Digital piano help please

[zbert]

As I now get "real" piano players in my studio the comment I get is "I need to get a digital piano with a real feel". What I own in keyboards are a Korg X3 and a Roland xp9 piano. The sound of the Roland is pretty good but no weighted keys. I've been reading many of the posts here to get some ideas. I've to narrow down my choices but being a drummer I need keyboard help. This piano will only be for my home studio recording. Trying to keep the budget down around $600
Option 1 Casio Privia 310. Nice feel and piano sound but I don't really need the other 202 sounds and all the bells and whistles.
Option 2 Buy a weighted controler and midi it to the Roland ep9
Option 3 Buy a weighted controler and get Steinberg The Grand.

I'm leaning toward option 3 but that leads me to the question of who sells a decent weighted 88 key controler?
Thanks for any help or suggestions.
Tom

[ssscientist]

This has gotten a good review in my favorite mag, Sound on Sound.

If you're not near a dealer to audition it you could order it and have some of your piano playing clients try it. The retailer in the link has a 30-day period for returns.

[zbert]

Originally Posted by ssscientist

This has gotten a good review in my favorite mag, Sound on Sound.

If you're not near a dealer to audition it you could order it and have some of your piano playing clients try it. The retailer in the link has a 30-day period for returns.

I tried the prokeys 88 piano and found the action to be, for lack of a better word, mushy when campared to the privia.

[ssscientist]

You asked.

I answered.

I don't play piano well enough to be picky about the controller I use so I need to rely on reviews from those I trust.

[SonicAlbert]

Any controller that sells for $399 is not going to have an action that will satisfy your piano playing clients. I don't need to play it to know that.

I'm not sure what used Yamaha S80's sell for, but they have a pretty good piano action. Likewise the S90, but that will be beyond your budget. If you can find a used Yamaha KX88 controller in good shape that would be another contender.

Roland keyboards to look at would be the A-90 or A-80 controllers (A-80 may be especially hard to find). The XV-88 synth actually has a decent keyboard action.

Some of the Korg 88 note keyboards feel pretty good, but will be pricey.

Another avenue is to look at consumer oriented electronic pianos offered by Yamaha, Roland, and Kawai. Some of them actually feel decent to play. It seems like that is more what the Casio Privia 310 is about, but I've not played that one, so I don't want to say anything (despite my earlier comment).

[zbert]

Thanks, some good keyboards to look into. I guess I need to go to the software form to check on Steinberg Grand piano.

[doc_keys]

well this bites

I typed this big response and my computer froze and I last it so this will be short.

Stay away from Casio

Roland-A90ex is good, on board sounds and a great controller, I have an A70
Yamaha Motif8-good but spendy
Korg Triton-My fav, I have a studio 88 and it wasnt cheap but I think it rocks!
Alesis-QS8.2, this was the new version they came up with when they will pulled from chapter 11, I think they were saved by Harmon dont remember. Anyways, drums from SR16/D4 drum module. Being a drummer I thought you would appreciate that.
I own a KX88 that I might sell if you're interested. Its currently at my moms in California in storage, I didnt have room for it and I would like to see it go to someone that would take care of it. Its been used but last time I used it, it still worked great, its a heavy cuss though.

Anyways good luck on the search!

doc

[SonicAlbert]

Some good specific suggestions from doc! I forgot about the Alesis QS 8.2.

This is above your price range, but the Triton LE 88 (the one with the piano expansion board) is pretty good as well. As always, it gets easier the more money you spend.

I own a Roland A-70 with the VER-D1 piano expansion board, the same piano that's in the A-90EX. In it's day it was great, but now there ar better out there. Mind you, I still use the VER-D1 piano just because it is so convenient because it is an internal board. But if you are buying new today you could probably do better.

The only thing about Steinberg the Grand or any software piano is that you have to have a computer beefy enough to run it with very low latency. With sampled pianos there can't be much of any delay between striking the key and hearing the sound come out, because that's the way it is with a real piano.

[soundchaser59]

Originally Posted by SonicAlbert

If you can find a used Yamaha KX88 controller in good shape that would be another contender.

Mine is doing great.....!!! And it is, unfortunately for you, not for sale! But it is the best controller keyboard I've played in my basement.....

