16 And 24 Track HD Recorders

[newatthis]

Ok..This might be a stupid question, but I gotta ask it.

Why is it that all these 16 and 24 Track Hard Disk Recorders only have 4 or 8 inputs on them? Is this so you can come out of your 24 channel mixer using your 8 subs into this recorder? Or do you have to constantly bounce tracks? I havent bought one yet, but I am looking to buy something to get done what I need to do.

I have a Mackie 24/8 mixer that my band uses. Currently I have several tape ADAT machines that we use to record with. Then I go into my computer recording software (2 input) and record using the computer CD burner.

What I want to do is,,,,come out of my 24X8 Mackie and into some type HD recorder (with 24 tracks in), then be able to, do the mixdown, then EASILY burn it onto CD. And I cant spend a million dollars in doing this.

Which unit out there is good for doing this? Is there such an animal?? I keep buying more stuff thinking its the right way to go, then find out there is maybe a better way>?>?

You can see the home studio I have started at www.fusedrocks.com and see what I am talking about. And yes there is some Behringer stuff in there,,,dont yell at me!

Can someone help me out and just say...here is simply what you need to buy to make great CD's demo's for your band.

I am still way new at all this recording stuff.

Thanks and peace...
AJ

[HangDawg]

Alesis HD24.

[newatthis]

The first thing you need for a solid mix is a solid performance.

Thats understood and thats not the problem. I am looking for the hardware lineup to make this all happen. The caliber of the band is the least of my worries. All are veteran musicians (but none have recorded on their own before as in home studios).

My question is, what unit is the best to buy to go from my 24 X 8 Mackie board to a mixdown capability, then onto a CD, or even from my ADATS onto a CD. (I already have the ADAT machines, but I dont really like the setup I have with burning using my computer)

And I still would like to have some type of 16 or 24 channel HD Recorder. So thats why I am asking,,,,whats the recommended unit to buy thats affordable and user friendly (with enough inputs)?

[mshilarious]

Originally Posted by newatthis

whats the recommended unit to buy thats affordable and user friendly (with enough inputs)?

Alesis HD24

[Blue Bear Sound]

Originally Posted by newatthis

Why is it that all these 16 and 24 Track Hard Disk Recorders only have 4 or 8 inputs on them? Is this so you can come out of your 24 channel mixer using your 8 subs into this recorder? Or do you have to constantly bounce tracks? I havent bought one yet, but I am looking to buy something to get done what I need to do.

There's no such thing as a 16 - 24 track recorder with only 4/8 inputs.... that would negate the whole purpose of a multitrack recorder! What units have you looked at that you though had limited I/O?

Originally Posted by newatthis

I have a Mackie 24/8 mixer that my band uses. Currently I have several tape ADAT machines that we use to record with. Then I go into my computer recording software (2 input) and record using the computer CD burner.

I'm curious as to why you want to change recorders? Several ADATs sync'd together ARE a multitrack recorder -- unless you just want to go to 24-bit -- but if you aren't getting good results with the ADATs, then going to a 24-bit, although a technical improvement, will not get you better results in terms of overall quality. The difference in sound quality between an ADAT and newer recorders is not significant enough to make or break the audio quality of a recording, engineering skills are going to be the dominant factor in that equation.

Originally Posted by newatthis

What I want to do is,,,,come out of my 24X8 Mackie and into some type HD recorder (with 24 tracks in), then be able to, do the mixdown, then EASILY burn it onto CD. And I cant spend a million dollars in doing this.

Which unit out there is good for doing this? Is there such an animal??

Yes, several ADATs sync'd together, or an Alesis HD24....

Originally Posted by newatthis

Can someone help me out and just say...here is simply what you need to buy to make great CD's demo's for your band.

Yes, several ADATs sync'd together, or an Alesis HD24!

[newatthis]

Ok...I do link my ADATS together and they record fine. Then I come back out of the ADATS, back into my mixer, then out of the mixer and into a (4 input)Delta 44 PC interface and into my computer. The software in my computer is a basic Cool Edit program, and the basic Cubase (I think its SE) program that I got with the Delta 44 interface unit.

When I record onto my sync'd ADATS, it sounds fine. I know there is an art to the whole mixdown process, but my question is, is there an easier better affordable way to get the final mix from the ADATS to being burnt onto a CD?

We want to do our own Demos, and when done (with mixdown and everything) we would like to walk out with a decent CD Demo in our hands. (assuming the production, mixdown is done right)

Thats why I have been looking at the HD recorders and Masterlink units etc. BUT, these recorders (such as the AW16 16 track with built in CD Burner) only show in their ads to only have 8 actual inputs on the back of the unit. And the HD24 has no built in CD burner although it DOES have the 24 inputs and 24 outputs on the back. So when you record into your HD24, then how do you get that final product onto a CD?

