picked up my MSR from the tech today

[Seeker of Rock]

Just plugged it in and ran my first ever reel tape. No recording, still have to hook it up to the board and first and foremost tomorrow buy a power conditioner, so just making the reels move. Cool braking system. Anyway, I'll post a pic when the camera is done charging. Yeah I know you've seen them before, but this machine has gone through a lot already since purchase so I'm glad to have it home.
Anyway, got a little tour of the shop and saw my first live Studer 24 track. Apparently Aerosmith, Bee Gees, and I forget the other, maybe Kansas used it to record an album. Tom said new parts are no longer made for them. He also had an MXI(??) that he said new parts could still be either found or fabricated and readily on the market. Saw another MSR 16 but had a dbxII not Dolby S, so essentially the same as mine. Saw some conversions they were making. Very cool experience. Especially seeing how wide 2" tape actually is in person. 4 soundcards per channel controlling different parameters, each with micro-adjustments for as I remember level, treble and one or two more. Man those are big-ass machines. Anyway, thought I'd share my exciting day (left work at noon so I could drive to West Palm Beach to get it)

[Seeker of Rock]

Oh yeah, lab report...the heads...they were worn to one side. Ch. 1 was .001" progressing to channel 16 at .0025". Don't know much about what heads are supposed to look like, but I know what they did look like and what they look like now. They are shiny smooth brass now. According to Tom they have a long life left and the wear was minimal, just not even. Don't undestand this in detail, but also had trouble with 2 amp cards...one channel reading low and one extremely high. TASCAM I guess does not make cards anymore, but he apparently troubleshot and fixed the problem by replacing transistors(I believe that's what he told me). Anyway, sheet reads replaced Q13,14,15. Of course the relap/alignment and calibration. Ah, my first reel to reel shop experience. Finally, time to enjoy it.

[Seeker of Rock]

Camera finally charged, here she is

[Seeker of Rock]

Sorry for the shitty quality. Notice ch. 1 meter pegging. Only happens when the Dolby S is activated, but ins and outs are not hooked up yet. Did the same thing with Chs. 2 and 3 as well intermittently when I first powered up. I wonder if it is my electrical outlet giving line noise or wired in reverse phase. Any thoughts? It is not constant, but intermittent. Hmmm, a problem perhaps? Stops when I activate the channel select.

[The Ghost of FM]

Congrats on getting the machine back from the shop!

I remember when I graduated from a cassette Portastudio to my first TEAC A3340S and I was like a proud papa, bringing my new massive baby home and once I made my first recording with it and heard the difference in the detail and fullness of the sound, I knew there was no turning back!

As for the channel 1 meter action your experiencing, it might be a tape lifter which is not lifting the tape far enough away from the head and is making contact but if it is tied into the noise reduction being on or off, then that would point to something electrical inside the recorder and I would tell the technician about this right away so that they'll fix it hopefully without further charge. If you wait too long to report it, they might try to weasel out of doing it promptly and on the house.

Cheers!

[Seeker of Rock]

Thanks for the advice. He spent almost a full day troubleshooting the cards on ch. 3 and 13, but when I powered it up, I noticed Dolby wasn't engaged. I hope he engaged and checked every detail, but I'll definitely call him Monday. Weird it happens intermittently and switched channels where it was signalling. Tired of worrying, but shit happens I know.

I feel the same way you described. Haven't heard it yet, but I have a bit of an idea of what she may sound like.

[Seeker of Rock]

This is eating at me....no meter activity during play, FF, RW, or REcord ready. I have left it on for about 5 minutes now and all seems well. Dolby S works by pushbutton, activate ch 1-8 and pushbutton for 9-16. I know Tom got into the guts of the amp cards and was talking to TASCAM factory, and I know he put about a day into this particular problem alone, told me what he did and that it challenged him, but was fully confident in the final result. He ran tape all day (actually, I think a day and then some) after the alignment, relap, and calibration to pinpoint the problem with the cards, which the solution ended up doing something to the master card, and basically said if there was something not working right on it (as I asked him that everything is in perfect working order, right?), it probably would have happened in that time. Of course he said to call him if there were any problems. I still will on Monday, but as I'm talking myself into happiness here, whatever was happening has stopped. Maybe just the PCB boards or new transistors/capacitors or whatever it was he installed breaking in?
Still going to get a power conditioner tomorrow, cause my house is 1952 built. Equipment is in a circa '80s Florida room addition, but the inspector when I bought it told me several of the outlets were out of phase. How was it he said..."not a big deal, and you'll be fine plugging basic things into the ones that are out...I wouldn't plug a computer or fine electronics into them, but other than that...." Maybe I should invest in a multimeter as well. $10 or something?
Still no meter activity in idle position after 5 minutes more. This is good

[Beck]

Nice MSR-16!

