How 'complex' are your songs...?

[andydeedpoll]

hey,

ive been thinking about this for a while, and ive slowly realised that, as i write more, ive (generally speaking) begun to use much more complex musical ideas in my songs - especially with things like rhythm, and the chord structure. I've almost completely stopped using just bar chords! ...

anyway, i was just wondering how complex the songs are you write... with rhythms, and key changes and the form and the melody and things... and do you think it makes any difference to the overall quality of the music? personally i cant stand songs where its just, for example, made up of chords I,IV and V with lots of distortion and vocals over the top and a simple rock beat on the drums, possibly with a guitar solo half way through... bu

what do you all think?

Andy

[dragonworks]

some of my stuff gets very complex, but then again i don't get to play it with other musicians often.
There is something to be said for less is more. Just look at CCR. Some of the simplest music written but try playing it and making it sound good.
There are only two kinds of music, good and bad, and that is in the ear of the listener as beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

[Toker41]

As far as writing goes, I've found myself leaning way more to the simple side anymore. I realized some of my favorite songs only have 4 chords in them! A complex song doesn't make it good, and a simple song doesn't make it bad.
However, I've yet to get to the recording stage of the song and find it anything but complex. Even the simplest of songs can be the most complex recordings.

[Krakit]

I'm a progressive rocker and my compositions reflect that.

By definition, my music MUST be complex. It's a style/genre thing.

Carl

[Benreturns]

when i first started writing i began writing psychadelic things with complex chords, rhythm changes and trippy lyrics. Then i tried to write pure power pop with hard chords, angry lyrics, key modulations and stuff. Then lighter pop but with sweet harmonies and simple lyrics, then smooth R n B and lots of other stuff. Ive been writing for 5/6 years (since 15) and my stuff was directly influenced by what i was listening to at the time (The beatles/stones/who/sex pistols/stone roses/hip hop/motown... whatever)

Now i have a style where i just write whatever. Ive absorbed lots of different styles and pay attention to whats currently hot. If it has 2 chords and works il do it or if it has 20 and complex harmonies i'll just do it. You go through your 'work experience' copying whatever you like and it all comes together and bingo bongo you have your own 'style' you can write to suit!

Disclaimer: thats ME...

[scrubs]

what's a key?

[andydeedpoll]

Originally Posted by Toker41

A complex song doesn't make it good, and a simple song doesn't make it bad.

hehe i understand that ... i know some of the best songs i've written for my band are based around one main riff, and then weve developed this with time changes and different textures and things... but sometimes, in my opinion, if a song needs complexity, then thats what it should be given, and it'll sound boring if it doesnt.

Andy

[mikeh]

When I first started to write it was a lot of I-IV-V stuff simply becuase my musical palette was limited. As I forced myself to learn more theory, I tried hard (perhaps too hard) to make the music more complex (key changes, etc. etc) - and in hindsight, perhaps compromised the message of the lyrics trying too hard to be musically clever. I found that it took me 6 minutes to tell a 3 minute story because I had to develop the hook and build to the key change and then resolve, etc. etc. etc.

Now I find I often fall back to 3 or 4 chord progressions (with more creative use of passing chords to imply more movement than may actually be present). So in answer to the question, I find my writing is less complex, than it use to be - but hopefully I'm now better at telling my stories.

[Rokket]

Originally Posted by scrubs

what's a key?

You use it to unlock doors....












HEY! That was figurative as well as literal. Someone give me a cookie!











But to answer the question, my writing is mood based, as well as a conscious effort to improve. So sometimes it gets complex, others simple. I am in the midst of a musical midlife crisis and trying to redefine myself, so I am trying out different writing styles and more, if not complex, then deeper songs...

[scrubs]

Originally Posted by Rokket

HEY! That was figurative as well as literal. Someone give me a cookie!

Sorry, I must wait awhile before giving you any more cookies. Don't want to spoil your dinner.

