Hated!

[219777]

All of the toys are finally here. I have a pair of Behringer B2's a decent set of AKG phones and the VF160. I thought it might be prudent to go with Ebay on the multi-tracker to save some money and it's been a HORRIBLE experience. Normally Ebay does me right but this time, it took >2weeks to get the guy to ship it and when it finally came a) there something shaking around inside (sounds like a CD rolling around or something) b) the input select isn't working. Now, I just opened the manual so I may be doing something wrong. Can anyone please help me diagnose any errors I'm making? Anyone who can contribute to diagnosing what I'm doing wrong or maybe help me go through the setup menu to make sure all the settings are correct is greatly appreciated. It seems pretty straight forward but here's the steps I've taken.

1) I turn unit on
2) Went to setup menu and toggled "Phantom Power" on
2) Attach mic to H input (ch 8) raise gain and faders
3) Press Input select
4) Nothing! No flashing oranges, signal, sound or otherwise.

PLEASE HELP!

[219777]

It was a CD. I'm reformatting the hard drive now. There were roughly 40 tracks of grunge/junkie stuff on it already so I burned it off on a CD and began formattiing the drive. While formatting I opened it up and low and behold a CDR. I have to beleive that if there is music on the drive that it works. It really seems that ALL functions work outside of the Input Select....should have this drive scrubbed in another 3 hours.

PLEASE HELP!

[mharr552000]

When you press the "INPUT SEL" key the bottom row(FADER 9-16) of "CH STATUS/CH SEL" keys should flash orange. If you are plugged into CH 8, press the key for CH 16. Press "EXIT" to clear the display. Adjust the TRIM knob for CH8/16/H so the level bar is over the midline. By adjusting the CH 16 fader, you should get some sound. Don't forget to adjust the "MON OUT" and/or "PHONES" knobs and the red "MASTER" fader as well.
Press "DIRECT REC TRK"(IT WILL TURN RED), press the "CH STATUS/CH SEL" key for CH 8(which will flash red). Press "EXIT" to clear the display. Hold down the "RECORD" key and press the "PLAY" key to record.
This was working for me less than 12 hours ago, so if that doesn't work then something is wrong.

[219777]

That's the prodcedure I used. The recording Buss and Direct recording even the source work but the input select doesn't. I wonder what the chances on a reformat curing the problem. Maybe it's just the switch?

[billisa]

If you hit DIRECT (REC TRK) button, you are then prompted by the display to select which tracks will be armed. Then push the track button for either 8/16 or 7/15, depending on whether you want to go into 8,7,16,15. Your choice. Then hit EXIT. Hit your RECORD BUTTON ONLY, and you should be able to see the LCD level meter corresponding to whatever track you selected.

REC/PLAY at the same time will actually start the recording.

If this isn't happening pretty much as written, something's wrong. I assume you got a great deal on EBAY because the VF160EX, new, goes for $799.00.

The problem with EBAY is you never know how a gievn item was treated, and with some pieces of gear, namely ones with a HardDrive, this could be an issue.

[219777]

Thanks,
If I'm not mistaken Input Select must be done first. After the input select is done then you can assign that input to a specific channel using your procedure. Unfortunately, without being able to select an input this device looks to be essentially useless. My format is almost done...have thought it through and doubt this will help....of to search for an authorized service shop in town :-(......anymore suggestions are greatly appreciated.

[billisa]

Originally Posted by 219777

Thanks,
If I'm not mistaken Input Select must be done first.

You're mistaken.

[219777]

I've got some tracks down finally. The input select still doesn't work so I'm not able to monitor gains before they come down and I've got some major high frequency noise up top on the stuff I've recorded with the B2's.

[carelessorc]

In direct record mode you do not need input select, because input to track assignment is fixed (input 1 to tracks 1 and 9, etc). The input/recording level is controlled using the Trim knob. The channel faders are for controlling the monitoring level of the track you're recording, and the playback level of the other tracks.
Input select failure will mean that you cannot use buss record.

