Not message music - feedback please.

[laatija]

Ok, I'm a moron but not an idiot. I need to ask for feedback.

I've been writing only a short while and have plateaued relative to self-evaluation. Now that I found this group I can let others beat me up. I've been reading a bit in this forum and I know it's less than adequate to only provide lyrics, but my recording equipment is in the mail and when it does show up that's just another huge learning curve. One curve at a time - please swing away.


I wrote this song about a gay person's struggle with coming out. Not being gay and not having any personal experience with the subject matter, I struggled with qualification issues; but the song was there so I wrote it.

Staying In (verses in Dm, chorus in G)

Black leather shoes, Sunday power tie
White button down, grab a piece of time
Fifteen years, have flowed into my mind
Since that day, when god was on my side

Face like a clown, political power bitch
You're just a pawn, in a game played by the rich
Four letter word, you seem a bit confused
Hate's not love, I'm human just like you
Yeah, the miracle's in me too

I'm standing out here on the water, I'm staring up at the blue sky
I've shown you who you want me to be, if I show you who I am
Would I look the same in your eyes

My dear dad, I know could never stand
The thought of me, with another man
But is it ok, for him to visualize
Another man that way, with my sister

Black and white, a mask for wrong and right
But why not gray, I don't choose to feel this way
I feel your fear, believe me I'm scared too
Please help me live, instead of persecute

I'm standing out here on the water, I'm staring up at the blue sky
I woke up scared and gray today, outside it's cold and starting to rain
I'd like to go on out but I think I'll stay in

[jeap]

hey...

when i read it the first time i didnt know it was about a gay dude and it worked better

i think you should not have told us since most of us are so homophobic and we might turn gay if we reply

the whole thing is kinda vague which is good at times - repeated listenings may reveal different meanings

is there a market for gay frustration tunes?

i like some of the lines especially the 2nd verse

i would lose the dad verse and the first verse

that would leave:

Face like a clown, political power bitch
You're just a pawn, in a game played by the rich
Four letter word, you seem a bit confused
Hate's not love, I'm human just like you
Yeah, the miracle's in me too

Black and white, a mask for wrong and right
But why not gray, I don't choose to feel this way
I feel your fear, believe me I'm scared too
Please help me live, instead of persecute

I'm standing out here on the water, I'm staring up at the blue sky
I've shown you who you want me to be, if I show you who I am
Would I look the same in your eyes

(solo)

(bridge)
Fifteen years, have flowed into my mind
Since that day, when god was on my side

I'm standing out here on the water, I'm staring up at the blue sky
I woke up scared and gray today, outside it's cold and starting to rain
I'd like to go on out but I think I'll stay in



its even more vague and could apply to almost anyone! its just a suggestion of what i might do with it.

and what a beginning! angry and scary!!!!!

[Fat_Satchel]

I havent posted in a while so I hope I dont ramble too much. Im with jeap in the thought that its rather hard to tell what this is about.

The verses say some interesting things and have some decent imagery. In and of themselves each verse describes someone in very vivid, blunt terms but the key to linking them all together is lacking fierce.

If you are going to intruduce what appears to be a new individual with each verse then the chorus had damn well better do a good job of explaining why you've brought them AND the listener all together for this moment in time. Without that ingredient the listener [or reader, if you will hehe] is left confused and disappointed....

and history teaches us that humans can go to great lengths to detach themselves from the reality of what they don't understand.

In other words, the chorus needs to make the listener [in this case] be able to relate somehow with each individual introduced.

/END rambling incoherant babbling nonsense

Just my opinion and that only seems to get more entrenched with age...not necessarily better hehehe

FS

[Rokket]

Is this a rewrite? It looks the same as your other post.........

[jeap]

its a duplicate thread but it has the moron and idiot stuff at the beginning.

i dont know the logistics of the deal.



i like what i did with it BUT...

now i want to re-arrange the parts:



I'm standing out here on the water, I'm staring up at the blue sky
I've shown you who you want me to be, if I show you who I am
Would I look the same in your eyes

Black and white, a mask for wrong and right
But why not gray, I don't choose to feel this way
I feel your fear, believe me I'm scared too
Please help me live, instead of persecute

(2nd verse uses lo-fi megaphone voice)

Face like a clown, political power bitch
You're just a pawn, in a game played by the rich
Four letter word, you seem a bit confused
Hate's not love, I'm human just like you
Yeah, the miracle's in me too

(bridge is dreamy)

Fifteen years, have flowed into my mind
Since that day, when god was on my side

(solo)

I'm standing out here on the water, I'm staring up at the blue sky
I woke up scared and gray today, outside it's cold and starting to rain
I'd like to go on out but I think I'll stay in

I'm standing out here on the water, I'm staring up at the blue sky
I've shown you who you want me to be, if I show you who I am
Would I look the same in your eyes



there. its done. the angry part is separated by the megaphone effect. what we have is rhythmic and dynamic.

the refrains about standing on the water should sound bright and revelatory (is that a word?) in a wise carly simon kind of way.

its vague but it has meaning.

its a hit!

[laatija]

Originally Posted by Rokket

Is this a rewrite? It looks the same as your other post.........

It's the same. These are my first postings to this group and when I didn't get a response within 3 minutes on the 1st one I panicked and sent the 2nd with a request for review in the title. Next time I will wait 5 minutes.

