That 70's show... errr... vibe

[six]

I really love the way a lot of rocksongs from the late 60's and early 70's are mixed and therefore want to achieve something similar. I know it's kind of hard to get what I am after without a listening-example; I'm thinking of songs such as "hey joe" (jimi's AND deep purple's version), a lot of hendrix' stuff anyway and all those "could be on a vietnam movie soundtrack" songs.

It's understood that a lot of the 'vibe' comes from the way of playing, the instruments and the recording equipment used, BUT i'm sure there were some popular ways in mixing, typical reverbs and stuff like that.

any suggestions?

thanks

six

[SonicAlbert]

I think one of the best ways to get a particular vintage sound is to use the gear from that period. So I guess with the 70's you'd scare up some used gear by DBX, MXR and others, maybe some spring reverb, some early digital stuff perhaps. Then record it to tape, using Dolby or DBX noise reduction. Noise reduction, and Dolby in particular, is a huge part of that sound.

By using the correct vintage gear, even just some of it, you get closer to the authentic vibe in a very natural way.

[six]

yeah, that makes sense. but i'm soooooo digital . what about the waves plugins - anything I can use there? like the plate reverbs, vintage compressors. any "dolby" plugins?

[SonicAlbert]

You know, noise reduction is something that has by and large gone away. Except for those still using tape machines. There's really no need for noise reduction plugins because digital is so quiet. And the amazing thing is how common noise reduction was until really quite recently.

I think what you might want to do is study how recordings were mixed back then, and then use your plugins in clever ways to simulate that. For example, plate reverbs would have been used, as would spring reverbs. But probably the most important reverb used on major label releases would have been a chamber. An actual chamber, as in a chamber or a room or a stairwell with a playback system and mics to record the reverberation. This is a *huge* part of that sound. It's also something you could set up in your bathroom, or a hallway or stairwell and emulate fairly easily.

But as far as plugins that you can just call up and say "okay now I have my 70's sound", I really don't think so. I do think you can use the plugs to simulate, but you have to look back and study their actual mix techniques to be able to do that with any accuracy.

I think at the very least you'll want to use a tape simulation plug. Again, it won't be exact but it might get you in the ballpark.

[chessrock]

I think if you really want to get a 70's sound, you need to add a rythm track of a guitar plugged in to a wah pedal. And it has to go "wacka-wacka-wacka."

Just watch a lot of old 70's porn movies, or reruns of Magnum PI if you really want to get an idea of the effect.

That along with a thumpin,' poppin' bass. Something that goes "thumpity-thumpity thump," or "bippity-bappity-bap."

Plug in a disco ball and turn on some black lights if you really want to get in to the mood.

[hrwmusic]

Originally Posted by six

yeah, that makes sense. but i'm soooooo digital . what about the waves plugins - anything I can use there? like the plate reverbs, vintage compressors. any "dolby" plugins?

i know tape was what was mainly being used then but izotope's vinly plug in is free and can give you a cool vintage sound, including scratches/warp/dust/electrical noise/and you can changed the era in which it was made (probly my favorite).

it sounds kinda pointless reading it, but it can be fun to mess with and may give you the feel that you want.

[six]

chessrock: that's 10 years later, dude.

hrwmusic: I checked out Izotone. Like the elctric and mechanic noise. but it still doesn't sound "vintage" on a 2000-mix.

I still need MIXING hints. points to start from.

[tamky]

Good luck with using old '60s equipment. Look at a bunch of old photos of The Beatles in the recording studio with Sir George Martin and look at the equipment in the background. Do you think any of that archaic stuff is still around somewhere? Maybe in a recording museum. Would you be prepared to do all your recording on only 4-track tape and bouncing?

[Nakatira]

Well allong with getting all the vintage stuff, wich offcourse would get you closer to the sound you like.
I would suggest A very round bass, forgett tightness go for for looseness and deep ness, Be carefull with guitar distrotion, If you need to use it use Fuzz and lots of it.