[Rokket]

Originally Posted by scrubs

Sorry, I must wait awhile before giving you any more cookies. Don't want to spoil your dinner.

Thanks anyway! I think I've had too many cookies, judging by what I am seeing in the mirror these days!

[Emusic]

If we measure the amount of money/income produced in the last 40 years from pop/rock; my rough estimate is that more than 80% of that money is generated from songs with simple chord schemes (3 or 4 more or less predictable chords in the verse (2-4 in the prechorus (if any)) and 3 or 4 rather predictable chords in the chorus).
If you look at a band like Norwegian A-Ha they sometimes had close to 30 variations of different chords in one arrangement. Other times they went pure and easy.
Myself I'm trying to get out of the predictable set of of chords; finding combinations that are unpredictable but still catchy.
But still 4-chord progressions can make tremendeous hits. Maroon 5's "This Love" is a great example of that, nominated to Song of the year 2004 in the European MTV music awards.
Keep up the writing guys and girls.

[Unsprung]

Originally Posted by Toker41

I realized some of my favorite songs only have 4 chords in them! A complex song doesn't make it good, and a simple song doesn't make it bad.

I actually started calling myself a guitar player, when an aquaintance once told me that "if you use standard E-E tuning and Barre chords, you've got most of the guitar playing licked." Then I realized that quite a bit of rock guitar can be "distilled" into Barre chords, if they're not already. Imagine my delight, when after having been "banging out" The Who's "Can't Explain" using Barre chords, then while watching one of my Who DVDs I notice that's exactly how Pete Townsend is playing it!

As far as complex songs...it really depends how I feel led, when creating something. At times, I hear complete symphony orchastras along with my rock guitars and organ day dreams...sometimes I hear just guitar, bass and drums. Whenever I get a chance to start recording my original songs, the first one I plan to record was created over 10 years ago, on a Sears student acoustic guitar. All this time later, and I've got 2 electrics and several combo amps to chose from, and I'm able to play the song the way I envisioned it back when all I had was that Sears student acoustic guitar.

I just hope that when I am able to be recording music, at the same time I'm creating it, I can keep in mind the concept of K.I.S.S. (Keep It Simple, Stupid).

Matt

[Dogman]

A song only needs to be as complex as you WANT it to be. If complexity is fun, go for it. If you are trying too hard to be complex, and it's no fun, why do the music?

Early Sabbath had some very complex music, for the time, while also doing some very simple stuff. You can do whatever you want. It is a form of art, to write a song, and sometimes you want a complex picture to state what you are feeling, and sometimes a simple drawing can get the idea across, with lots of impact. Composing music to some sort of formula can make for a sterile environment. The Ramones survived for quite a long time using very few chords per song, and people listened. A band like Dream Theater can use many complexities in their tunes, and get it across as good music.

I guess what I am trying to say is, whatever you feel like doing is what it is all about. Why be tied down to one form, or formula of music? In reality, it's all good.

[Unsprung]

The first song that I record, a hot rod/surf guitar instrumental, is also gonna be one of the simplest ones I've created, over the past 10-15 years. No introduction, 4 or 5 Barre chords moving at a quick pace with a bit of sustain and neck slide at the end of the "chorus," straight-8 bass and some kinda fast moving drums. If only I could get over my "I suck as a drummer" problem...

Other future efforts will require me to wait until I've managed to collect non-Fat Telecaster, a Squier Bullet Special, some kinda Les Paul or SG knock-off, a baritone electric, 12-string electric and 12-string bass...along with the Native Instruments B4 software.

I really let the song decide what it wants to be, as a few bits of guitar noodling start sounding like a good idea. I'm not saying all other future efforts will be more complex than my first, but I fully understand why there are some guitar players that have a "small arsenal" of axes and amps to choose from. It's probably a good thing that I only desire a Hammond B3 (or equivalent sounding console), aside from an M2 that I already own....they take up more "real estate" than guitars.

Matt