Ion iED01 Electronic Drums - Adequate?

[bongolation]

Has anyone had a go at this set?

I've been trying to come up with a small, light set for my home studio to MIDI patch directly into the computer to run Drumkit From Hell or another velocity-layered drum program. The box on any set is irrelevant beyond being able to do that. Will it?

Does this set have velocity-sensitive pads? Choke rim on the cymbal pad?

I've gathered that this is a light-duty set, but I'm easy on this stuff. I just need to know if it'll work for the modest requirements I have. At $270 shipped from some discounters, the price will cover a lot of minor shortcomings.

Here they are.

[msblaze]

i don't know if they would be very good for a main set in a studio but i ordered some for a late night practice/backup kit in my studio for when my real drums arn't enough...i'll let you know how they sound/work ect

EDIT: just realized you have a home studio, i think this set would work great!

[jeffree]

Bong, there was a recent lengthy review in SOS mag if you run a search there:

http://www.soundonsound.com/

The review's actually quite positive, with the bang-for-low-buck value high. I remember that the brain for the Ion is the Alesis sr-16.

Best,
J.

[travelin travis]

check out page 6 of the manual:

http://www.ion-audio.com/manuals/iED01_Manual.pdf

[bongolation]

Originally Posted by jeffree

Bong, there was a recent lengthy review in SOS mag if you run a search there

Yes, it's there -- but it's not accessible to me, though.

[bongolation]

Originally Posted by TravisinFlorida

check out page 6 of the manual:

It doesn't actually tell me what I want to know, but there is a MIDI-out, which is at least suggestive that it might work as a straight controller -- which is what I'm after.

The strange part of this is that I saw a different .PDF of the instructions last night and it showed a totally different box! It had MIDI in and MIDI out/through.

[bongolation]

I think the best deal on these at the moment is from Amazon.Com -- $279.99, w/free shipping minus an additional 5%. Here it is...but I have to pay sales tax from Amazon. I wonder if I can get that price-matched somewhere. Suggestions? MF doesn't carry them.

[later:] Whoa. Amazon isn't charging tax for some reason -- so I ordered them. US$265.99 -- delivered!

[jeffree]

Originally Posted by bongolation

Yes, it's there -- but it's not accessible to me, though.

Sorry, Bong. I forgot that SOS blocks some reviews online for about six months. I read it in a bookstore and just remember that the review was surprisingly positive. The machine seems to be a useable set-up if low cost is a major concern. You may want to check out the Alesis sr-16 since that's the heart of the sounds. If I recall, the main criticism was the lightweight construction (as expected at this low price point) and flimsy pedals.

J.

[jesterscourt]

I too, am interested in this kit, certainly someone on this forum must have access to SOS, and could give us the basic rundown of the article?

The problem I have with the kit, from reviews, is that sometimes it doesn't trigger when it should, or double or triple triggers (in rapid succession) for things like the bass drum.

[peritus]

Originally Posted by jesterscourt

I too, am interested in this kit, certainly someone on this forum must have access to SOS, and could give us the basic rundown of the article?

The problem I have with the kit, from reviews, is that sometimes it doesn't trigger when it should, or double or triple triggers (in rapid succession) for things like the bass drum.

Ditto on all points...

[bongolation]

I saw the user complaint about multiple triggering of the bass pedal in a customer review that showed up on a number of sites. That's consistent with a broken/shorted piezo and I have seen it discussed before in threads about the defective cymbal pads that Roland had in their early V-drums, which cracked internally and did all sorts of multiple triggering weirdness. I think that that may be either preventable or repairable in these pedals, or at least a warranty fix. [shrug] Considering the abuse electronic drums take, I'm surprised this sort of thing isn't more common.

It looks to me as though these are merely made up of stock pads for both drums & cymbals, so there are probably no choke rings on the cymbal pads. Unfortunate, but I think I can live with it at the price. Additional pads are going for 2/$49 to fill out the set if it turns out to be any good.

I can see that this set is somewhat on the flimsy side compared to $1600 Roland drums, but it's just going to be set up once semi-permanently at home. If this set's merely good enough to hold up under light use purely as a velocity-sensitive percussion MIDI controller in my home studio, I'll regard it as wildly worthwile.

[bongolation]

Interestingly, this set is marketed in the UK under the Alesis name. Strange.

Yep, it sure looks like the brain is a SR-16. I still don't know for sure if this can be used as a straight MIDI percussion controller, though. I've been told that all such known units can be as that's a very fundamental function, but with my luck...

[peritus]

Originally Posted by bongolation

Interestingly, this set is marketed in the UK under the Alesis name. Strange.

