The Studio Floor...

[SpencerSetters]

I record regularly in my basement, and I used to have carpet layed out. It recently got torn up becuase it was old and gross looking. I need something that looks professional. What is the best type of flooring I can put in my basement. And remember, I'm not rich! Thanks!

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

Personally, in a basement I would use linoleum or linoleum tiles. Cheaper and easier than Parque(wood), easier to install, and won't be subject to moisture. There are SOME laminate floorings that resist moisture, but for the above reasons, I'd go with linoleum roll. Good reflection too. Use some broadband absorption(fabric covered rigid fiberglass) panels on the ceiling.

[peritus]

I would either go with what Rick said or maybe consider staining the bare concrete... Not sure how moisture would impact it though....

[SpencerSetters]

What do you guys think of this type of flooring, its a lamanent.

Lamanent Honey Oak Floor

[mtx records]

looks nice to me, if i didn't already have carpet i think i would get some of that myself

[Dani Pace]

If you go for the laminent flooring be sure to seal the concrete first. Moisture from the concrete could cause warping. I've seen this happen, it's not a pretty sight and a real pain to repair.

[HapiCmpur]

Originally Posted by SpencerSetters

What do you guys think of this type of flooring, its a lamanent.

I used a laminate with pretty satisfactory results. (Click the signature for pics.) I second what Dani P said about sealing the slab, but I didn't do it myself and haven't had any problems so far. Instead, I put down plastic sheeting with big overlaps. If I had to do it again, though, I'd seal it, just in case. I'd also use glue-together planks instead of snap-together. I chose snap-together because it brought the skill level of the job down to my limited abilities, and so I saved money on installation. The tradeoff is that the floor creaks and pops underfoot in several places, and that's not good for recording. I think glue-together planks would be quieter.

[pandamonk]

happy camper, I've been looking for your site for AGES. I think it was the first site i found that had anything about acoustic treatment, and i've wanted to show people it since then, but have never found it!!! YEY!!!

[SpencerSetters]

Thanks for all your help, from this I think first seal the concrete slab. Then, I want to find a lamanent floor that resists moisture and put it down with glue.(I will ask home depot, or find someone in my family that has done laminent flooring before and ask them what is best) None of this popping and squeaking! I will post pictures of my progress, and considering I tore up the old carpet and I still have clients scheduled, It will have to be done VERY soon!

[mshilarious]

I would recommend a hardwood laminate rather than the wood-look stuff. frederic was the first to clue me in, but the laminate gives very harsh-sounding reflections. I am tearing up a laminate floor in my studio right now and replacing with Tarkett Vanguard from Home Depot, which is a real hardwood veneer laminate product, it installs exactly like the regular laminate (no glues, no nails, snap-together), but sounds better and is softer on the feet. It comes prefinished but can supposedly be sanded and refinished a few times, like regular hardwood.

It is more expensive, actually only a little cheaper than real hardwood, but the ease of installation is a big plus

[SpencerSetters]

I like the idea of the real wood laminate rather than a fake wood laminate, makes sense. Need to get that big warm sound! But I came up with an idea, I listened to a song or two from all of my favorite CDs and listened for the biggest and warmest sounding. It was a hard decision, but I chose Strapping Young Lad's "Alien" produced by Devin Townsend. I found that they recorded at The Armoury Studios which was designed by John Vrtacic. He puts a floating floor down and underneath lays sand. I'm a little to cheap for that. But I just want to know what kind of wood they lay on their floor, so I can do the same! And maybe one day Ill put the real suspened floor down! Here are pictures of the floors that this guy has designed, I just dont know what it is...





Do you guys know what is on that floor?

[mshilarious]

Originally Posted by SpencerSetters

Do you guys know what is on that floor?

Hard to tell, one piece in the top picture looks figured, so it could be cherry or maple maybe. The top picture has a lot of variation, so maybe it's mixed species of wood, not sure.

However the sound from those rooms is probably more dependent on the fact that they are BIG, complex shapes, with a proper balance of absorption, reflection, and diffusion. You aren't going to be able to emulate that in a small room simply by selecting the "right" species of hardwood.

[SonicClang]

Originally Posted by peritus

...or maybe consider staining the bare concrete... Not sure how moisture would impact it though....

Stained concrete is extremely moisture retardent. The reason being, the stain actually chemically changes the color of the concrete. It's not just a paint or a coloring, it's like when you glaze a pot and put it in the kiln. Just make sure though that when you "seal" the floor after the staining process, don't use an oil-based polyurethane. Use something water-based. The concrete needs to breath. No matter what, moisture will come up through the concrete, if you use an oil-based sealant the water has no place to go and before long you'll have to strip the poly and re-seal the floor.