If the power is too "dirty" or out of phase for a computer it will be bad for the MSR as well -- everything is microprocessor controlled in that beast. You should have the outlets corrected for phase and get an APC 700 UPS or something to protect it from surges and low power events.

I take it these are not three-prong grounded outlets?

To correct for phase you just have to pull the outlet out of the wall (after switching off power to that room at the breaker or fuse box, of course) and reverse the position of the black and white wires. The white will go on the screws that currently have the black wires and the black where the white wires were.

You can buy a tester at Radio Shack or any Home Depot type store to test the outlet first.

http://www.radioshack.com/product.as...ct%5Fid=22-141

-Tim

[evm1024]

Do not swap the hot and neutral wires at the outlet. Let me say that again do NOT reverse the hot and neurtral wires. If your outlet has been mis-wired hire an electrician to go and find the source of the problem.

US outlets and most of the world are polarized to present the hot wire to the thing you plug in. Switches are often wired so as to break the hot side only. His has the potential to present lethal voltages when the appliance is turned off.

So keel white to white and black to black and get any mis wiring fixed at the point of error.

(OK off my soap box)

Seriously do it right.

[evm1024]

OK I wnet back and re read the post.

So if you live in a house where some outlets are wired with Hot to the neutral you need to get those fixed.

I'm calmer now...

[Beck]

Yes, by all means get the tester I mentioned first to check the status before doing anything else. It is a very simple device. It is possible that the origin of the problem is in the breaker box itself. However, it's been my experience that home-owners/renters get it out of whack at the outlet when replacing or adding outlets. I have often found an entire dwelling wired correctly, save a room or just one outlet in a room.

In a two-wire system you just want to be sure in this case that the chassis of the MSR-16 is not live (hot). And you really don't want to be working with two outlets that are wired differently but will cross paths via patch cords and metal racks.

I've been doing this stuff for more years than I care to admit, but if anyone is not comfortable going where angels fear to tread, by all means call in an electrician. It’s worth getting it resolved as a first step.

-Tim

[Seeker of Rock]

Thanks for the advice! Just a little background, all outlets are three prong grounded. They upgraded the fuse box (from the old glass fuses to a breaker panel) in '81. Original wiring in the walls(you know the kind with the clothlike insulation), but the outlets are '81. Outlets AND wiring in this room are all circa '81 when they built the addition. Some just wired incorrectly but not sure where. I've done some minor house wiring, hard wired appliances and such. I should be able to rewire the outlets myself but will definitely call an electrician if I get in a bind. Need to get my multimeter first, I guess and locate the ones out of wack.
Oh yeah, learned a bit about the pinch roller. Ordered one from TASCAM a few weeks ago. When I put it on last night, I compared the old and new. The old wasn't sticky, but the rubber was noticeably grooved. Anyway, I'm already 14 bills into this thing, another $38 bills at this point wasn't going to hurt me much more since I've already jumped into the river and over my head.

Just turned her on again to make sure nothing has changed since last night. No meter activity with Dolby S activated. Whatever it was seems to be gone. I wonder if it had something to do with the bumpy 1 hour drive home after picking it up. Weird, but after all it is microchip-controlled and computers do the same thing. Sometimes a simple reboot works the bugs out on my PC. I'll keep my fingers crossed, but a power conditioner has to be a must today. Looking at the bottom end Furman, no pull out lights, just conditioning. Any thoughts?

[FALKEN]

nice! where did you take it in west palm? do they work on fostex?

[FALKEN]

oh yeah btw if you're just running blank tape the meters shouldn't show anything.

[The Ghost of FM]

a power conditioner has to be a must today. Looking at the bottom end Furman, no pull out lights, just conditioning. Any thoughts?

Furman makes some decent stuff though APC would probably give you better bang for your buck and especially so if you get something with battery backup and full voltage under/over regulation.

Cheers!

[Seeker of Rock]

Ghost, thanks for the heads up!

