Drum dial tuning question

[FattMusiek]

Let me first say I can make drums sound pretty good. I can tune by ear alright as well. I recently picked up a drum dial to see what all the hype was about. Here's the scenario (using the opposite lug approach):

I'll start from scratch and go for a tension of 80. As I work around the drum, some lugs that are obviously a lower tension (they can be comepletely loose), read as high as the previous lug, yet somehow produce a higher note. It's a mystery to me. The tensions get higher and higher as I go around usually; they never seem to stay at the same tension after the first pass. Am I using the device wrong? If so, what is the proper way to get each lug reading the same tension? Am I damned to always tuning by ear?

[Shout It Out]

I've had that problem on our bands kit too, some lugs are jsut completely loose. I guess same tension doesnt apply to the dial?

[TheBigGiantHead]

You will NEVER get the tension to read the same on all the lugs...unless maybe you're tuning a 32" bass brum, and even then, only if the drum is perfectly round and the head is perfectly consistent. The Drum Dial is a total scam.

[Shout It Out]

yea i didnt have to pay for ours, it just doesnt seem to do anything.

[mikeh]

Every lug has an impact on parts of the head not directly at the lug. As an example, adjusting the tension on a lug at 12 o'clock effects the tension at the lugs at 2 o'clock & 10 o'clock as well as at 6 o'clock.

Often if the initial tension of a drum (before using the drum dial) is way out of balance (some lugs real tight, others real loose) you have to loosen tension at various points until you can get the dial reading consistant.

It is very possible to have a drum sound good with uneven tension - but even tension can really help improve the overall sustain of a drum (more so than helping to improve the "note" the drum plays.

While I think all would agree it is important to be able to "tune" drums by ear, getting even tension is also an important skill. Candidly, I can put a head on, tighten the head to a point where it sounds good (at least to me) and then verify the tension and the dial almost always indicates the tension is very close at all lugs. I worked in a drum shop for many years and we often used the drum dial just to get the tension in line quickly (when you set up several kits during an afternoon, any short cut is helpful)

I can't really agree that the drum dial is a "scam", it is simply a tool that can make the job easier and perhaps a little more precise. While it can't replace a good ear, it is a tool - just as valid as a guitar tuner.

[TheBigGiantHead]

Okay...it's not a scam.
It's a crutch for handicapped drummers.

[jonnyc]

Originally Posted by TheBigGiantHead

Okay...it's not a scam.
It's a crutch for handicapped drummers.

We like to use the term "handicapable" these days.

[RAMI]

It's the biggest scam perpetrated upon the American public since "One Hour Martinizing".

[EdWonbass]

Originally Posted by RAMI

It's the biggest scam perpetrated upon the American public since "One Hour Martinizing".

But my shirts are so crisp and white.

[RAMI]

Originally Posted by EdWonbass

But my shirts are so crisp and white.

That's only because you lost them in the fountain too.

[scrubs]

Originally Posted by RAMI

It's the biggest scam perpetrated upon the American public since "One Hour Martinizing".

Yes, everyone knows that true Martinizing takes no less than 97 minutes, and that's when executed by a professional.

Personally, I love my drum dial (but I wouldn't call myself a drummer by any stretch). The key is to "sneak up" on the desired tension by making small tension adjustments to your lugs -- just as you would when tuning by ear. It's very easy to overshoot if you tune each lug to the desired tension, as tightening one lug makes the tension of the head tighter at all the lugs. The real beauty of the drum dial is when you find a tension you like for your specific drum/head. Tuning up a new head is much easier.

[RAMI]

Originally Posted by scrubs

Yes, everyone knows that true Martinizing takes no less than 97 minutes, and that's when executed by a professional.

Personally, I love my drum dial (but I wouldn't call myself a drummer by any stretch). The key is to "sneak up" on the desired tension by making small tension adjustments to your lugs -- just as you would when tuning by ear. It's very easy to overshoot if you tune each lug to the desired tension, as tightening one lug makes the tension of the head tighter at all the lugs. The real beauty of the drum dial is when you find a tension you like for your specific drum/head. Tuning up a new head is much easier.

I know...I just wanted to get my "Martinizing" line in.

[petermiller]

it can work to some degree as far as getting you in the ball park. however for it to be useful at all you have to male shure that the drum you are using it on is functioning properly, I.E. the head is seated right, the t rods are moving propperly, the rim is in good shape and not out of round, the bearing edge is smooth and has no problems and so on. + if you are putting on a new drumhead , they take a little time to stretch and get seated propperly, if your drum head is old and wasted then it won't work either.