[laatija]

Originally Posted by jeap

its a duplicate thread but it has the moron and idiot stuff at the beginning.

i dont know the logistics of the deal.



i like what i did with it BUT...

now i want to re-arrange the parts:



I'm standing out here on the water, I'm staring up at the blue sky
I've shown you who you want me to be, if I show you who I am
Would I look the same in your eyes

Black and white, a mask for wrong and right
But why not gray, I don't choose to feel this way
I feel your fear, believe me I'm scared too
Please help me live, instead of persecute

(2nd verse uses lo-fi megaphone voice)

Face like a clown, political power bitch
You're just a pawn, in a game played by the rich
Four letter word, you seem a bit confused
Hate's not love, I'm human just like you
Yeah, the miracle's in me too

(bridge is dreamy)

Fifteen years, have flowed into my mind
Since that day, when god was on my side

(solo)

I'm standing out here on the water, I'm staring up at the blue sky
I woke up scared and gray today, outside it's cold and starting to rain
I'd like to go on out but I think I'll stay in

I'm standing out here on the water, I'm staring up at the blue sky
I've shown you who you want me to be, if I show you who I am
Would I look the same in your eyes



there. its done. the angry part is separated by the megaphone effect. what we have is rhythmic and dynamic.

the refrains about standing on the water should sound bright and revelatory (is that a word?) in a wise carly simon kind of way.

its vague but it has meaning.

its a hit!

You're right about the refrain (which used to be the chorus) - bright and revelatory. But I wouldn't open up with that because the song is about an individual going through a dark time and that's why I wrote it in Dm then switch to G for the chorus. When I posted this song I should have mentioned that it was just me and an acoustic guitar, and the guitar knows me better than I know it. So when I read about bridges and lo-fi megaphone voices it's just another thing I have to figure out - but that's why I'm here.

[laatija]

Originally Posted by Fat_Satchel

I havent posted in a while so I hope I dont ramble too much. Im with jeap in the thought that its rather hard to tell what this is about.

The verses say some interesting things and have some decent imagery. In and of themselves each verse describes someone in very vivid, blunt terms but the key to linking them all together is lacking fierce.

If you are going to intruduce what appears to be a new individual with each verse then the chorus had damn well better do a good job of explaining why you've brought them AND the listener all together for this moment in time. Without that ingredient the listener [or reader, if you will hehe] is left confused and disappointed....

and history teaches us that humans can go to great lengths to detach themselves from the reality of what they don't understand.

In other words, the chorus needs to make the listener [in this case] be able to relate somehow with each individual introduced.

FS

Funny, it all made sense to me.

From the few replies I've had I can see that if I want to move beyond enjoyable for me writing I need to be aware of the holes that are on paper but not in my mind.

Thanks.

[jeap]

what???

youre not bowled over by my improved version??????

[laatija]

Originally Posted by jeap

what???

youre not bowled over by my improved version??????

I'm willing to bet my $100 guitar that yours will sound a lot better than mine.

[jeap]

hey laatija what are you getting for recording gear?

my first setup was a stereo cassette deck. a hitachi. this was back in the day when home stereo cassette decks had 2 mic inputs and big vu meters.

my acoustic guitar had a pickup and i plugged that in the deck and a cheap shure copy mic (yu brothers from taiwan) in the other side and just played and sang.

the results were amazing! clear and warm and people i played the songs for liked the sound.

sometimes simple works really well. i think all this computer stuff makes it hard to get a good recording right away.

[laatija]

Originally Posted by jeap

hey laatija what are you getting for recording gear?

my first setup was a stereo cassette deck. a hitachi. this was back in the day when home stereo cassette decks had 2 mic inputs and big vu meters.

my acoustic guitar had a pickup and i plugged that in the deck and a cheap shure copy mic (yu brothers from taiwan) in the other side and just played and sang.

the results were amazing! clear and warm and people i played the songs for liked the sound.

sometimes simple works really well. i think all this computer stuff makes it hard to get a good recording right away.

What timing. I just received a Zoom 802B. I'm in the process of trying to record a few songs so I can get some more abuse, I mean advice, from this forum. The thing is, and this is the thing - I know nothing; not only relative to recording but musically also. I started playing the guitar 2.5 years ago and prior to that, well, nothing. So it's an adventure. But I have a library card, a computer, and a $100 guitar (no pick up), so I'm learning. When I get some songs up on a site (which I also don't have yet), I'll be asking for sound advice. I'm reaching for that clear, warm, people like it thing. Since you've found it I'll be looking for your help. Thanks.

[jeap]

well i just looked at the samson site at your new recorder! thats a great way to start i think.

it has little bitty meters im sure which is not great but it probably has peak indicators and overload detection.

you want a strong signal going in but not too strong or it will cause digital distortion - really bad sound.

do you have any microphones yet?

musicians friend has acoustic pickups for 20 bucks!

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/...se_pid/303400/

this one for 30 bucks is a good brand and i would jump on it in a heartbeat

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/...se_pid/300132/

theres a lot of good cheap mics available too.

another thing you need is speakers. headphones are ok for some things but with that drum machine you have you want speakers so you can jam along with drums. use it like a metronome.

lots of computer type speakers can be used for that if you can plug the recorder into the powered speakers.

congratulations you have started on a frustrating and expensive journey!

[jeap]

also cheap guitars can be hard to play.

if your guitar is hard to play or even if its not you can always take it to a guitar store and ask somebody to look at the setup.

usually the nut slots are sloppily filed and the strings sit too high - makes them hard to press down.

even cheap guitars can be set up to be easy to play!