Phase Solutions

[poo]

Im SO confused about phase now. How can I find out if my mic's are in phase or out of phase? I have tube MP and one of my mics sounds better with the phase revsersed...why is it like this? why are some mics phased differently? I found OUT THAT EVERYTHING BEING IN PHASE MAKES a WORLD of DIFFERENCE! I just dont get it, how do i FIX these problems if i have a console that doesnt let me switch phase?

thanksss :-)

[John Sayers]

Firstly it's a good idea to make up a couple of Phase reverse leads. That's a female XLR to male XLR with pin 2 going to 3 and visa versa.

Now set up your main mike and plug in your other mikes one at a time and speak into both mikes. You will need to get someone to help you here. If they are in Phase the sound will come out of the phantom centre between your speakers when panned L/R. Put the phase reversal into one of the mike leads and you will immediateley hear the difference as the phantom centre will go and it will sound very wide.

It's a good idea to do that to all your mikes and you will quicly learn which are in and which are out of phase. It's also a good idea to do it with mikes you know are in phase and keep changing your mike leads to find out what leads are out of phase

Now I've confused you yeah?

cheers
john

[poo]

YES! I caught a bit of it..i just dont know how to create all those pin 2 pin 3 things..i understand what you said I just dont know how to apply it. That was the answer I was looking for! however, I still dont understand why certain mics are in/phase and vice versa.

FOR example:
If i Have 2 SM 57's can they be different from eacother in how they are wired? WHAT is PIN 2 and PIN 3, hot ?cold? im lost! haha :-)

thankss

[Aquanaut]

i'm obviously new to this...

what does phase mean?

hope i don't sound like an idiot>>>mike

[c7sus]

Phasing refers to the polarity of the transducer and the sine wave generated by it. When mics are out of phase with each other portions of their signal are cancelled out at the points along the wave where they are 180 degrees out of phase. Get three or four tracks recorded out of phase and things are gonna sound shitty in a hurry. I know this isn't a good explanation of "in phase/out of phase".

While there are standards for this stuff, boards get rewired and hots become colds, some dumbass fucks up at the cable factory and 2 and 3 get switched in your cord. There are a few ways this can creep into your setup. Anyway, it's a fairly easy fix.

Yo, John... can you cite any examples where you would want to record something out of phase?

[poo]

SO, how can i remedy my problem...is it my mic thats out of phase or the cable im using? When i reverse the phase on this mic it sounds great. All my other mics are the other way around. Things are made so difficult sometimes!

latah!

[John Sayers]

OK Phase: Two mikes in phase
http://www.lis.net.au/~johnsay/Phase.gif

Two mikes Out of Phase.
http://www.lis.net.au/~johnsay/OPhase.gif

Sooooo when you mike a snare from underneath the mikes are out of phase to the source and you need to reverse the phase of the bottom mike. OK C7sus? Also if you mike the back of a guitar amp it will be out of phase to the mike on the front.

A typical Cannon lead has three pins.
Pin 1 - is the ground and is usually slightly longer so it contacts first.

Now Pin 2 and 3 are the +ve and -ve feeds. The problem is that the US and Europe use different pins for +ve (HOT) but that is slowly changing. In the US pin 2 is hot, (3 in Europe) so if you have US gear and Europe gear together you can run into phase problems.

I recommend that you go through and check everything in your studio for phase relativity. As I described before you can do it with your mikes and mike leads first, then move onto your outboard gear.

cheers
john

[c7sus]

Cool graphic, John.

I had no idea that mics should be out of phase in the apps you describe.

That's what I like about this site, though; I learn something every day.

[poo]

Thanks..the diagrams were sweeet!

[poo]

Man I feel stupid.
OK, so the only way I can reverse the phase on my Mics is if i have a device (such as a preamp) that has a phase reverse control? Or is there another way?

[John Sayers]

Poo just get a short mike lead and reverse pins 2 & 3 on one of the plugs. Some consoles have a phase reverse switch but they are usually the expensive ones.

It's worthwhile making a couple of phase reversal leads but Paint them RED so you know which ones they are.

cheers
john

[poo]

Thanks John! Its clear to me noww..:-)