[Farview]

Originally Posted by jonnyc

We like to use the term "handicapable" these days.

Can't we just go back to using 'cripple'?

[FattMusiek]

So literal perfect tension is impossible on a snare? It's a 10 lug 14 x 5 1/2 Tama Starclassic Birch snare drum. Over the years I've learned the best way to achieve a great recording is starting with the best possible tones to begin with, which is why I've been so anal over perfect tension. I'm never completely satisfied with my dry snare tracks; I rely on compression and EQ more than I'd like to admit. Instead of the handicap jokes could we discuss what's really on our minds? - Obtaining the greatest snare tone mankind has ever known.

[SBax]

My experience with the dial tuner is that some lugs have drag from the threads and some of the measurment is from the threads, not the head tension. Even after oiling and replacing lugs I still had problems.

[bubbagump]

Long story short, those things don't work. You just gotta tune by ear. Tune to pitch, put a finger in the center of the head, and tap at each lug. Adjust until the note is the same at all lugs. At this point, continue tuning and check your work with this method. That's the only reliable way to do it.

[scrubs]

Originally Posted by SBax

My experience with the dial tuner is that some lugs have drag from the threads and some of the measurment is from the threads, not the head tension. Even after oiling and replacing lugs I still had problems.

The Drum Dial does not measure lug tension, only head tension.

[TheBigGiantHead]

Originally Posted by jonnyc

We like to use the term "handicapable" these days.

Oh...like those 'tards buying the dumb-o-meter?

[TheBigGiantHead]

Originally Posted by Farview

Can't we just go back to using 'cripple'?

Political correctness will be the end of the United States.

There is unrest in the forest,
There is trouble with the trees,
For the maples want more sunlight
And the oaks ignore their pleas.

The trouble with the maples,
(And they're quite convinced they're right)
They say the oaks are just too lofty
And they grab up all the light.
But the oaks can't help their feelings
If they like the way they're made.
And they wonder why the maples
Can't be happy in their shade.

There is trouble in the forest,
And the creatures all have fled,
As the maples scream "oppression!"
And the oaks just shake their heads

So the maples formed a union
And demanded equal rights.
"The oaks are just too greedy;
We will make them give us light."
Now there's no more oak oppression,
For they passed a noble law,
And the trees are all kept equal
By hatchet, axe, and saw.....

-N.Peart

[Farview]

Originally Posted by TheBigGiantHead

Political correctness will be the end of the United States.

There is unrest in the forest,
There is trouble with the trees,
For the maples want more sunlight
And the oaks ignore their pleas.

The trouble with the maples,
(And they're quite convinced they're right)
They say the oaks are just too lofty
And they grab up all the light.
But the oaks can't help their feelings
If they like the way they're made.
And they wonder why the maples
Can't be happy in their shade.

There is trouble in the forest,
And the creatures all have fled,
As the maples scream "oppression!"
And the oaks just shake their heads

So the maples formed a union
And demanded equal rights.
"The oaks are just too greedy;
We will make them give us light."
Now there's no more oak oppression,
For they passed a noble law,
And the trees are all kept equal
By hatchet, axe, and saw.....

-N.Peart

Still doesn't answer my question.

[TheBigGiantHead]

No...you can't call yourself a cripple.
You're special.

[PhilGood]

Originally Posted by TheBigGiantHead

Political correctness will be the end of the United States.

Finally something we agree on!

[Dethska]

I like the Drum Dial. I'm tuning retar. . . crippl . . . handicapp . . . impaired. The Drum Dial has really helped me get good tunings out of my drums. They sound much better than before when I'd spend an hour tapping at each lug just to get frustrated.

If you already can tune a drum set by ear in five minutes, then getting one would be a waste of time. But if you are new to drums, or have trouble tuning by ear, then I think the Drum Dial is really helpful.

[dgatwood]

Originally Posted by Dethska

I like the Drum Dial. I'm tuning retar. . . crippl . . . handicapp . . . impaired. The Drum Dial has really helped me get good tunings out of my drums. They sound much better than before when I'd spend an hour tapping at each lug just to get frustrated.

If you already can tune a drum set by ear in five minutes, then getting one would be a waste of time. But if you are new to drums, or have trouble tuning by ear, then I think the Drum Dial is really helpful.

Agreed. Well, not sure about the drum dial, but I like my ratchet key....