Use loads of Plate and spring on the vox, Loads of the bands back in the late 60`s such as vanila fugde used "a bit to much" reverb.
Allthough its suiting.
Try using "cheat stereo" like the doors did on theire first record, with different instruments in each speaker, that will probbably give you a little of that stereo Sound.

[chessrock]

Originally Posted by six

chessrock: that's 10 years later, dude.

Hey, I WAS THERE! I KNOW! I had the disco and black lights in my room. Granted, I was only 8 yrs old, but I had them.

I'll give you the Magnum PI thing. That was definitely an 80's show, but Chips, man ... Chips. Ponch and John. Eric Estrada. Now there's a show for ya. Lot's of "wacka-wacka" guitar in the soundtracks for that one for sure. That's 70's.
.

[blackdiscoball]

I defintly second the old style production techniques, Im a big fan of that. A good example would be for instance on vocals, you could run them through a quick delay, with a single repeat to do a slab back echo like when they used a three hea tape deck, then run it into a plate reverb and maybe even roll of some highs and lows somewhere to mimic the tape compression. Thats A trick I love to do. Especailly the slab back, if tastefully done you dont even notice its there its more of a vibe thing. (just listen to purple rain, I must have listen to that album 100 times before I realized that there was a slap echo on almost EVERY song!)

[six]

Ok, so here's what I figured out so far (but keep on posting your ideas please):

- Don't DI the bass. If so, use a cab-simulator. I use mda-combo. Small, free and nice sounding, also includes speaker-distortion.
- Don't pan the drums too much.
- Don't use a wide stereo-image for the drum-verb. I set it to mono and it sounds authentic. For things like that mda-image is handy.

I think for guitars it would be best to actually record it wet, i.e. with (spring-)reverb -> mono, although this will limit fancy punch ins a bit.... so I don't do this. A mono verb might be juicy too.

by the way, this reminds me of my first - and so far only - "band in studio"-experience. I had this cheap sounding guitar-setup with a ton of cheapest reverb. I didn't know too much about mixing back then, and the engineer caught me on the wrong foot saying "the reverb you're using cost like 2 bucks 50, and mine in the desk is like 2000 bucks. so turn it of."
i didn't cause he was a dickhead. if he had said "recording dry will give me more freedom in the mixing stage" I would have. aaah, psychology.

well, just an anecdote, now back to the topic!

[hrwmusic]

Originally Posted by six

chessrock: that's 10 years later, dude.

hrwmusic: I checked out Izotone. Like the elctric and mechanic noise. but it still doesn't sound "vintage" on a 2000-mix.

I still need MIXING hints. points to start from.

i know that your looking for spacific mixing tips.
But you sure you didnt get anything out of the izotone?
if you want, id check out the era selections, they arent perfect for sure, but im sure if you worked it into your mix it could be effective (just in random fills or w/e). What you doing is pretty shaky to me because it took a hell of a lot of work to get down what they did. The izotope can give you a slight "vibe" of a vintage sound, but if your going for the full thing, becareful because you may end up with alot of noise that isnt as exceptable now, things werent ever done cheep back then, so go light on what you do (just a suggestion).

im getting the mxl v67g soon, which deffidentally has a warm/vintage feel to it (im sure you can find recordings). And im not saying to get that mic, i mean i pretty much just starting out so it'll work for me.
But maybe going with vintage gear/vintage sounding gear could solve the problem quickly...its in high demand right now, so why not. simple vintage mic replications and effect petals would do. <-just to make sure you dont go to crazy of effects, which if are especially cheep, cant be used in high concentration.

[hrwmusic]

Originally Posted by chessrock

Hey, I WAS THERE! I KNOW! I had the disco and black lights in my room. Granted, I was only 8 yrs old, but I had them.

I'll give you the Magnum PI thing. That was definitely an 80's show, but Chips, man ... Chips. Ponch and John. Eric Estrada. Now there's a show for ya. Lot's of "wacka-wacka" guitar in the soundtracks for that one for sure. That's 70's.
.

yeah hes right, jimi's famous for his wah wah petals