Yep, it sure looks like the brain is a SR-16. I still don't know for sure if this can be used as a straight MIDI percussion controller, though. I've been told that all such known units can be as that's a very fundamental function, but with my luck...

I'm sure there is something here.... somewhere...

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...di&safe=active

[bongolation]

Originally Posted by peritus

I'm sure there is something here.... somewhere...

I found an SR-16 .PDF manual online and on page 41 there seems to be an answer to my question. It appears that MIDI function includes straight triggering of external devices.

[jesterscourt]

Google Groups Link

According to George Lawrence, it's a pile of steaming shit, nothing more than a toy. I kinda figured it was too good to be true, things of this nature generally are.

[travelin travis]

the SR-16 does'nt have trigger inputs. it has little trigger pads. it does look like the SR-16 though.

[bongolation]

Originally Posted by jesterscourt

Google Groups Link

According to George Lawrence, it's a pile of steaming shit, nothing more than a toy.

That was a relatively content-free thread. You can break it easily. So what? I already know that. I wouldn't be gigging with it. The only criticism that was meaningful for me -- and it's not even clear that it was referring to the same item -- was that there was some sort of latency issue. THAT would be fatal in my application, so I cancelled my order until I can get to the bottom of that.

[peritus]

Here's an idea you may of already thought of....

I saw these at Best Buy yesterday and scoffed at the price (don't remember it at the moment). I had look at them online and realized the markup...

However (as an angel appears on each shoulder).....

It would be cool if you went to a local store ... Tried it out... Took it back... and if you liked it... Order one online... Then we'd all know how useful it was... I'd do it, but I'm pretty much broke at the moment...

Just an idea....

Then again... bongolation could just fill us in....

[bongolation]

Originally Posted by peritus

It would be cool if you went to a local store ... Tried it out...

If these were anywhere locally where I could check them out, I would in a heartbeat, as all I'm really concerned about is the latency issue (which I suspect is BS, as there's no technical necessity for more than about 10ms uncompensated latency). I can get that scienced out in ten seconds with earphones.

All these things have to do for me is be a better percussion MIDI controller than a cheap keyboard. Enough silicone glue can take care of everything else.

[peritus]

Originally Posted by peritus

Here's an idea you may of already thought of....

I saw these at Best Buy yesterday and scoffed at the price (don't remember it at the moment). I had look at them online and realized the markup...

However (as an angel appears on each shoulder).....

It would be cool if you went to a local store ... Tried it out... Took it back... and if you liked it... Order one online... Then we'd all know how useful it was... I'd do it, but I'm pretty much broke at the moment...

Just an idea....

Then again... bongolation could just fill us in....

Lol... big error... I mean msblaze...

[peritus]

Originally Posted by bongolation

If these were anywhere locally where I could check them out, I would in a heartbeat, as all I'm really concerned about is the latency issue (which I suspect is BS, as there's no technical necessity for more than about 10ms uncompensated latency). I can get that scienced out in ten seconds with earphones.

All these things have to do for me is be a better percussion MIDI controller than a cheap keyboard. Enough silicone glue can take care of everything else.

Yup... My sentiments exactly... I'm leaning towards the percussion pads at the moment though... This product seems risky...

I'm thinking something like this would get me by til I can get some live drums...

[bongolation]

Originally Posted by peritus

Yup... My sentiments exactly... I'm leaning towards the percussion pads at the moment though... This product seems risky...

I'm thinking something like this would get me by til I can get some live drums...

Couple of points: Other than the control box, all these various sets really amount to is a bunch of piezo sensors stuck on the backs of things you hit. Seriously. That's all they are. One feels more like a real drum to someone, or the cymbal pads swing like real cymbals, or not even your roadie can bend or break them...but that's totally unimportant to me for my purposes, and a $1600 set won't do $1 more for me in real terms than this set will if it works, and that's the bottom line. I just need a velocity-sensitive something more or less drumlike to gate a software percussion synthesizer.

Second point: Playing drums on a keyboard is just too unnatural for me. I've tried, but it just ain't happenin'. I can't play an acoustic set in the studio because of noise concerns, mainly my destroyed ears, and I don't have room anyway. I have to have an electronic set to gate the computer and the smallest, least expensive set that can perform the function in a kit-like way without actually failing is the best choice for the application.

The requirements here are modest.

