703 - Framed?

[cincy_kid]

Well, I have been browsing these forums and reading various posts on absorbtion and read Ethan's acoustic page and just trying to figure out a few things. One question I have at this point is with the 2' x 4' sheets of 703 I will be purchasing.

I have a very small room (closet), which I will be recording and listening in:
See Room Here

I will be posting another thread here in a bit after I get into Photoshop and draw out wheer I plan to put everything, but before I get that far, my question about the fiberglass.

Ethan wrote in his article about placing strips of 1' x 2' wood on the walls and then screwing the 703 onto the strips. Then building a wooden frame, wrapped in fabric and screwing the frame over top of the fiberglass (for looks)

I also read other posts that said you build a 2' x 4' fram of wood, stuff the 703 inside the frame, and then wrap the entire thing in fabric, which then you can either hand from the ceiling or screw to the wall, etc.

Am I understanding both of these principles? If so, is one better than the other?

Thanks again,

cincy kid

[mshilarious]

Ethan's method (as you have described) results in a 3/4" airspace between the wall and the insulation. Provided you constructed your frame to leave the same gap, I don't believe there is any difference.

[cincy_kid]

Hrm, yes, but the more space between the wall and 703 the better I thought. Didn't know if it would be better to build the frames stuffed with 703 and then either hang them from the ceiling with fishing line or even use Ethan's method and double or triple the depth of the wooden strips.

Really I am trying to work on this:
Room Layout Thread

So, maybe I screw panels together with hinges and then hang some way?

[pandamonk]

Don't build the frame if hanging over head. Think about it. Do you really want some wood hanging over your head and equipment. For the "clouds", just wrap the 703 in fabric, and hang it from the ceiling with fishing line. There was a site with someone showing you how to make them, i forget what it is though. Someone help me out. And yes you're right, the further from the wall the 703 is, the better. The space causes it to absorb lower(more problematic)frequencies.

[cincy_kid]

Ok, good point

Thanks for the tip on the "clouds". Will the semi circle work? If so do I want to keep them as close together as possible?

[pandamonk]

Originally Posted by cincy_kid

Ok, good point

Thanks for the tip on the "clouds". Will the semi circle work? If so do I want to keep them as close together as possible?

I really am not sure. I'm not actually sure what you are asking, to be honest . Anyway, I'd build them is such a way that they can be used as bass traps when mixing. Actually you'r building them with hinges aren't you. So they fold out? When mixing I'd set them up like the attached pic. I'd also make a cloud and two broadband absorbers(like in the pic). Also your mixing position should be centred and not in the corner(like the pic shows, lol).

[pandamonk]

I just realised, your room is almost the same size my control room is going to be. even the door is in the same(ish) position. Ohh ethan, or someone who knows, will i need a cloud above my mixing position if the ceiling slants up to the back of my room, and the back is deadened? I'm guessing not, but need to make sure. Also, isn't it usually a problem to mount your speakers(ear height)on a desk? Is it because the reflections off the desk? What about if your desk slants? Theres a few questions to keep you busy. Thanks, The Panda MONK , lol

[cincy_kid]

so in your pic I would be singing from the desk? Also playing guitar from the desk area or behind where the other 2 absorbers are? Im more confused now

[pandamonk]

No, you mix and edit in that position, but when recording, do it as i mentioned before, but now you will have 2 more broadband absorbers so can place them all round you, so there are even less relections.

[giraffe]

Originally Posted by cincy_kid

I also read other posts that said you build a 2' x 4' fram of wood, stuff the 703 inside the frame, and then wrap the entire thing in fabric, which then you can either hand from the ceiling or screw to the wall, etc.

putting the frame around the sides (as opposed to behind the back) of the trap will reduce it's effectiveness somewhat.

[David Katauskas]

Oh...and get rid of that lighting. It will probably be very noisy. Get some nice incandescent lighting...it's really quiet, but it can warm the air a bit.

[cincy_kid]

Yea, for sure thought about replacing the lighting. Incandescent lighting is just regular lightin like in the old days right? Probably hook it up with a dimmer when I get that far.

