API(or clone)Pre for Indie Punk/Screamo?

[BRIEFCASEMANX]

I want something that will make guitars and vocals sound punchy and powerful. As well as snare.

I've pretty much decided on an API or a clone- OSA(Old School Audio) or Brent Averill.

What do you guys think of each the clones vs. the real things?
What is the real difference between the 312's and the 512's?????

[gemsbok]

i record hard rock and punk mostly and would like to know also about the BA 312 AND 512. im also looking at the great river for vocals ,bass and marshall-boogie heavy guitar. it will be a major upgrade from my vtb-1 so im wondering which to buy ? there is a 200$ dollar difference between the 2 pre-s im looking at for a single channel but im thinking API clone.

[xstatic]

The difference is pretty subtle between the clones and the current API's. API however is not necessarily what I would be looking at for guitars and vocals. For drums though, API hands down. Personally I would look at something a little more neveish like the L series if you are looking at OSA. I would also make sure you have a nice fast fairly transparent preamp available as well.

[BRIEFCASEMANX]

My current preamp is a DMP3 which is "fairly transparent" but i don't know what you mean by fast? good transient response? What do I want a preamp like that for exactly, you didn't explain.

[Henri Devill]

Originally Posted by BRIEFCASEMANX

My current preamp is a DMP3 which is "fairly transparent" but i don't know what you mean by fast? good transient response? What do I want a preamp like that for exactly, you didn't explain.

Good for percussion,overheads,acoustic guitar ect.Sounds that are faster for lack of a better explanation ..I like OSA A's for this... As for the OSA's the L3 is really nice,kinda like a GreatRiver with no imp or loading features.The Great River NV are very Good also..Once you get to this level is all a matter of taste..There are so many choices..Good luck

[chessrock]

Originally Posted by BRIEFCASEMANX

I want something that will make guitars and vocals sound punchy and powerful. As well as snare.

For that, I'd recommend either an Empirical Labs Distressor or a Crane Song Trakker.

[Dot]

Why would you get a clone when you can get the real deal for around the same price? Real API is not really more expensive than the clones. The API 500-6B Lunchbox runs a little north of $400 and a real API 512C pre/DI is generally around $650. You can get started with real API 500 series for under $1100. And then every time you add another API module, you won't be shelling out for the power supply.

Difference 312 and 512: via Paul Wolf of Tonelux

The similarities are that they use one 2520 op amp and one 2503 transformer each, which is the larger transformer. The differences are that of course, the 512B/C brings out all of the knobs and functions to the front panel, so X that, the differences are that the 312 has no coupling capacitor between the output transformer and the op amp, which means that if the op amp has any offset, it may cook the transformer. The 512C has a very large coupling cap, in parallel with a high frequency cap, in parallel with a resistor for transformer damping. The op amp has a servo to eliminate offset, resulting in two things, increased headroom and the elimination of popping when the phase switch is used.

The 512B and C were the next generation of the original 512 mic pre, which was the first modular mic pre and was used for mics, line amps, summing, and booster/distribution. Different models had meters, banana jacks, input selectors, and pots, in just about every combination, in the original consoles that API made in the early 70's. It is most similar to that instead of a 312 card, which has no features.

[Dot]

Originally Posted by BRIEFCASEMANX

I want something that will make guitars and vocals sound punchy and powerful. As well as snare.

Originally Posted by chessrock

For that, I'd recommend either an Empirical Labs Distressor or a Crane Song Trakker.

Or you could use API pres. That's sorta what they do.

[BRIEFCASEMANX]

Originally Posted by Dot

Why would you get a clone when you can get the real deal for around the same price? Real API is not really more expensive than the clones. The API 500-6B Lunchbox runs a little north of $400 and a real API 512C pre/DI is generally around $650. You can get started with real API 500 series for under $1100. And then every time you add another API module, you won't be shelling out for the power supply.

That description kinda went over my head. I still don't really know what the difference is and I don't want anything getting "fried" though, haha.....

You're right about it being close to the same price. In the OSA stuff the L3 has peaked my interest- although that isn't really an API clone. It's probably safer to just go with an API though. Do you have any opinion on the L3 or have you tried it? Just from reading your posts for a long time now, you are one of the people whose opinion I really trust on this, and other forums Dot.

Chessrock, I am not in the market for a 1500+ compressor......yet. In fact, I don't really want any outboard gear other than maybe pre's until I have had more experience tracking/mixing.

[chessrock]

Originally Posted by Dot

Or you could use API pres. That's sorta what they do.

API's can give a certain snap that really seems to work with drums ... but anything else will be mostly subtle. A compressor is just powerful enough of a processor to breathe life in to certain things. To the point where you can literally alter / sculp the dynamics.

Someone please shoot me for this -- -- but with the proper usage, they can "make guitars and vocals sound punchy and powerful."

This is just the interperatation I'm getting from his post. Nothing in the least bit against API pres. As far as mic pres go ... yea, they're pretty bitchin. But I'll tell ya what. I just tracked a band using Brent Averil API's on snare top/bottom, kick, and center overhead in a semi - decca tree deal.

This dude's snare hits are so lame. Like the way you hit a little kid or a dog when you "play hit." I must have spent all day trying to salvage this thing. We're talking thonk! ting! thing! THONK! thwack! ting all over the place. On the outside rim ... on the sweetspot ... just left of the sweetspot.

Thank god for dynamics processing.

[DJL]

Originally Posted by chessrock

We're talking thonk! ting! thing! THONK! thwack! ting all over the place. On the outside rim ... on the sweetspot ... just left of the sweetspot. Thank god for dynamics processing.

LOL... ... Amen.

[playit]

Sounds like a job for Drumagog.

[Teacher]

OSA is cheaper then API and not inferior to it