I'm planning on doing stained concrete in my studio. Check out this site here http://www.kemiko.com/ It appears to me to be an extremely affordable solution and looks VERY professional. I've talked with a couple people who've done their studio and/or house with this and they're more than happy with the results. Besides re-applying the sealant yearly, it's virtually maintanence free.

[big country]

real wood floors are way more expensive .not realy shure if real wood would sound better or not. Id recomend going with the laminate plus a floating floor
is a must .I bought mine at Cost co. I think it cost something like 100.00 dollars
for a 12/8 space it looks good . I bought a rug at home depo for 30.oo bucks.
looks awsome put down some big bass board all for under 200.00 bucks. dont
for get to put some kind of padding down under the floor.

[HapiCmpur]

Originally Posted by pandamonk

happy camper, I've been looking for your site for AGES. I think it was the first site i found that had anything about acoustic treatment, and i've wanted to show people it since then, but have never found it!!! YEY!!!

Awesome! Thanks, pandamonk. It's good to be rediscovered.

Originally Posted by mshilarious

frederic was the first to clue me in, but the laminate gives very harsh-sounding reflections.

I remember frederic waxing eloquent one time about the "sock appeal" of hardwood floors, but I don't recall anyone in that thread explaining how hardwood could sound any different than a laminate. If true, it's certainly counter-intuitive. Seems to me that since hardwood floors are protected by the same kind of tough, durable surface layers that get put on laminates, any self-respecting sound wave would bounce off either one without being influenced too heavily by what's underneath. Anybody got the science on this?

[SpencerSetters]

Well, I do know that different types of wood change the sound of a guitar, and a drum, so why not the sound of a room? But I don't know the science behind this at all! Anyway, I already started sealing my concrete...

[SonicClang]

Started sealing the concrete........ umm.... well, I guess that rules out stained concrete!

Spencer, the only "science" you need to know about the floor is that you don't want it to color the sound of the instruments at all. That's why everyone recommends extremely reflective coverings. Carpet will absorb the highs, yet leave the lows to continue bouncing around. This leaves the room sounding boomy. If you have a reflective floor, counter the reflections by adding absorption to the ceiling. The only thing you need to remember is, floor = no absorption = happy sound.

[mshilarious]

Originally Posted by HapiCmpur

Anybody got the science on this?

No, but anecdotally, when I drop a cable end on a laminate floor, the sound hurts my ears, but when I do the same on a wood floor, it doesn't.

Originally Posted by SpencerSetters

Well, I do know that different types of wood change the sound of a guitar, and a drum, so why not the sound of a room?

I'm sure it has some effect. But will the "right" wood suddenly make an 11x14 room with 8' ceilings sound like a professional studio with a live room big enough for an orchestra? I'm afraid not. Thus your efforts are better concentrated in other areas, such as proper absorption--especially bass.

[SpencerSetters]

SO really, it doesnt matter what kind of floor I put down at all?

[HapiCmpur]

Originally Posted by mshilarious

No, but anecdotally, when I drop a cable end on a laminate floor, the sound hurts my ears, but when I do the same on a wood floor, it doesn't.

No surprise there, but that's not necessarily an applicable anecdote -- unless, of course, Spencer intends to record himself playing his floor. The question is, what will different floor surfaces do with sound waves bouncing off them from other sources? I'm still not convinced that a finished wood floor will behave any differently than a laminate in that regard.

Originally Posted by SpencerSetters

SO really, it doesnt matter what kind of floor I put down at all?

Whoa! Slow down there, Spence. Just because we're saying the floor won't make all the difference in the world doesn't mean it won't make any difference at all. Follow SonicClang's advice and balance your (mostly) reflective floor with a (mostly) absorbant ceiling. And read this if you haven't already seen it: http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html, especially the sidebar titled "Hard floor, soft ceiling."

[SonicClang]

Originally Posted by SpencerSetters

SO really, it doesnt matter what kind of floor I put down at all?

Did you read my reply? You did get that carpet is bad right? That should illustrate the point to you that what you put down does matter.

For the most part, if it's hard, it's reflective. But there are certain circumstances where some floors may act almost like the head of a drum and have resonance, thus creating a spike in your room's frequency response. This is why I'm going with stained concrete.

[Innovations]

Nearly anything in a basement has a potential for water damage. If you wanted good appearance I would go laminate. If you wanted good functionality I would suggest interlocking rubber flooring squares...easy on the feet, easy to install, and pretty much impervious to water damage.