Falken, yeah I know the meters shouldn't have been pegging with no input. I think it may have something to do with my line voltage, not sure though. I'm getting ready for a strong tropical storm right now, but I may plug it back in and see if everything is still fine.
Ampservices is where I took it in Boca. Called a couple of big studios in Miami, and was told that was the place to go. Apparently, they do work for quite some distance. They are authorized TASCAM and I'm not sure about the others, but they had the 24 track Studer, an MXI(?), a few other "console" type reel machines, another MSR16, numerous other reels I really didn't look to closely at..I was kind of like a kid in a learning store at the time. One half of the business is strictly recorders and such, the other is amps. Saw some cool old blackface Fenders and a Musicman. I would very safely assume they service Foxtex as well. I can pm the number, or just post, if you want it, just let me know.

[FALKEN]

gimme dat numba!!!!


sounds kewl man. I play a musicman. I haven't found a place in FL that will service these suckers.

[arjoll]

Originally Posted by Seeker of Rock

Original wiring in the walls(you know the kind with the clothlike insulation), but the outlets are '81.

If this wiring is cotton coated wire and not in earthed (grounded) steel conduit then you should really get it replaced by TPS (plastic coated) wiring. Even if it is in conduit then its well overdue for replacement. Definately if it is rubber coated then its time for replacement.

(this is from my NZ-based, 230 volt experience, but I'm sure the same can be said for those parts of the world with abnormal mains voltages )

[Seeker of Rock]

Falken, sorry for the delay but Katrina took my power for a few days. AmpServices, ask for Tom on recording gear, and I believe Chris handles their amps. The number is 561-333-0335. Nice, honest guys and they seem to know their gear. btw, which model and year of musicman do you play? GREAT amps


arjoll, I don't disagree running new wire throughout is by far the IDEAL situation. But at the moment I have to go with an electrician-friend-of-mine's advice to let a "sleeping dog lie". He agrees with what you suggest too, but again it is ideal and right now and am not pulling that kind of coin to do that. I need a new barrel tile roof as well In my attic where the wire is run, no corrosion or peeling, just an old style of wire insulation, circa 1952. PVC-insulated is my choice, all new, new breaker panel, just re-hung and re-mounted my main service from the pole to my house so that is nice and secure now, GFI on all outlets, etc. is what I would do if I could. Got $5K I can borrow, man . Tell you what though, right now I'm just happy to have power after 4 days and nights without in 94 degree days and not much cooler at night!! Thanks for the heads up though. I agree with you but it's not something I can prioritize at the moment. It is something I need to do a tax return or so from now.

BTW, still haven't had a chance to get a conditioner. They have all different price ranges and this one does this, that one does that, etc. I don't need pull-out lights, just to protect and/or condition the current going into my gear. I would obviously like to buy the low model unless there is a valid reason to jump up $$. Any advice before I make the sale?

[arjoll]

Originally Posted by Seeker of Rock

arjoll, I don't disagree running new wire throughout is by far the IDEAL situation. But at the moment I have to go with an electrician-friend-of-mine's advice to let a "sleeping dog lie". He agrees with what you suggest too, but again it is ideal and right now and am not pulling that kind of coin to do that.

Fair enough. I was in a similar situation in the old house - bought it just after getting married and it was a mixture of TPS, rubber and cotton in condit. House was built around 1950 with a mixture of whatever post-war leftovers were around! The rubber stuff is the worst, the insulation just perishes and can be a major fire risk. Cotton isn't as bad (and in our case it was in earthed steel so any faults would just blow the fuse).

I'm not sure what TPS would be worth over there or what the standards are - here you can pick up a 100m (333ft) roll of 2.5mm2 twin plus earth for not too much (from memory about NZ$70 or so, about US$50). 2.5mm is the standard for our 20A/230V circuits (usually feeding 4+ dual outlets) but the US may use larger cross section cable because you're having to drag more current at 120V for the same power.

Check what the cost is for a reel, and look at running it yourself. Get your electrician friend to supervise and use the old wiring as draw wires. Do what you use often or anything that could be starting to get dubious first. If you just wire into the old panels etc then you're still making a huge difference to safety and I'm guessing you can do most of it for less than $200 plus whatever tyour electrician friend wants (a couple of six packs? )

Originally Posted by Seeker of Rock

In my attic where the wire is run, no corrosion or peeling, just an old style of wire insulation, circa 1952. PVC-insulated is my choice, all new, new breaker panel, just re-hung and re-mounted my main service from the pole to my house so that is nice and secure now, GFI on all outlets, etc. is what I would do if I could. Got $5K I can borrow, man .