Best thing that hapened to mine was the dealer shipped it to yamaha for a minor fix, and on the way UPS crushed it, a stack of heavy parcels fell over on top of it. So when I got it back it was bascially a completely gutted and factory refurbished KX88! All expense paid keyboard vacation courtesy of UPS!

[Beck]

Yamaha Clavinova -- many older models to choose from... features vary.
Kurweil -- lots of good choices over the years... I liked the RG100/200 from years ago.

Not first choices as MIDI controllers, but 88 keys with a decent feel, and stylish.

[zbert]

So I think my money will be best spent on a keyboard that has mainly piano sounds (not a full synth) for the best sound and I guess I should bring up my budget a couple of hundred to get something with good feel. The search continues. Thanks for the advise.
Tom

[littledog]

I've been playing piano for almost 50 years and own a Steinway B, so I'm pretty picky about piano actions. I may be representative of the clients you are trying to please. Unless things have changed recently, there were only two major manufacturers of keyboard actions - Yamaha (for Yamaha obviously) and Fatar (for everyone else).

Of the two, my personal preference is the Yamaha action. Combined with the triple sampled piano on the S90, it is the best piano in a box I have ever played. I also have a Kurzweil PC2x (Fatar action) in my studio, and my clients (which have included many of the top Pros in New England) tend to pick the S90 over the Kurzweil by a huge majority when able to play them side by side.

In addition, the S90 has a huge collection about 1000 Motif sounds in it, which adds to its value beyond just being a piano.

[zbert]

How far down the Yamaha line can I go (for budget reasons) and still get good action? I don't mind buying used.
Thanks again

[rushofblood]

CME? I have one, it's really good, but it's not the 88-key, which is supposed to be piano-style action.

[doc_keys]

Is this post still going? I keep forgetting to go to this forum mainly because I dont use this pc much anymore, I should favorites this site at my work so when Im slow I can keep up with you guys.

Anyways, my reply regarding the S90, the choice of Michael W Smith and others alike. I had wondered about that keyboard, how good it actually was. I thought about the next keyboard I bought would be the Motif8 but thats all I need is another beefy keyboard to carry around. I remember the days when Korg sponsered Smitty but I guess those days are gone and so are the days of the O1WproX. Dont get me wrong, I love my Triton Studio 88 but I was thinking about leaving it in the Studio and looking for a live gigging board (man I hate the keyboard on this computer), anyways, tell me more about the S90. I havent seen it anywhere here in Boise so demo it. My church is looking into getting more into loops and I am thinking that the Motif would be a better option instead of a stage piano. What about the Motif rack, any opinions on this guy?

PS-I still have a KX88 that might still be for sale, you would have to pay shipping to send it to you, just FYI. Worked fine last time I plugged it in but it could be due to replace the internal battery.

[littledog]

Originally Posted by doc_keys

Dont get me wrong, I love my Triton Studio 88 but I was thinking about leaving it in the Studio and looking for a live gigging board (man I hate the keyboard on this computer), anyways, tell me more about the S90. I havent seen it anywhere here in Boise so demo it.

What is it you want to know?

[Toddskins]

Hey Zbert,

I'm a Kurzweil guy, through and through, but I seriously consider what others write. That said, I checked Ebay and found a Roland A90 for sale, you may wish to look at. Apparently, many other people have already bid on this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Roland-A-90-EX-A...QQcmdZViewItem


Here is a couple Kurzweil PC2x boards:

http://cgi.ebay.com/KURZWEIL-PC2X-PC...QQcmdZViewItem


and a Kurzweil PC-88:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Kurzweil-PC-88-K...QQcmdZViewItem



Lastly, I was just kinda thinking, while I was reading your own posts, that since you are not a pianist, it might be extremely wise to allow your piano friend(s) (especially the one you most respect as a pro), to help you with your evaluation.

Regards.

[zbert]

Hey
Thanks for the heads up on the Roland. I gonna check to see how much to fix the keys. I did get in touvh with a couple of piano playing friends. Most seem to agree on Yamaha. Especially the p80 (discontinued) or the p90. A used p80 seems best to fit my budget. Thanks again for the help.