Orc

[219777]

Thanks that makes a lot of sense. If I'm recording live sound through 7+8 I can send them over to 1+2 when they're finished correct? One of the things I'm using this for is rehearsal CD's for my ensemble. I ripped a track off a CD and was laying down Bass and Tenor parts and noted that I had to max out gains to get even close to the ripped accompaniment. I'm basically eating the mic at max gain singing mezzo forte volumes and getting a track with much high frequency noise @ approx -10db. Is it possible the preamp is fried? If I had a fried preamp in this unit would I still get some level or would it be silent? I'm just trying to figure out if this is worth keeping or not....no input select and buss recording, a lot of noise in the signal.....???

[rboyce_boston]

Assuming that you're using your condensor mic, it sounds like either the Phatom Power is not turned on, or that the Phantom Power function is not working properly.

Have you tried this on both tracks 7 & 8? If it's not working for either track, that I would doubt that the preamps on both tracks are shot.

You're using and XLR->XLR cable, right? I ask because some recently posted a problem where the were trying to use phantom power over a XLR->1/4" cable (that won't work).

And yes, you are correct is thinking that you can move tracks around after using Direct Record mode to record them.

-ray

[219777]

Thanks man. I am using a condensor mic and have turned on the phantom power through the setup menu....the mics are rated @ 48V which is what the fostex is. The light is on but I can't be sure it's sending the signal up to the mic. I will try track 8 to see if that helps any....I do have an standard male female XLR cable.....Thanks for the input...will try track 8.

[rboyce_boston]

When you say "the light is on", what light are you talking about?

Also...double-check that the phantom power has definitely been turned on in the "setup" menu. I know when I first got my VF-16, there were several instances where I thought I had changed a setting in the Setup menu, when in fact I really had not. Usually because I was hitting the "Exit" button before I had hit the "Enter" button to change a particular setting.

Lemme know what happens.

ray

[mharr552000]

Originally Posted by rboyce_boston

When you say "the light is on", what light are you talking about?

There is a small LED labeled PHANTOM to the left of the LCD display that illuminates when phantom power is activated.

[rboyce_boston]

Some condensor mics have an LED on them, too, that signifies whether it is receiving phantom power. That's why I was asking which "light is on". But you're probably right...I bet he's talking about the LED on his VF-160.

Could be a bad XLR cable, too. Try a different cable, in addition to trying to record on track 8.

-ray

[219777]

Sorry was at work. Yes Phantom Power light on the VF160. I wonder if there's a way I can test with a Voltmeter? Will try different cabling as the one I purchased to test was a "guitar center special". Thanks for the input. I assume that the input select feature should not affect the gain in any way. That regardless of whether that feature works or is applied the gain should be the same using direct recording?

[rboyce_boston]

No, the "input select feature", whether it is working or not, should not affect the ability to use phantom power when recording in "Direct Record" mode. I do it all the time on my VF-16.

BTW...have you tried recording in "Direct Record" mode yet? It's a much more straightfoward process than "Buss Record" mode.

-ray

[rboyce_boston]

Here's another quick test:

do you have a dynamic mic (like an SM58)? If so, can you test your ability to record on your VF-160 using a plain old dynamic mic?

If you're still having recording problems using a dynamic mic, an XLR cable, and either channels 7 or 8, then it's probably not a problem with phantom power or an individual preamp. But if you are able to successfully record using a dynamic mic on 7/8, then maybe there is a problem with phantom power (or a bad XLR cable).

HTH,

-ray

[219777]

Note:

I'm coloring this post green because that's exactly what I am!

One returned "guitar center special" XLR cable later

I've discovered that all cabling is not created equal. I've got two decent live sound cables from the church sanctuary and they work for now but I'm curious....does anyone have a recomendation for low noise/high gain cabling.

