levels and mixing

[dolecek1]

Lately i have tryin to work on my mixer, where i just seem to have trouble on adjusting levels.like drums and bass guitar.I'm not real sure to bring drums up enough to clear everythign else, but then sometime si think the drums are so loud i cant hear anythign else, another problem i have is mixing bass.Its either too high or non existant, i just cant seem to get it to flow just right.I havent even started eq'in yet im at a loss with that, i wouldnt even know where to start even after reading hours of online of articles.I'm also still expermenting with compression, how much or when to do it. any tips or suggestions for me to get myself on track with this? thanks

[SouthSIDE Glen]

Originally Posted by dolecek1

Lately i have tryin to work on my mixer, where i just seem to have trouble on adjusting levels.

If you're talking about your Soundcraft and not your mixing in CEP, then I have some questions for you regarding your process.

Are you trying to record "live"; i.e. recording everything at one in the same take and and mixing it all on the fly to a stereo recording? If so, are there legitimate logistical reasons for you to do that like time constraints or lack of input channels to your PC (how many simultaneous channels in do you have?)

If you're mixing to a stereo recording live because you have to, then a little more inforamtion abut how many instruments and voclas you're recording and how, and what style of music it may be, would be very helpful to avoid general comments like "strap your compressor across the drums at 3:1 medium", which may or may not be the actual best solution for you.

If, OTOH, you're talking about mixing multiple tracks in CEP, that's a different animal altogether with a different set of details.

So could you explain a little further?

G.

[SonicAlbert]

One trick I use to get levels to match is to turn down the monitors to a very soft level, whisper soft. What happens is that when you listen this soft is that any tracks that are too soft in relation to the others will simply disappear. So if your drums are too loud, when you turn down the volume you won't be able to hear any other tracks.

What you do is *at the soft volume* adjust the levels so that you can hear every part in the mix. Then turn the volume back up to normal levels and you should be fairly close to the right relative volumes between the tracks.

[SouthSIDE Glen]

Originally Posted by SonicAlbert

What you do is *at the soft volume* adjust the levels so that you can hear every part in the mix. Then turn the volume back up to normal levels and you should be fairly close to the right relative volumes between the tracks.

Interesing idea Al. If I can partially hijack this thread for just a cycle, can I ask you how well that does or doesn't work for your low frequencies? I'd think that one would be temped to boost tracks like bass and kick at those low levels to the point where they'd be too much at higher SPLs. Or are you using that trick mostly for the mid-to-high-heavy tracks, and then bringing in the lows after you return to regularly-scheduled programming levels?

G.

[COOLCAT]

Originally Posted by SonicAlbert

One trick I use to get levels to match is to turn down the monitors to a very soft level, whisper soft. What happens is that when you listen this soft is that any tracks that are too soft in relation to the others will simply disappear. So if your drums are too loud, when you turn down the volume you won't be able to hear any other tracks.

What you do is *at the soft volume* adjust the levels so that you can hear every part in the mix. Then turn the volume back up to normal levels and you should be fairly close to the right relative volumes between the tracks.

this kind of relates,
listening to the radio fairly quite, an alarm clock radio...
listening to the "oldie hits" station...
noticed how the vocals were up front every word understandable,
guitar main riffs came and went usually when there's no vocals going on.... bass was there, but minimal drum ex: snare only heard...

but on songs that had more drums the bass was pushed back...disappeared as Sonic said.

while the vocals & guitar and/or piano rffs remain same,
with guitar or piano licks coming in and out and not stomping on the vocals.

it was like a whisper level, on a crap 2" or 1" radio/alarm clock speaker.

dolecek1...
i'm doin the same Mixing 101 man...its fried at times...each sounds ok, then little by little the mud creeps in or "masking"...very interesting like any art i guess..crazy.

i'm going to do the whisper thing...sounds logical and easy.

[PhiloBeddoe]

Originally Posted by dolecek1

I havent even started eq'in yet im at a loss with that, i wouldnt even know where to start even after reading hours of online of articles.I'm also still expermenting with compression, how much or when to do it. any tips or suggestions for me to get myself on track with this? thanks

You should really experiment with eq alot. Go through each instrument and a vocal and run a boost notch filter up and down the whole spectrum to listen to the different frequencies. It will take you a while to get a feel for the spectrum, but when you do the payoff is big. You'll be able to tell where there's a conflict between a vocal and guitar, guitar and bass, etc. For example, you may cut 3k on a guitar to make space for a vocal. This kind of thing can help when tracks are fighting each other for space.

There are several different procedures that various people have for mixing, e.g. building bass up, starting with vocals, putting all faders at 0dB and going from there. In the end you really just need lots of practice to hear what you need to hear. I still suck, but I can usually get a mix to the point where all the instruments can be heard and nothing is too offensive. I'm a lifelong musician (and avid forum reader) with performing, not recording engineering, experience in professional studios and it still took a ton of work to get to this point as a recording engineer.

Regarding the alarm clock, is it mono? All kinds of strange things can happen in mono, but obviously the instruments directly in the center will be featured.