vary

Cheers!

[pappy999]

Channels 1-4 are the same way. Audio goes in HOT, comes out cold. I think I am going to take it to a local Tascam tech I found today. It is an electronics repair place right near my house. In your experiences, how are general techs on these older machines? I assume he knows what he is doing being an authorized tascam tech.

[Beck]

What kind of new tape did you get?

[pappy999]

I got RMG991 from tapes.com. The CSR at the site said the tape cannot be more than a month old.

I am in the process of cleaning the machine again. The old owner was running 996 on it. There is still brown shed on the heads. If this does not work, I will take it to the tascam tech.

[cjacek]

Originally Posted by pappy999

There is still brown shed on the heads.

Then that means it must be caked on there pretty good and may be the cause of your problems. Do yourself a favor and get a microfiber cloth, which can be bought fairly cheap in most places and use that WITH 99% isopropyl alcohol (or at least 90%). Clean in the direction of tape travel. After each cleaning inspect the heads closely and make sure no oxide remains. If in doubt, clean again. It's ok to use a bit of pressure when cleaning.

[pappy999]

I cleaned it again and got track 5 working better. 1-4 are still low in volume and tone, but workable. KEEP CLEANING!!!

I am using 91% alcohol with those make-up swabs. Is there any danger of destroying the heads from scrubbing too much?

[cjacek]

Originally Posted by pappy999

I cleaned it again and got track 5 working better. 1-4 are still low in volume and tone, but workable. KEEP CLEANING!!!

That's exactly right, keep cleaning!

I am using 91% alcohol with those make-up swabs. Is there any danger of destroying the heads from scrubbing too much?

Yup, those will work too but be prepared to go through a dozen of 'em. I don't believe you will harm the heads. Just clean in the direction of the tracks, applying reasonable pressure when doing so. Remember to squeeze out excess alcohol. I've done the same type of work on a TEAC 3440 and all I got was excellent results. Keep cleaning.

[pappy999]

Channels 3-8 work well now. 1+2 are better but still cutting out very often and without much volume. I am still cleaning. I am going to try the microfiber cloth next to get more pressure on the heads and rollers. How often should I clean this machine? Every time I record?

[The Ghost of FM]

With healthy tape that's not shedding, you should be able to get away with a fast cleaning before and after each day's session. If you're working the whole day on a project, take a break every 4 - 5 hours and give the heads a fast wipe. Even a little bit of oxide build up can reduce high frequency response and overall level.

It pays to be diligent, I kid you not.

Cheers!

[cjacek]

Yes, do as the Ghost recommends.

Great about channels 3 - 8 working. Keep cleaning and see if 1 and 2 improves. You should also, just in case, spray some caig deoxit into each RCA connector. Reseating channel cards, as Beck mentioned, would also be a good idea, spraying some deoxit there as well.

[pappy999]

I have some deoxit that I use on my mixers and preamps. Do you think the cutting out on channel 1+2 are connection problems?

[MCI2424]

Originally Posted by pappy999

I have some deoxit that I use on my mixers and preamps. Do you think the cutting out on channel 1+2 are connection problems?

I know TASCAM 80-8s have problems like this when the relays get dirty. Look to see if your machine uses electro-mechanical relays that switch between play and record (should be on every channel card).

[cjacek]

Yeah, I recall having very similar problems with my TEAC 3440 where I recorded and then it played back at low volume. I then worked the "input" buttons, at the front of the machine, back and forth many times, which operated the relays and this must have dislodged the oxidation 'cause it all worked well after that. I know it's a different machine but MCI2424 makes a good point. Yes, I would bet it's oxidation and or connection problems. It would not hurt to spray some deoxit into the RCA connectors and also clean the relays / channels cards, resitting them. That latter part I have not done so I can't comment further but it would make sense to do.

[A Reel Person]

It helps when I can type!...............

[cjacek]

Amen to that!