[cortexx]

check this one out , CME are getting rave reviews i have never seen anything negative about them.

http://www.arbitermt.co.uk/cme/images/uf8.jpg

It looks cool , built like a tank and is supposed to be very good for the hammer action, piano crew

I havnt tried one yet but im tempted, going for piano lessons and playing synths at home is hurting me, takes me about 15 minutes in lesson to get used to the hammer action each time

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by SonicAlbert

If you can find a used Yamaha KX88 controller in good shape that would be another contender. Roland keyboards to look at would be the A-90 or A-80 controllers (A-80 may be especially hard to find). The XV-88 synth actually has a decent keyboard action. Another avenue is to look at consumer oriented electronic pianos offered by Yamaha, Roland, and Kawai. Some of them actually feel decent to play. It seems like that is more what the Casio Privia 310 is about, but I've not played that one, so I don't want to say anything (despite my earlier comment).

Exactly my sentiment.

A80 probably advanced and modernized master keyboard (GUI and usage) department, unlike any other masterkeyboard. When Peavey decided to make uncompromising (DPMC8) attempt making finest masterkeyboard, they employed A80 almost exact graphic interface, and for a good reason.

Only thing that later exceeded the key grade was and still is MP9500 Kawai

Back to you zbert

On qualitative level , one would assume that both German car trio would from point of product evolution offer the same quality of manual gear. Sadly they don’t. Bavarian boy offers the best grip, while others two try to catch up. Also, they all offer 4wheel drive, but this time Quattro leaves other two into the shade. It is just more refined.

To find analogy in keyboards, sadly the best sound is often not match with equal keyboard quality.

So ironically for my ears, presently best piano sample of Fantom and RD700SX are in mercy of not equally good keys, Yamaha has one notch better grade feel, while again, fantastic MP9500 graced with real wood (!) keys, has at best very ordinary piano sample.

Kurzweil again excels in Piano, but with average keyboard feel for my taste. However, its piano sample compared with recent Fantom/700SX has clearly less resolution and sophistication.

See if you can find used RD700, and as SonicAlbert suggested, equilibrate between Yamaha/Roland/Kawai to find your match of sample/keyboard combination.

Each has more then plenty models to choose in your budget range, specially Yamaha.

[Todzilla]

Anthony's statements are highly subjective.

I gave close consideration to the Yamaha line before going with a Roland RD-300SX. Was it a better digital piano? for me it was, but it's just a matter of taste. I find Yamaha feel to be too "spongy" and Roland's far more reminiscent of the Sohmer upright that I play regularly. And there are tens of thousands of piano players that feel Yamaha is superior to Roland.

But above all else, YMMV.

[warble]

As Sonic stated, a used S80 would be a great board. I own one and have no plans to ever get rid of the thing. Great feel - I actually look forward to playing it. It's feel is a little different than the S90 and newer boards simply by the fact that is has balanced hammer action (plays pretty equally from low to high) - not graded which heavier in the low-end, lighter in the high-end. I think the intention of the action was for playing more "synth" type sounds, but still offering great action & playability for the piano/rhodes sounds. Did I mention that I love my S80?

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Todzilla

Anthony's statements are highly subjective.

Do we characterize something as highly subjective when it becomes completely opposite from our own set of disciplines, or when all accepted concept excludes recognizable wis?

I hardly see how my opinion is more or less subjective then yours, as every individual statement is inevitably in a way subjective Per Se.

Originally Posted by Todzilla

And there are tens of thousands of piano players that feel Yamaha is superior to Roland. But above all else, YMMV.

Tens thousands of piano players could fit this statement in relation to any brand, in fact I’m sure there are Tens thousands of Casio and Technics players exactly Content about their own choice

[warble]

Originally Posted by Todzilla

Anthony's statements are highly subjective.

I gave close consideration to the Yamaha line before going with a Roland RD-300SX. Was it a better digital piano? for me it was, but it's just a matter of taste. I find Yamaha feel to be too "spongy" and Roland's far more reminiscent of the Sohmer upright that I play regularly. And there are tens of thousands of piano players that feel Yamaha is superior to Roland.

But above all else, YMMV.

Different strokes.....

I do like the new Roland pianos though. Played a RD700sx and thought to myself "what a great piano sound, but I wish I liked the feel of this thing better".

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by warble

Different strokes.....I do like the new Roland pianos though. Played a RD700sx and thought to myself "what a great piano sound, but I wish I liked the feel of this thing better".

Exactly, S90ES for me , offers the better keyboard, not perfect, but better. S90ES offers a very good piano also, but it is evident Roland created more priority making a piano sample. But in a way, Yamaha has more piano models then Roland , and more profiled segments in its piano offer, so this could be partly, one the reasons.