Vocal Effects (Harmonies, etc)

[andibleed]

Im wondering what hardware can create harmonies and do pitch correction and the like. The only company I have seen is TC Helicon.

Thanks.

[notbradsohner]

Evintide......

[Big Kenny]

Antares.. p.s. They all sound like robots and suck. Sing your harmonies, don't "create" them

[soundchaser59]

Only one I've actually used is Digitech, but it was old and it sounded like "a digital novelty" mostly because it was only using a 12-bit output. The new 16 and 24 bit units might be a lot better.

These "machines" can fill in the gaps in places where you hope people wont really be listening critically.....but BigKenny is right, it is MUCH better to sing the harmonies. If you are not comfortable doing that, consider "hiring" a friend to sing for food, or consider taking 10 or 20 voice lessons. 10 voice lessons paid off for me more than anything else I've done since I learned how to play piano and guitar and bought a real bass. I gave that Digitech beast to my brother after that.....

[andibleed]

Does anyone know the theory behind harmonies? Maybe its something simple Im missing?

[e-dog]

Harmony is just singing notes that are different than the melody, basically.

Singing "good" harmony is more complicated, but, that's music theory and stuff, and generally dependent on personal taste.

If you have no idea what you're doing, try picking out some songs that have harmonies you like and sing along with them, if you can hear the different parts, try to sing them, like switch from a high part to a low part and back and forth.

That'll give you a general ear for how it works.

Maybe make a CD of your stuff and drive around in your car trying to sing along NOT singing the notes of the melody, and see what sounds good.

Also, harmonies can be in "unison" like singing along with the melody, but different notes, or can be antiphonal or contrapuntal or in "blocks" where you're singing completely different stuff, like "doo wah oooh" kinda stuff.

The poor man's harmony is usually just mostly made up from singing the melody an interval up or down from the actual notes be it a third, fourth, fifth, sixth, or seventh.. depending on the music style or artist/composer's tastes.

If you want to do REALLY crazy shit like the beatles you could try singing an occassional note from a different key, spicing up the melody with dissonant touches.

But "harmony" is just different notes from the melody.

Technically a guitar chord is "harmony" if used to support a melodic line, and speaking of chords, any of those notes should work for a supporting vocal part.

I'd just mess around and see what sounds good.



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[sweetpeee]

Originally Posted by andibleed

Does anyone know the theory behind harmonies? Maybe its something simple Im missing?

Play a chord on whatever instrument you play. Try to sing each individual note...that's harmony.

J.P.

[ez_willis]

Originally Posted by e-dog

Harmony is just singing notes that are different than the melody, basically.

Singing "good" harmony is more complicated, but, that's music theory and stuff, and generally dependent on personal taste.
.

Harmony and melody are two different animals

Harmony is simultaneously using different notes that compliment each other relative to a particular scale, could be a vocal harmony or a chord on an instrument.

A melody is a "rhythmically organized sequence of single tones so related to one another as to make up a particular phrase or idea"(dictionary.com).

You can have a melody with one note, not so with a harmony.

There's a whole world of theory out there, explore it, it can only benefit you.

[ez_willis]

Oh, and the best hardware made for creating vocal harmonies is the human being.

[wbcsound]

Originally Posted by Big Kenny

Antares.. p.s. They all sound like robots and suck. Sing your harmonies, don't "create" them

While I'll agree they don't sound perfect, I saw a live demo of the TC Helicon floor unit at the Dallas Guitar show and it basically sounded like real people singing with a chorus effect applied. There were no pitch or tracking glitches and the modeled voices didn't sound like traditional fake pitch shifting, they actually sounded like other signers.

They even pulled someone out of the crowd who was kinda pitchy and the pitch correction on the artificial harmonies was excellent. If I didn't know better, I would have thought "Why did the sound guy put all the chorus on the backups?" not "That harmonizer sounds like crap..."

[gcapel]

Originally Posted by notbradsohner

Evintide......

Evintide is the sheeioot..... $$$ though

[Big Kenny]

I've got one of the tc Voice Ones and for what it is it sounds good. If I get somebody that is having a tough time I can throw the pitch correction on and it doesn't sound as bad as the guy missing the note. Sometimes it can add, but mostly I think you should sing it till ya get it right.

