MSH-4 Tube mic test

[XLR]

Nylon string guitar w/MSH-4

Mic positioned 2 ft out from midpoint between soundhole and bridge, on axis with soundboard. 31'x17'x16' room. Great River pre, Lucid converter. EQ -4 dB shelf @100 Hz. SIR verb added at about -30 dB, half second decay

Steel string acoustic w/MSH-4

Dreadnought gtr, mic 2 ft from neck/body joint, on axis, low cut @ 100 Hz, same verb

Tim

[msly]

Sounds pretty good to me.... what were your impressions? Do you like it better the the other test you did with this brand mic? Nice Playing...... would love to here a nice Jazz box playing with these mics.....

sLY

[orksnork]

great playing timothy...

here's a random question...

how is it that i hear professionally recorded cds with acoustic guitar...and i'll never hear someone breathe?? i can hear you breathe on your recordings...

seems impossible considering the ideal setup for recording an acoustic...

[apl]

Well done, Tim, and well done, mshilarious.

[Big Kenny]

You've passed the audition, and we'll take two of the mics!

[Dr_simon]

Nice job mate, I really enjoyed listening !!

[true-eurt]

It really has some awesome definition to it Tim. Very nice highs and mids too.....and of course your precise and elegant playing.

Hmmmmm....I am on a roadtrip, traveling in one of those little foreign cars, looking at all the wonderful Architecture of Europe...those great longshots of tall buildings and Cathedrals. Of course, when I get to Spain, I expect one of those passionate Flamencos.

Such a lovely backdrop to express the delight of the eyes.

I can't hear any breathing, only the squeaking of the strings.

I was thinking at work earlier about trying to record my acoustic. I have never done that before. I was just wondering where to put the mic/mics and what room would be best for this.

[MadAudio]

Very nice tone, and very well played.

[hognogger]

Wow... you got a full mp3 of the Bach piece? That was really nice.

I should see if they ship these mics to Australia... at $US55 it would be well worth it... I currently have a pair of Studio Projects C4s. These sound like they would be good variation pieces.

[XLR]

Msly – My impressions? There’s something appealing about the mic’s sound that’s a totally different flavor than its non-tube version. For clean and clear I’d use the 1-O. For a big sound with a bit of sparkly compression I’d use the 4, especially in a mix or mixed with other mic's on solo guitar. I also tried it as a middle mic with a surrounding ORTF stereo pair and it added a nice fullness mixed in just a little.

Other impressions – the mic also sounded great through a Mackie VLZ pre – a little less bite in the highs. My EH 12AY7 tube pre wouldn’t power up the mic though. Guessing the EH hasn’t got enough phantom power muscle.

Listening to the samples makes me want to experiment more with closer (than 2 ft) placement for optimum sound on the steel string gtr since I was playing it pretty quietly.

Orksnork – thanks ork. Breathing sounds? Sometimes yeah. I don’t try to totally eliminate it. A little of that comes with moving the mic’s back instead of having them right up on the guitar. Listen to CDs by guitarists Galbraith and Parkening and you’ll hear pretty loud breathing. Listen to pianist Glenn Gould to hear humming and moaning.

Apl, Big Kenny, Dr simon, MadAudio – much appreciated

True-eurt – Hi True! Thanks for your comments.

Hognogger – Thanks. You mean Jesu, Joy of Man’s Desiring? Naw, I just did a short bit of it for the test.

Tim

[Brackish]

Originally Posted by Timothy Lawler

[URL=http://www.timothylawler.com/bachswing.mp3]Nylon Steel string acoustic w/MSH-4Tim

Hi, Timothy.

I see your steel string sample is no longer hooked up.

I'm new to recording classic guitar and was just
wondering if I'd be better recording (mono) with the mic
more toward the bridge or more toward where the
neck and body meet?

[orksnork]

depends on the room, the guitar, the way you play...

try a few quick clips...see what sounds best....get it on

[XLR]

Originally Posted by Brackish

Hi, Timothy.

I see your steel string sample is no longer hooked up.

I'm new to recording classic guitar and was just
wondering if I'd be better recording (mono) with the mic
more toward the bridge or more toward where the
neck and body meet?