When we built this house all the electrical work - wiring, all outlets, switches, dimmers, light fittings, 20mm2 neutral screen from the street, RCDs, MCBs, panel, meter box etc - would have been the equvalent of US$5k, so if you take it one step at a time it might ease the pain.

Also remember that I've only ever dealt with roughly twice the voltage you are. Its going to stress insulation more, requires thicker PVC etc etc, so what is a major risk but relatively inexpensive to fix here might be less of a hassle but be more expensive (more copper and less PVC for the same power) there...

Originally Posted by Seeker of Rock

Tell you what though, right now I'm just happy to have power after 4 days and nights without in 94 degree days and not much cooler at night!!

Yes, power is good. I'm back to 10-15C temparatures in NZ's late winter, from 20-25C in Rarotonga. It was nice to have to snuggle up last night instead of sweltering with AC and a ceiling fan running all night!

Did you escape the worst of the storm? Looked bad.

Originally Posted by Seeker of Rock

Thanks for the heads up though. I agree with you but it's not something I can prioritize at the moment. It is something I need to do a tax return or so from now.

No worries. Just look into the pricing of the cable. You might find its more like one gig that you need to spend to make a difference!

Originally Posted by Seeker of Rock

BTW, still haven't had a chance to get a conditioner. They have all different price ranges and this one does this, that one does that, etc. I don't need pull-out lights, just to protect and/or condition the current going into my gear. I would obviously like to buy the low model unless there is a valid reason to jump up $$. Any advice before I make the sale?

Looking through the rest of the thread (after a good night's sleep, instead of after a day full of a 767, a 737 and an ATR72), and putting the hurricane and power disruption to the side (you did unplug it during the outage?), I wonder how dirty your power really is? Do you experience frequent over or under voltage conditions? (surges and brownouts)? How is your PC running? Sweet or always doing weird things?

If your mains really does have phase and neutral reversed then you should get it fixed as soon as practical. A simple tester will show this - or you could wire a lamp between the neutral and earth (just wiring a 120v neon between the pins on a plug). If it lights you have a problem.

In a similar way if your building cabling is contributing to the problem - i.e. if your neighbous have good power from the same transformer - then you have a problem and using any kind of conditioning is like taking panadol when you have menangitis!

If you get frequent surges then a basic surge protected powerboard will help - any number of cheap brands are better than nothing, but throw it out when it gets hit. If you have frequent undervoltage as well then an APC UPS is the way to go. You should also talk to your power utility - in most countries there are certain minimum standards for mains power and they may be exeeding them - often they will put monitoring equipment in to see how bad things really are. Just make sure its not your wiring first!

Hope this helps in some way. As always its written by someone who has only had experience with NZ mains and YMMV

[arjoll]

Originally Posted by Seeker of Rock

Notice ch. 1 meter pegging. Only happens when the Dolby S is activated, but ins and outs are not hooked up yet. Did the same thing with Chs. 2 and 3 as well intermittently when I first powered up.

OK after reading this thread yet again I think the whole power thing is probably a red herring, I'm guessing something's unstable or noisy in that channel - quite possibly a relay. Do what Ghost has suggested and get them to double check it.

[Seeker of Rock]

Quick follow-up...talked to Tom my tech today and he says don't worry. If it re-occurs to contact him, but similar situations have happened and as long as it is not a recurring problem, the MSR should be fine. Furman M-8 is on the way as well.

[Seeker of Rock]

Everything is hooked up and I got to "hear" the MSR for the first time last night. Wow. What a cool sound. Just recorded some drum diddling. I love the sound of it!

Unfortunately, my transient level jumping is back on the LEDs. Not peaking, just occasionally "chattering" and only when Dolby S system is active and machine is idle. Did not affect any of the recording, just see it on the meters and now occasionally on the board now that the two are linked.
It did seem like I got a little crosstalk from channel one onto channel two, ever so slightly but enough to flicker the bottom bar on the meter. Is this common or no?
Now I have to figure out how to work my board for recording mode versus playback monitor mode and how to switch between the two. Too many buttons, damnit

[Herm]

If you are running the dbx you dont need to hit the meters hard on record.
peaks of 2 and 3 are plenty. That may take care of your crosstalk some if thats what you are doing on record.

[FALKEN]

just because the meters appear to cross talk doesn't mean its necesarily going to tape that way. actually, when you overload channel 1, you will see channel 2's LEDs light up..but the crosstalk should actually come out on track 16...so figure that one out.

about the chattering...it sounds like there is a noise coming from within your system....if it doesn't come out on recordings dont sweat it....it might just be the LED flickering.