[peritus]

Originally Posted by bongolation

Couple of points: Other than the control box, all these various sets really amount to is a bunch of piezo sensors stuck on the backs of things you hit. Seriously. That's all they are. One feels more like a real drum to someone, or the cymbal pads swing like real cymbals, or not even your roadie can bend or break them...but that's totally unimportant to me for my purposes, and a $1600 set won't do $1 more for me in real terms than this set will if it works, and that's the bottom line. I just need a velocity-sensitive something more or less drumlike to gate a software percussion synthesizer.

Second point: Playing drums on a keyboard is just too unnatural for me. I've tried, but it just ain't happenin'. I can't play an acoustic set in the studio because of noise concerns, mainly my destroyed ears, and I don't have room anyway. I have to have an electronic set to gate the computer and the smallest, least expensive set that can perform the function in a kit-like way without actually failing is the best choice for the application.

The requirements here are modest.

Don't get the wrong idea... I'm not fighting you on your logic or anything. On the contrary, I agree on all of your points thus far (save the fact that I will have an acoustic kit someday (probably in addition to a midi kit)).... Just throwing that out there too... The point was, in my previous post, was not really the keyboard, but the drumpads... I'm on your side bro..

[travelin travis]

Originally Posted by bongolation

Couple of points: Other than the control box, all these various sets really amount to is a bunch of piezo sensors stuck on the backs of things you hit. Seriously. That's all they are. One feels more like a real drum to someone, or the cymbal pads swing like real cymbals, or not even your roadie can bend or break them...but that's totally unimportant to me for my purposes, and a $1600 set won't do $1 more for me in real terms than this set will if it works, and that's the bottom line. I just need a velocity-sensitive something more or less drumlike to gate a software percussion synthesizer.

Second point: Playing drums on a keyboard is just too unnatural for me. I've tried, but it just ain't happenin'. I can't play an acoustic set in the studio because of noise concerns, mainly my destroyed ears, and I don't have room anyway. I have to have an electronic set to gate the computer and the smallest, least expensive set that can perform the function in a kit-like way without actually failing is the best choice for the application.

The requirements here are modest.

Have you ever done any electronics assembly? Maybe you could put together one of these, http://www.edrum.info/index.html, combined with stuff like this, http://edrum.for.free.fr/, to put together what you need. I've thought about going this route many times. Usually though, I'm too broke or unmotivated to do anything about it.

After looking over the midi module a couple of times, it does'nt look very hard to build. The creator, Admir, says latency is around 4ms which is probably the same for other hi dollar modules. The price to put together the module is supposed to be 60 euro = $72. The drum stuff could be thrown together pretty cheap too out of pvc, wood, nuts/bolts, piezos, and wire, if you are'nt too concerned with cosmetics (sounds like your not). Here's the e-drum features:

15 velocity sensitive trigger inputs with adjustable gain
Five Dual Piezo inputs:
Hi-Hat top/edge
Snare head/rim
Crash Cymbal 1 bell/edge
Crash Cymbal 2 bell/edge
Ride Cymbal bell/edge
Two mode HiHat pedal operation:
Pedal potentiometer
Foot controller (CC04)
Four Mono Piezo inputs:
Bass Drum
Lo Tom
Mid Tom
Hi Tom
Two cymbal choke inputs
VU-Meters for each channel
Overflow indicator on each channel

Not bad for a $75 box. When uncle sam sends me some cash, I just might take a stab at it.

[peritus]

Originally Posted by TravisinFlorida

Have you ever done any electronics assembly? Maybe you could put together one of these, http://www.edrum.info/index.html, combined with stuff like this, http://edrum.for.free.fr/, to put together what you need. I've thought about going this route many times. Usually though, I'm too broke or unmotivated to do anything about it.

After looking over the midi module a couple of times, it does'nt look very hard to build. The creator, Admir, says latency is around 4ms which is probably the same for other hi dollar modules. The price to put together the module is supposed to be 60 euro = $72. The drum stuff could be thrown together pretty cheap too out of pvc, wood, nuts/bolts, piezos, and wire if you are'nt too concerned with cosmetics. Here's the e-drum features:

15 velocity sensitive trigger inputs with adjustable gain
Five Dual Piezo inputs:
Hi-Hat top/edge
Snare head/rim
Crash Cymbal 1 bell/edge
Crash Cymbal 2 bell/edge
Ride Cymbal bell/edge
Two mode HiHat pedal operation:
Pedal potentiometer
Foot controller (CC04)
Four Mono Piezo inputs:
Bass Drum
Lo Tom
Mid Tom
Hi Tom
Two cymbal choke inputs
VU-Meters for each channel
Overflow indicator on each channel

Not bad for a $75 box.

I wouldn't mind trying something like this but, honestly, I'm scared of PCB making techniques... I looked for a kit on his site... Didn't see one.... Sweet link though..