Why the big change in Drum sets?

[capnkid]

Drum sets started out with minimal pieces, and then in the 70's and 80's you saw drum kits with like 4 tom toms, two floor toms, Roto toms, chimes, at least 6 cymbols and cow bells etc.
Now Every time I see a band on Leno, or and show on tv or any video, the drum sets are all the old Jazz style with minimal pieces.
It seems to me that Drummers nowadays have no Flash, Nothing makes them unique. I Guess the Drum sets fit right in with the modern music, nothing really stands out.

[Dave52]

You've no seen Mike Portnoy or Terry Bozzio then...?

[scrubs]

Originally Posted by capnkid

Drum sets started out with minimal pieces, and then in the 70's and 80's you saw drum kits with like 4 tom toms, two floor toms, Roto toms, chimes, at least 6 cymbols and cow bells etc.
Now Every time I see a band on Leno, or and show on tv or any video, the drum sets are all the old Jazz style with minimal pieces.
It seems to me that Drummers nowadays have no Flash, Nothing makes them unique. I Guess the Drum sets fit right in with the modern music, nothing really stands out.

Have you ever heard a really great jazz drummer? I would take that over Neil Peart anyday. If you are a great player, you can get an amazing sound out of a minimal kit. Granted, there are a lot of shite drummers in this neo-mod garage-revival stuff that's coming out now. However, I wouldn't criticize them just because they don't all have a revolving drum riser and a gong. Don't get me wrong; drums/percussion are critical, but more is most definitely not always better.

Music is about what works best for the song. Face it, drums are almost never the centerpiece of the song. They are the backbone. I would much rather have a drummer who can lay down a steady groove and play something tasteful that compliments the song than some hotshit who wouldn't know a downbeat if it hit him in the face.

Just a thought.

[donkeystyle]

there's lots of great drummers using minimalist sets and there's lots of great drummers using massive sets.......danney carey for instance. each drummer does what works for them. and flash isn't in the size of your drumset. it has more to do with your drumming and stage presence. it probably takes more imagination to play badass stuff on a 4 piece than it does on a 30 something piece like danney carey's set.......not that danney carey isn't an imaginative drummer, because he is. i'm just saying that playing a huge drum set doesn't make you great and playing a small drum set doesn't make you suck.

[gumplunger]

I think one of the signs of a great drummer is if he can play a song in the studio with a tom with, say, 4 toms and 4 crashes, two rides, etc. but then can go on tour with a minimalist set and make it sound just as good.

[Warhead]

I think all the beat detection and "correction" has more to do with this homogenized drum sound than anything. Ever notice how all drummers in the new loud ass screaming bands sound the same? Hard to stand out when ProTools "Beat Detective" spits out everyone the same.

I'd love to see a Keith Moon or Tommy Lee pop onto the scene (their equivalents anyhow).

War

[toemaster]

Man, me and a buddy who have played music off and on together for the last 15 years talked about this last night. When we started out we had a punk band in the vain of the Descendents and this kid had a huge kit. He could play just about anything. Fast forward to 2005. He plays a 4 piece kit with just as much style and creativity as he did when we were alot younger. Totally different style of music too. Check them out at the tiles . They played last night with a metal band who were made up of early 20 somethings and their drummer had the 40 piece kit with rototoms, chimes, double bass, etc... The kid could play but jeez. It took him 30 minutes to break that set down.

[dr.colossus]

i used to play a big kit then i realised my creativity was flailing!~ i was repaeting the same patterns just on different parts of the kit. i went to a four piece set up to force some creativity upon myself and it has worked wonders.

i think image and fashion have also played a big role in the whole thing. remember when guitarists used to have an array of eight quad boxes stacked up behind them? nowadays our guitarist friends are just as happy through a twin combo and the like, any guitarist posing infront of an ominous tower of marshalls just looks like a wanker, same goes for a drummer with a 40 piece kit.

this is just my opinion.

[juststartingout]

Originally Posted by capnkid

Drum sets started out with minimal pieces, and then in the 70's and 80's you saw drum kits with like 4 tom toms, two floor toms, Roto toms, chimes, at least 6 cymbols and cow bells etc.
Now Every time I see a band on Leno, or and show on tv or any video, the drum sets are all the old Jazz style with minimal pieces.
It seems to me that Drummers nowadays have no Flash, Nothing makes them unique. I Guess the Drum sets fit right in with the modern music, nothing really stands out.

I got your flash here. It's all in how you accesorise.

[mikeh]

As a drummer with almost 40 years of gigging/recording under my belt -I've gone from a 4 piece kit with one ride & one crash all the way up to an 11 piece kit with 12 cymbals and now am back to a 4 piece kit with a ride, 2 crashes & a splash).

During the last 40 years I've had just about every configuration you can imagine. I also played just aboust every musical style from German polka music to Rush to be-bop (and the drum kits I used reflected those varied styles)

I too found that when I had the bigger kits I fell into certain patterns that seemd redundant (and candidly, I've a very good and very musical drummer). The smaller the kit the more creative you need to be to still pull numerous tonal colors from a smaller pallette.

However, I think the actual reason you see smaller kits - many drummers have gone back to a more minimalist style which focuses on the groove rather than overplaying, simply to hit everything on every song (in most cases, this is a good thing). In addition, smaller kits require less mic'ing, less set-up, less transportation etc. - all of which factor into the business ecomonics of touring.