If there's any way you can use a really big room you'll get the best sound moving the mic a few feet back, and then it's not so critical exactly where the mic is in relation to the bridge or neck... more of a room thing. But with closer mic'ing - say, under 3 ft. ... of all the classical guitars I've recorded I've always preferred the mic sound on the bridge side of the soundhole... usually about midpoint between the bridge and soundhole. ...never found one that sounded as good with the mic at the neck/body joint. Gets kind of a scooped sound there. Totally the opposite of steel string acoustics.

I had taken the steel string sample down because as I got to know the mic a little I think I got a better sound on this clip, which I put up in a later thread.

Good luck with the classical recording.

EDIT: I just uploaded that acoustic blues clip to replace the missing steel string acoustic clip in the first post.

Tim

[nuemes]

Wow Tim, that sounds fantastic. I really like your take on Bouree. Pretty good workout, eh?

[Brackish]

Originally Posted by Timothy Lawler

EDIT: I just uploaded that acoustic blues clip to replace the missing steel string acoustic clip in the first post.

Tim

Where was the mic located on this new clip?

And what is the problem putting the mic
direct across from the soundhole?

[Nakatira]

Sweet sounding mic, great playing.

I love that piece Bouree isent it?

Specially in that jazzy feel, You just need some flute and Ian Anderson in there

The steel string sounds great as well, very fancy Tim

Alllways a thrill to hear ya play.

and yeah props to Msh

[Brackish]

Another question,too. Is all classical guitar
done with nylon strings rather than steel?

[BigRay]

can you post some straight samples, Tim? (no eq, low cut, verb) id like to see what they sound like raw.

[funckyfinger]

"can you post some straight samples, Tim? (no eq, low cut, verb) id like to see what they sound like raw."

I would like to hear that as well.

[XLR]

neumes – Thanks… don’t know if Jethro Tull ever did the B section, but it kind of just falls under the fingers… doing a swing rhythm while reading from the original.

Brackish – on the acoustic blues thing the mic was just under a foot away from the neck/body joint. Since it’s an omni, yeah, you could mic the soundhole with no problems… I just liked the balance better at the 12th fret on that guitar.

Nakatira – Hey Naka. I always hear this tune on flute in my head when I play it – just can’t get away from the Jethro Tull influence, not that I want to. I played this a few times with a stand-up bass player, and that suited the tune too. Just a good tune… Bach knew what he was doing I think.

Brackish – kind of rare to hear classical guitar music done with steel strings. No reason it couldn’t work on some things though. Maybe the quicker decay of nylon strings makes it easier to keep things clear in multi-voice stuff… hmmm. Composer/guitarist Barrios used steel strings in the early 1900s though, and there are some old recordings of him around.

BigRay and funckyfinger – I’ll try to dig up the raw files and see if I can get them up tomorrow.

Tim

[funckyfinger]

Well I hope these mics do what I'm hoping for,I just ordered a matched set of the 10's. I have been really into messing with recording acoustic guitar and vocals, one mic,one take. I want my recording to sound like your in the room with me. Sort of like the old bluegrass single mic recordings. Anyway I'll surely post a recording or two when I get them.

[Caotico]

That's definitely a decent sound. I like it better than the non tube msh samples I've heard.

[Paj]

Originally Posted by funckyfinger

Well I hope these mics do what I'm hoping for,I just ordered a matched set of the 10's. I have been really into messing with recording acoustic guitar and vocals, one mic,one take. I want my recording to sound like your in the room with me. Sort of like the old bluegrass single mic recordings. Anyway I'll surely post a recording or two when I get them.

I think the MSH-4 is especially good at that. Try pointing it straight up/down, about a foot or so in front of you, at sound hole level. It'll sound like you're still playing.

Paj
8^)

[Brackish]

Originally Posted by Timothy Lawler

Totally the opposite of steel string acoustics.

Tim

So, as a general rule, with steel strings mic on the
neck side?

[Big Kenny]

You have to realize that, while the mics are nice (I have at least one of each and two pairs), the main reason that recording sounds great is the playing. The technique, attack and phrasing that Tim utilizes makes a nice recording easy to achieve. I think the mics are phemoninal at that price and use them frequently but you gotta give it up for the player, that's the main ingredient!