LITTLE PIGNOSE Mic'ing Prob.

[rayc]

Hi,
All the talk of little/cheap amps reminded me that, though I REALLY enjoying playing through my tiny Pignose, I've not found the secret to mic'ing it. Obviously I can take the line out of the back but it doesn't have the same quality as the air moving version.
Any trade or oersonal secrets out there that you'd be willing to pass on?
Cheers & thanks in advance.
rayC

[noisedude]

What are you doing to mic it at the moment? As much detail as possible, and we'll work from there. The Pignose things are pretty cool as practice amps go.

[rayc]

noisedude
I've tried all the (cheap) mics I usually use:
Behringer XM8500 Dyn
La Grange DM1100 Dyn
Primo DM 260
Sony ECM 19B Cond.
A Behri pre & the, actually quite good, pres in my MT1004 track.

Very loud, loud & just enough to get the sound.

All pretty much straight on in the pig's face from 3 to 30cm distance. None of which actually captures the real sound of the amp.
Cheers
rayC

[Anfontan]

I have read that Frank Zappa used the pignose for a lot of his guitar lead overdubs. I think he would open the case up and lay it on it's back, then point a mic straight down at it. There were stories in Guitar Player magazine that could tell the specifics and the microphones he used, try checking in the archives at Guitar Player online.

[Farview]

Do you have a 57?

Laying the amp on its back will help give it some low end, put the mic about a foot above.

[Outlaws]

Move the mic off center will help sometimes.

Also, using two mics (one close and one a few feet away) can give good results too.

And one mroe thing....every mic collection needs a sm57 and/or 58.

[rayc]

I know I can get a GREAT sound from my Marshall Superbass MkII with any of the mics in my list.
I've perversly avoided the Shure 57/58 because everyone has one/wants one/suggests one. Mayhap I should own one!
I take note & try the recco's regarding placement, double mic'ing & open/shut back.
The opening & shutting REALLY makes a diff. With someone's help or running a recorded line in the open/shut fluctuations create a very amusing/interesting quasi Wah effect.
Many, like Zappa, have used the widdle pig for great sounds - it has a great tone for running a wah wah into as well.
I'll borrow a 57 & give that a burl as well.
Cheers
rayC

[Outlaws]

Originally Posted by rayc

I know I can get a GREAT sound from my Marshall Superbass MkII with any of the mics in my list.

Sometimes amps just only fit certain areas. Take a mental note of the sound got and one day it just might ring a bell as the perfect sound for something.

[rucarlso]

I tracked a guitar the other day with the pignose laying on its back with a Shure SM57 kissing the grill cloth and placed on the outer edge of the grill cloth circle. That went straight into my board to tape.

It came out righteous.

[twon]

[QUOTE=rayc
I've perversly avoided the Shure 57/58 because everyone has one/wants one/suggests one. Mayhap I should own one!
rayC[/QUOTE]

correct, theres a reason why everyone has/wants one

[noisedude]

If you point at the centre of the cone it'll be too tinny, you need to get nearer the edge of the speaker. That's going to be harder with it being a small cone.

Also, take your mics off-axis ... like experiment with almost sideways on to the amp. I would get the closest to a 57 you have, turn it around 70 degress off-axis, put the capsule three quarters of the way to the edge of the speaker and work from there.

Let us know if that helps at all.

[philboyd studge]

Man, it's going back 30 years to an album project with my band but we used a pignose on a couple of tracks for a tighter sound. We opened the case with the pignose standing and used a 57 with a heavy blanket over the whole thing. Got an amazing sound on a pedal steel.

[gvarko]

Originally Posted by rayc

I've perversly avoided the Shure 57/58 because everyone has one/wants one/suggests one.

The 57 should be the first mic in your collection..

[gatholonobs]

Duct tape the mic end of a telephone to the pig nose's speaker. Then duct tape the left side of a pair of walkman headphones(this acts as a microphone) to the reciever end of another telephone in your house. Run the mic(headphone) to a Arion MTE-1 distortion pedal and crank the knobs up all the way. Run out of the Arion to a BBE processor and turn the knobs up full. Go BBE out to your recorder. This is how Metallica always record their guitars.

[rayc]

philboyd studge,
I ought to have mentioned I'd done the blanket routine - it did make a big improvement BUT wasn't close enough.
gatholonobs,
I believe you - but that's a hell of a set up to have come across in the 1st instance.
Just so you don't feel I'm being rude,
I've been searching ebay for a cheap 2nd hand 57. There're a heap of Chinese ones &, of the non-chinsoir, variations galore. Anyone have a spare to sell to a sonically improverished Orstraylyan?
I've been quite influenced by a British producer who suggests that the 57/58 thing is just an industry myth perpetuated by "those that have one".
He does REALLY good work using a variety of mics such as:
Sony electret condensers, pair, 1971.
Philco stereo mic, 1960’s, omni: Looks like a hand grenade. A dynamic mic with 4 capsule pick up.
Grampian DP4 dynamic: quintessential early 60’s British live mic.
“Empire Made” 60’s crystal mic
Realistic stereo electret condenser, 1970’s: looks like a bug.
Hong Kong 60’s pencil dynamic: no manufacturer.
And several other mic oddities for fx.
Perhaps I'll have to "suck it & see" - 'strine for try it & have an informed opinion.
Cheers
rayC

[Farview]

Originally Posted by rayc

I've been quite influenced by a British producer who suggests that the 57/58 thing is just an industry myth perpetuated by "those that have one".
rayC

What is the myth?

[rayc]

Farview,
The myth being that the 57 is THE point of reference &/or beginning/ending of the holy grail in rock'n'roll recording I guess.
Its ubiquity is astounding as witnessed by the references to it in this thread.
I won't say that I'm wedded to this position BUT am perverse enough to be cynical of it's ubiquity as well as of the apparent reliance on it particularly in this age where many "name" brands don't hold to the values they once did.
As mentioned, I'm seeking a 57 to actually make up my own mind - something I should've done before now.
Cheers
rayC

[Farview]

A 57 isn't the only thing, but it is a safe one that just about everyone can afford. I tend to favor 421's on guitars, but when that doesn't work, a 57 does.

Cliches and stereotypes end up being cliches and stereotypes because they work. Otherwise it would be a myth.

[rayc]

I've bought a 75 & will trial it this weekend - still sad though - kind of like finally eating Macca's food. - which I haven't done since about '76.
Cheers
rayC