[RecordingMaster]

As Buddy Rich once instructed, 'Every piece in your drumkit should be accessible with from both arms, without having any discomfort'.
This is true to an extent, unless you have a china cymbal to the far right for your right hand and one vice versa, for example.
I admit, I do play a huge rack kit that is about 180 degrees around me, but when I play live I like to keep it more basic. I helps me concentrate on my playing, more so than focusing on 'what' to hit. I creates a more intimite vibe between you and each piece of your drumkit.
But with all of these modern-day pop-rock drummers, I do understand the question of 'why' do they all use that setup all of the sudden? I would have to say that most mainstream bands now are trying to look like punk band's even if their music is Avril Lavigne or Good Charlotte. Punk drummers all mostly have the 4 pc. kit with 2 crashes, ride and hats. same placement. The reason why they all set up the same is simple...no more creativity, or originality. They are just doing what they can to get up on stage, play shitty hit songs, and get down as fast as their song climbed the charts. The truth is, they couldnt give a rat's ass about their kit setup...it's not about the playing, it's the money.

[bruntm]

I'm no expert with drums but I think that most drummers should have only what they NEED.

I have the ususal 5 setup, 2rack toms, one floor tom, snare, bass. However I rarely actually use all of the toms. I could probabaly easily get away with two toms, and i probabaly SHOULD just use two toms. However some tunes i jam to require more. some require even more than what i do have.

With cymbals I have a splash, two crashes and a ride (with hats obvs) I used to think that wow if i get more cymbals I'll be a better drummer. thats wrong. i think I actually learned more when I had only one crash/ride combined, it taught me that I had to hit things differently to get different sounds - where as now I have lots of choice which sometimes spoilts things.

Sometimes bands look good with loads of toms and 45,000 cymbals, sometimes they dont. It depends totally on the music,imagine, and what you actually need.

I'm happy with removin one of my rack toms when I dont need it (the ride fits in nicer!!) and puttin it back when I do. I really think its down to the situation/drummer/ and sometimes even cost!

[geet73]

I used to play with a 5 piece kit with a rack and a few extra cymbals. I sold that after a year or so.. that rack got heavy!

I play with a 4 piece kit. I have a ride, 2 crashes, a china, and hi-hats. It's a lot lighter than a big kit. Heh.

I'm in a "loud, screaming, noisy" band.. but it works for me. I don't claim to be a good drummer anyway.

I can at least say that I do not use beat correction.

[fenix]

kits are smaller for the same reason guitar solos do not exist. Nobody likes a wanker on drums and no one likes a wanker on guitar.

[A GUY NAMED JON]

Originally Posted by fenix

kits are smaller for the same reason guitar solos do not exist. Nobody likes a wanker on drums and no one likes a wanker on guitar.

I like guitar solos and big drum kits. It depends on what you want to play on the drums for me personaly, I like kits with a range of different sounds. Also I believe toms are good for more than fills. I have nothing against a guy on a small kit. If you're good then you're good and all you need is what is comfortable for you.

[capnkid]

Originally Posted by juststartingout

I got your flash here. It's all in how you accesorise.

That's a nice modest set. And the drums be nice too!

[alba123]

Hey Juststartingout, Could you take another picture of that drummer with a minamlist kit. Preferably just a popcorn snare 18" kick and small ride.......Just for the sake of comparison to the large kit?

[juststartingout]

Originally Posted by fenix

kits are smaller for the same reason guitar solos do not exist. Nobody likes a wanker on drums and no one likes a wanker on guitar.

Actually, guitar solos don't exist because of the style of todays music. It's all about being loud and not necessarialy good.

A kit is a kit, large or small. It's all about stick control. I love playing my kit. It's 7 toms, 6 crash, 2 splash and other stuff. But when I go out, I only take 4 toms and 2 crashes. Most fills that I do only use 4 toms. With a larger kit, you don't have to take everything, or play everything on every song. With 7 toms, I can pick out a few of the toms that fit a song's scale, and the drums will always sound very tight.

Let's face it, the drummers job is to keep a beat, and that can be done on about anything. 95% of the time, you are just playing a pattern. Fills only make up 5% of the time.

So, if we all had roadies to lug gear around, and had the room to set it up, would you want to have a large kit? I would have to says "Hell yes. It's more shit to hit". But since it's my back, I will just take a subset to gigs and set it all up when in the studio.

http://home.comcast.net/~bonrox/guitars/drums.htm

[juststartingout]

Originally Posted by alba123

Hey Juststartingout, Could you take another picture of that drummer with a minamlist kit. Preferably just a popcorn snare 18" kick and small ride.......Just for the sake of comparison to the large kit?

Well, she modeled some of my guitars too. What can I say, it was a real good day.

[applejax]

Gee what a pic lol...Got any more? lol

Drummers are there to lay down the beat and keep the GROOVE...thats what it's all about! Its not about doing showoff drum parts during music...that comes when the DRUM SOLO happens. Ive been playing for 6 years now and ive been learning alot in the past 3 years about how its not about how big your kit is...but how good you are!
Its all about personal preference too. Times change you have to face that. Look at clothing...and technology. I mean people may have a 4 piece kit, but the technology on that kit is probably more advanced than the 60's and 50's. I mean look we're talking to eachother from across different countries... i mean times change people change...DRUM KITS CHANGE. But i totally agree that things now-a-days are just plain and boring...thats why im not into the mainstream stuff!

[fenix]

even when bands had big ass kits, you can still play the stuff on a 4 piece.

[scrubs]

Originally Posted by juststartingout

Well, she modeled some of my guitars too. What can I say, it was a real good day.

Where are these guitars you speak of? I don't see any.

[juststartingout]

Originally Posted by scrubs

Where are these guitars you speak of? I don't see any.

Well here is the my Les Paul Black Beauty.

And by the way, she loved my Big Kit. She says that size does count. So I think she votes for a larger kit. Lucky I had one, huh.

[Warhead]

juststartingout...

what are your rates in the studio?

War

[scrubs]

Originally Posted by juststartingout

Well here is the my Les Paul Black Beauty.

Hmmm... Still don't see it. Maybe it's the jpeg conversion, or something.