[Robert D]

I'll just add here that if you don't understand harmonies, you're not going to be able to effectively use a harmonizer anyway.

[scrubs]

Originally Posted by andibleed

Does anyone know the theory behind harmonies? Maybe its something simple Im missing?

http://www.alandmoore.com/ramblings/.../vocalharm.htm

[flamin-gitaur]

THIS is all you need.

[roadwarrior]

Having worked with the TC-Helicon VoiceWorks now for several months all I can say is it earns it's keep in the first hour of use. It is dead on accurate and is entirely governed by the user. This means that you can make the harmonies (all 4 of them two up and two down) as accurate and where you want them all with the custom parameter adjustments. It allows for every harmony known to man and with great accuracy. Astoundingly real IMHO. You can even dial in a slight delay between the main and harmony voices. Pitch is superb as well allowing for as much sensitivity and accuracy as desired. The built in effects are TC all the way (as good as it gets). For about $600 USD there is NO better deal out there. Quiet as a church mouse with one heck of a sweet preamp on board to boot. Aside from the Korg D3200 perhaps the best thing I've bought since.

[punkin]

For good and natural sounding harmony parts, you still need to know something about chord structure and fundamental music threory. NO product on the market will fix this lack of understanding. You might get lucky here'n there but the best solution is learn the basics and sing the harmonies.

Seriously consider taking beginner piano lessons. You'll catch on quickly and that way, learn to read and write music and the big bonus...a new way to work out your vocals and harmonies while sitting at the keyboards.

[Robert D]

Originally Posted by punkin

Seriously consider taking beginner piano lessons. You'll catch on quickly and that way, learn to read and write music and the big bonus...a new way to work out your vocals and harmonies while sitting at the keyboards.

Great advice. Many years ago I took a piano class and a music appreciation class at a community college. It was fun, and very rewarding, even if you don't plan on becoming a pianist. The keyboard makes it so much easier to visualize music theory than a guitar neck does.

[fraserhutch]

Originally Posted by Robert D

Great advice. Many years ago I took a piano class and a music appreciation class at a community college. It was fun, and very rewarding, even if you don't plan on becoming a pianist. The keyboard makes it so much easier to visualize music theory than a guitar neck does.

Agreed, 100%.

Most musicians I grew up with and certainly all I studied with in college managed at least a basic level of proficiency on the piano. Few of them would consider themselves pianists.

It just amazes me that anyone who is serious about music composition has not worked at obtaining at least minimal keyboard skills.

[Big Kenny]

Originally Posted by fraserhutch

It just amazes me that anyone who is serious about music composition has worked at obtaining at least minimal keyboard skills.

What does that mean?

[fraserhutch]

Originally Posted by Big Kenny

What does that mean?

Oops, typo, fixed.

[MOFO Pro]

Pitch correct while mixing... not tracking... and only correct what needs fixing... no reason to correct the whole track if the vocalist only misses a few notes... Sounds a hell of a lot more transparent...

Oh... I've use the TC Helicon Voiceworks... and what he said... best value out there... Canned harmony patches are a bit in your face... but with a bit of tweeking... very useable... I mostly pitch correct with it...

[e-dog]

maybe i'm wrong but, aren't harmonizers like the #2 thing wrong with music?

#1 being pitch correction?

(no offense, i'm sure it's useful on certain problem stuff...)

no wait, clear channel is #1... bump everybody down.


oo! I just though of my very first sig file!

just a minute...



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[e-dog]

ahhhhhhhhhhh...

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[sajs]

I own a TC VoiceLive. I use it at our gigs because unfortunately, I am the only one who can sing. My band mates are great musicians, but don't have a voice.

I just dial up the song, press a foot switch, and it's like have 2-4 of me in harmony.
I only use 2 part harmonies for most of our songs. One nice feature is the harmony hold button, as long as I hold that foot switch in, the box will sustain, oohs,etc. while I sing lead over them.

I don't use the pitch correction.