I dont want to keep buying things to "try out" if there is something out there that will do all of this easier. Again, I plan to keep the ADATS, but if I bought something that had HD recording capability, I figured that would just give me more options when it came recording time.

Does this make more sense>?>? Like I said i am VERY new at all this,,,just trying to read and learn as I go.

Thanks for the help and responses thus far
AJ

[COOLCAT]

i picked up a Tascam 2488.
There are only 8qty pre's or inputs as you call it.
So you can only plug in 8qty cables or mic's etc...
What you do is bounce over you tracks or assign Ch 1 to Ch 20 for example.

this is great and sufficient for a "songwriter type" who may only do
1 or 2 mic's at a time. Application seems to be your question.
Solo artist- like Les Paul without Mary Ford.

I have 8qty inputs's an only really need 2qty inputs.
Vocal Mic and a Guitar, then overdub Bass, then overdub Lead, etc...


With your setup and application or goal,
it sounds like a nice Masterlink would satisfy your quick DEMO CD-R
goal.

of course you might as well get a CD duplicator,
because the rest of the band will want a copy.

my 2cents is on the Masterlink...sounds like you have a very good setup.

[mshilarious]

Originally Posted by newatthis

Thats why I have been looking at the HD recorders and Masterlink units etc. BUT, these recorders (such as the AW16 16 track with built in CD Burner) only show in their ads to only have 8 actual inputs on the back of the unit. And the HD24 has no built in CD burner although it DOES have the 24 inputs and 24 outputs on the back. So when you record into your HD24, then how do you get that final product onto a CD?

OK you are talking about two different kinds of units: ADATs/HD recorders, and HD recorder/mixers/CD burners, usually called studios-in-a-box, or SIABs.

The HDRs are more professional tools, and they are part of a larger system--big mixer, outboard effects, and something like a Masterlink (which is not a multitrack recorder). They can also be used to transfer remotely recorded tracks to PC for mixdown.

The SIABs are more for project studios, in that they might not have enough inputs for all their tracks, but they have built-in digital mixers, preamps, effects, and CD burners, such that you don't have to have anything else to finish a CD. If you need 16 track simultaneous recording, not all of these units will support that, although some do with ADAT lightpipe inputs--you will need an external preamp/converter unit to get the additional inputs.

[HangDawg]

Originally Posted by newatthis

Thats understood and thats not the problem. I am looking for the hardware lineup to make this all happen. The caliber of the band is the least of my worries. All are veteran musicians (but none have recorded on their own before as in home studios).

My question is, what unit is the best to buy to go from my 24 X 8 Mackie board to a mixdown capability, then onto a CD, or even from my ADATS onto a CD. (I already have the ADAT machines, but I dont really like the setup I have with burning using my computer)

And I still would like to have some type of 16 or 24 channel HD Recorder. So thats why I am asking,,,,whats the recommended unit to buy thats affordable and user friendly (with enough inputs)?

Duh! read the fucken post. I answered you. You quoted my signature line.

[HangDawg]

Originally Posted by newatthis

So when you record into your HD24, then how do you get that final product onto a CD?

Ummm, from HD24s outputs to your mixers tape/line inputs so you can mix. Take the Main outs to your Delta card and record the mix to your PC. Burn to disk.

[tedluk]

If you're going the SIAB route, the Akai DPS24 has 12, high quality preamps and can record on all 24 tracks at once. Those features and many others make it a truly professional package capable of producing a complete project, including mastering.

Sadly, Akai has done an atrocious job of marketing this unit. Numark has recently bought Akai Professional so we'll see if they do a better job, but I'm not going to hold my breath. Still, if you look beyond the slick ads of competitors and all the hype out there, you can tell from looking at the specs that the DPS24 can deliver sonically.

Ted

[newatthis]

I went ahead and bought a Masterlink Unit tonight. I think with everything I already have, that should be perfect for the finishing touch (as far as the hardware end of it).

Tonight the band recorded 5 tunes "live" onto the current set up (ADATS back into the Mackie 24X8 then into the M-Audio Delta 44, then into the computer),,, and for a rough quick BS mix, it came out pretty decent burnt onto CD.

Tomorrow I will spend time playing around with the mixdown, and then wait till the Masterlink arrives and go from there. (see what it offers)

Thanks for all those who replied to this post. I think I finally have the combination I need to do what I was after. Now if I get the experience I need to do it all right, this shit will rock. Oh....and,,,,I will still probably buy an HD24 just to have in the rack for whenever. I like the toys.