I've made my first master of our rehearsal...not great stuff but well balanced and definitey suits the purpose for which it was intended. Both track 7+8 work fine.

[rboyce_boston]

Originally Posted by 219777

Note:

I'm coloring this post green because that's exactly what I am!

One returned "guitar center special" XLR cable later

I've discovered that all cabling is not created equal. I've got two decent live sound cables from the church sanctuary and they work for now but I'm curious....does anyone have a recomendation for low noise/high gain cabling.

I've made my first master of our rehearsal...not great stuff but well balanced and definitey suits the purpose for which it was intended. Both track 7+8 work fine.

Glad to hear that the problem was due to some bad cables. Try to stay away from the real bargain brands (i.e. Guitar Center, Musician's Friend "house" brands) and buy from a company like Whirlwind - cheaper than Monster Cable (ridiculously overpriced) but much better than GC and MF.

Also...keep in mind that if you want/need to use more than 2 condensor mics at the same time, then you can/should buy an external multi-channel preamp unit like the Behringer ADA8000. It can provide phantom power on up to 8 channels, which can then be pumped into your VF-16 on 8 seperate tracks using ADAT. The ADA8000 (roughly $200) is the best bang for your buck in order to expand your studio.

Good luck!

ray

[219777]

With direct recording is it possible to shuttle track 7+8 over to track 1+2 and overdub parts in or is that strictly a buss recording function?

[rboyce_boston]

Originally Posted by 219777

With direct recording is it possible to shuttle track 7+8 over to track 1+2 and overdub parts in or is that strictly a buss recording function?

After you finish recording to tracks 7+8, you can move them to any track you want, using either the "Track Exchange" function or the "Copy Track" function (I can't remember if there's a "Move Track" function). It doesn't matter whether you've recorded them using Direct or Buss mode. The functions that I mention are all available using the "Edit" function (which is independent of either Direct or Buss mode).

Another thing to keep in mind....if you use an external ADAT interface/preamp/mixer (like the Behringer ADA8000 or the Fostex VM-88 mixer, for example), the 8 input channels on your VF-160 will record to tracks 9-16, while the ADAT channels will record to tracks 1-8. And since the ADA8000 has XLR/phantom power on all of its 8 channels, this means you could record a condensor mic on either tracks 1-8 and/or 15 & 16 using Direct Record mode.

With my ADA8000/VF-16 combo, I rarely use Buss Record mode since I've got a LOT of flexibility in routing my signals at the input stage.

Hope this helps,

ray

[219777]

Thanks Ray. Planning on the ADA8000 for live performances where we'll use close stereo miking for the choir and a seperate pair for ensemble accompaniment as well as an ambient pair out in the sanctary. The bouncing tracks idea came for when I need to record rehearsal cd's. I let our accompanist lay down and track then bounce the four remaining voices over. Would need to get the accompaniment in a pair of phones in playback for it to work effectively. I thought that was more of a buss recording function but if I can playback while recording an overdub using direct I think I'll be ok. Thanks for the info.

[rboyce_boston]

Originally Posted by 219777

Thanks Ray. Planning on the ADA8000 for live performances where we'll use close stereo miking for the choir and a seperate pair for ensemble accompaniment as well as an ambient pair out in the sanctary. The bouncing tracks idea came for when I need to record rehearsal cd's. I let our accompanist lay down and track then bounce the four remaining voices over. Would need to get the accompaniment in a pair of phones in playback for it to work effectively. I thought that was more of a buss recording function but if I can playback while recording an overdub using direct I think I'll be ok. Thanks for the info.

I playback existing tracks while recording overdubs on other tracks all the time using "Direct Record" mode. You just arm the tracks you want to record on (indicated by a red light above the channel fader) and then you select the tracks you want to "monitor" during playback (indicated by a green light above the channel fader). Just be careful not to inadvertantly record over any existing tracks that you want to keep. That's why it's good to use track sheets to keep track of everything. Good luck.