[cincy_kid]

Originally Posted by giraffe

putting the frame around the sides (as opposed to behind the back) of the trap will reduce it's effectiveness somewhat.

I am not sure I understand what you mean here Giraffe. The way I pictured these panels was to cut some 1" x 2" pieces of wood into 4 pieces (2 that are a little over 4' and 2 that are a little over 2'). Nail, screw or glue them together to make like a picture frame. Then put the 703 inside of the framed wood and wrap it in fabric.

Are you saying it should be more like what I described above except also have a 2' x 4' piece of plywood or something covering one side of it so that only 1 side of the panel is fabric/703, while the other side is fabric/wood?

[Jeff_D]

FYI, dimmers *can* be noisy too.

[giraffe]

any wood covering the sides will reduce the effectiveness (not a ton, but some) of the absorbers.
build a frame that the 703 fits ON, not IN.

make the frame the same size (or slightly smaller) than the 703, and put it (the 703) on top of the frame.
wrapping the trap in fabric and attaching the fabric to the frame (staples or whatever) will hold the trap together fine.

[lomky]

Originally Posted by giraffe

any wood covering the sides will reduce the effectiveness (not a ton, but some) of the absorbers.
build a frame that the 703 fits ON, not IN.

make the frame the same size (or slightly smaller) than the 703, and put it (the 703) on top of the frame.
wrapping the trap in fabric and attaching the fabric to the frame (staples or whatever) will hold the trap together fine.

I've been following this thread, sorry if this is a hijack but, what are you facing the frame with? plywood? how thick?

I'm imagining (for lack of better words) a sealed box with 703 on the face. Is this correct?

[cincy_kid]

no problem lomky. To be honest I am stull confused and trying to picture how to make these panels. I keep reading posts on different boards though, I am getting closer to a visual!

[cincy_kid]

I saw this just a while ago when researching more about these panels.

See Photo Essay Here

Is this the way to do it? Obviously they work great for him but just wondering if its the way I should constrcut mine? Its kind of what I initially had in mind but after giraffe's comment of:

"any wood covering the sides will reduce the effectiveness (not a ton, but some) of the absorbers. build a frame that the 703 fits ON, not IN."

Now I am wondering which way works best.

[giraffe]

Originally Posted by lomky

I'm imagining (for lack of better words) a sealed box with 703 on the face. Is this correct?

no, sealed traps are something altogether different that i don't understand at all.
no plywood.

i wish i had pictures, what i'm talking about is just as easy as the pictures posted above but the traps would work slightly better because the sides aren't covered

i'm sorry, i didn't take pictures when i was building mine (the result just looks like a 4" trap flat on the wall, but it is a 2" trap with an airspace) and i'm at a loss to explain myself better.

following the photo essay will yield excellent results.

[cincy_kid]

Hey Giraffe,

no problem man, I am just a noob reading like crazy trying to figure some of this stuff out. I actually just ran across another cool link that shows panel absorbers, that once again, confuses me since every way/method I have read about or imagined have been different.

Here is the link

This way, looks to me, as if they glue the insulation (703) onto a piece of plywood. Then, after the frame is constructed, the insulation side goes DOWN into the frame. This seems to me as you will have plywood on one side, and timber wood on the other side, with just some insulation in the middle. I thought the insulation (wrapped in fabric) needed to "absorb" the frequencies. With this method I do not see how that is possible when the plywood is the material that will facing the room.

Anyways, I pick up (12) OC 703 2' x 4' panels tomorrow and will keep researching to find the best way to use them in my small space and will for sure start a thread and post pics as I go along.

Any other advice or pics / drawings (preferred) to show me the best or easiest way to utilize the 703 would be great

[giraffe]

you probably don't want panel absorbers. they don't absorb hi mids or hi's
and you have to (or at least should) tune them.

actually, these are the traps i mentioned that i don't know much about.

i would build them like the ones in the photo essay, because you probably need more broad band absorption, and not just bass traps.