HANGDAWG, I didnt see your quick very basic reply when you simply stated the "HD24" response in your reply, my bad!! I just saw your signature line. I showed your "attitude" (in laughter) to my 2 guitarists in the band tonight and they said, "That wingnut is our neighbor,,,we will kick his ass"!! (again in laughter)

Small world isnt it? I am convinced all you boys from up in that "area code" are all backwoods redneck musicians,,,,,but pretty damn good at what you do.

Anyway,,,,Thanks again people,,,,

Peace......signed,,,,(from a new studio only about 1 hour 45 minutes south of Da Dawg)

AJ

[HangDawg]

Originally Posted by newatthis

"That wingnut is our neighbor,,,we will kick his ass"!! (again in laughter)

Small world isnt it? I am convinced all you boys from up in that "area code" are all backwoods redneck musicians,,,,,but pretty damn good at what you do.

Anyway,,,,Thanks again people,,,,

Peace......signed,,,,(from a new studio only about 1 hour 45 minutes south of Da Dawg)

AJ

I seriously didn't mean to be an ass. So where abouts are ya. I'm in Williamsport area.

[mshilarious]

Originally Posted by newatthis

Oh....and,,,,I will still probably buy an HD24 just to have in the rack for whenever. I like the toys.

I've a feeling that once you get the HD24, you won't keep the ADATs around for very long.

[newatthis]

I've a feeling that once you get the HD24, you won't keep the ADATs around for very long.

Then while we are at it, answer me this. Will I notice a difference between the HD24 sound and the ADAT Tape sound as to the warmth of the sound? In reading, some seem to think the HD recording is more transistorish then the ADAT Tape sound which they say gives you a warmer richer sound.

Is any of this true?? Or no? Is it maybe better to have BOTH options available?

And Dawg, they (my guitarists) are both from Berwick, PA and our Frontman is from Wilkesbury(sp). They all have your same area code. I am from Harrisburg, Pa.
And its all cool, I know dealing with newB's such as myself with some of the dumb questions we ask gets frustrating.

Anyway, thanks again all....

Peace

[mshilarious]

Originally Posted by newatthis

Then while we are at it, answer me this. Will I notice a difference between the HD24 sound and the ADAT Tape sound as to the warmth of the sound? In reading, some seem to think the HD recording is more transistorish then the ADAT Tape sound which they say gives you a warmer richer sound.

Is any of this true?? Or no? Is it maybe better to have BOTH options available?

The only practical difference in the sound of an ADAT and the HD24 is the converters, the HD24 having newer 24 bit converters. Especially the XR version has well regarded converters.

Both units are liberally sprinkled with transistors, so that comment makes no sense to me. Anybody who thought that ADAT sounded 'warm' because it used tape lacks a fundamental understanding of digital audio. However it's possible that one prefers the sound of the old converters, although I don't know why that would be.

Bear, if you're reading, you want to chime in here?

[Blue Bear Sound]

Originally Posted by newatthis

Then while we are at it, answer me this. Will I notice a difference between the HD24 sound and the ADAT Tape sound as to the warmth of the sound? In reading, some seem to think the HD recording is more transistorish then the ADAT Tape sound which they say gives you a warmer richer sound.

Is any of this true?? Or no? Is it maybe better to have BOTH options available?

Definitely not true.... and as mshilarious already said, anyone who told you that "ADAT Tape sound gives you a warmer richer sound" clearly has no concept of digital audio. The recording medium (digital tape vs. hard disk) itself has NOTHING to do with the sound quality. In the digital realm the A/D converters are completely responsible for the audio quality.

The HD24 technically has superior converters than the ADATs, but whether you will notice a difference or not will depend on the calibre of the rest of your gear in letting you hear that difference, and how discerning your ears are!

[hasbeen]

I third, fourth and fifth the HD24!!!!

[dobrocop]

hi hangdawg,...you seem to be a confirmed alesis 24hd man,..i have heard great reports on this machine but as its quite a new recorder the price would be beyond my budget[ at least 60% beyond],..so my question is ! do alesis make a 16 track hd [ 24bit] as i dont need 24 tracks,..or if you know of another stand alone unit that would take he place of my old AKAI MG14 D analogue recorder [ on its last legs] and running out of tapes ,... im not interested in the all in one mix n multitrack, with effects n drums n comp/limiti,bells n whistles,...i would be thankful if you you can help,cheers,dobrocop,