Recordings are too quiet - vf160ex

[iwnnay]

I got my vf160ex and I've taken the time to learn all the commands and I feel very comfortable using it. It's a great machine. My only irk with it comes to the final mixdown. For some reason it is really quiet when I burn it to CD. I'll record everything to the loudest point and I've even tried digitally altering after I've recorded but nothing seems to just make it louder without going over the channel limits. Does anyone have a workaround for this, or at the very least any suggestions? I've tried everything that I can think of and it still plays very quiet when I burn it to CD. Thank you.

[T1ny]

Move the finial wav to a computer and normilize it? Or send to a mastering house? Hoping someone has better ideas for you.

[iwnnay]

Originally Posted by T1ny

Move the finial wav to a computer and normilize it? Or send to a mastering house? Hoping someone has better ideas for you.

what do you mean normalize it? What pogram should i use?

[dja1353]

Iwnnay,

I have had my vf160ex a couple months now and have gone through the basic functions with it, including recording up to 10 tracks and doing mixdown and burning cds for band demos. The volumes on the cds come out about equivalent to that of store bought cds. Over the next week as I go through the paces I will pay attention to my levels and report back. How are your levels on recording AND on the mixdown phase.. in my very simple mind I guess somewhere in that 2 step process you are low, or you have a defective machine.

[iwnnay]

I've had all the levels as loud as possible and it plays fine over the monitor I have but when I get it to CD even if it's the wav file and I move it over to a computer it's still very quiet. And it happened with my last fostex too. It could be defective but I wanted to see if others were having the same problem annd how it was to work out. Just from looking for normalizing programs though I hit a lot of threads where a lot of people with the same issue on many different machines were having the same problem.

[glynb]

When tracking each instrument you want it to record as close to 0db as possible without clipping. Assuming you're doing this then each instrument will be recorded loud enough. So far so good. So the problem must be at mix down?

Make sure your Master fader (the red one) is on the 0db mark, that could be your problem. When mixing you want to make sure that the stereo mix is as close to 0db as possible too without clipping. if it occasionaly appears to go up above the 0db mark but sounds fine, then leave it, use your ears. If the mix is going above 0db and it sounds distorted (clipping) then slide the master fader down a little.

This will ensure that the master mixdown (I'm assuming you're using the internal mix down method?) is at a reasonable level.

If you are mixing down to an external source then the probelm might lay there, that's another story.

Note: You're unlikely in my experience to get the mixdown on your audio CD as loud as a commercial one. These commercial products have gone through the mastering process in order to boost the loudness - that's a skill in itself.

The other problem could be that you are not using compression, so you are most likely to get extreme peeks. With these high peaks you have to lower the volumes of the instruments to avoid clipping at hte peaks, therefore the overall volume goes down and you end up with a quiet mix in order to avoid clipping? Normalizing brings up the low parts of the mix closer to the level of the peaks making the whole thing sound louder (or reduces the peaks so that the overall level of all the music can be brought up to a louder level).

Hope that helps.

Incidently I took my 'album' all recorded on the Vf160 to a friend who knows about mastering, he said it was OK level overall but a little quiet and needs to be brought up a little - so there you go.

[T1ny]

I use wavlab for my wav editor but there is a free one called Audacity which does the job fine as well. I dont have a link handy, but we used it two years ago under Linux when we ran a Internet radio station to add commercials to the live shows we used to run. (On the repeats so they could run at night without us). (What a time that was)

Audacity can normalize tracks.

[billisa]

Originally Posted by glynb

Incidently I took my 'album' all recorded on the Vf160 to a friend who knows about mastering, he said it was OK level overall but a little quiet and needs to be brought up a little - so there you go.

I believe the 0db level on the VF160 is actually a few db lower. The LED bars can go a tad higher without clipping... Even the LED clipping lights are set to flash a tad lower than 0db, and will also flash when a signal climbs fast without ever hitting 0db.

Actually, even if your levels are recorded closer to -12db, the final result will still be dependent on being able to mixdown near 0db. I actually don't believe in having to hit right on 0db. Commercial CD's come in all different levels and while many I own are louder than VF160 masters, many others are not. I doubt if your machine is defective.

[mharr552000]

I record all tracks as close to 0dB as I can get them. Then do "internal mixdown" as close to 0dB as possible. Then I run tracks 1&2 through a 15 band stereo eq and a stereo compressor back to tracks 3&4 at 0dB(this would also work by bouncing 1&2 to 15&16 for compression.) Then do another "internal mixdown" on that at 0dB. My stuff is pretty damn loud.

When you are tracking, adjust the trim so that the red led blinks every so often. If you end up with a track or two that are a lot louder than the others(and screwing up your mix), bounce it over to track 15 or 16 and throw some compression on it to smash it down a bit. Try to keep your faders around 0dB when you mix. (Use the scenes. Most of my mixes are 100% automated.) Keep that Master fader up too. That should keep you competitive with commercial stuff as far as loudness is concerned.

[dave in toledo]

there is another thread here discussiong the same thing with a different recorder.... this is the down fall of the stand alone daw.... no way to master the file...

a great deal of compression and limiting needs to go on in order to get the volume close to that of a commercial cd...

right now i am taking tracks recorderd on my guitar players 16 channel korg daw.. importing the stereo wav files to the pc, and doing a HOME mastering job with n tracks studio, adding the final eq, and compression limiting with the classic direct x plugins classic compressor and then the classic limiter both set to the preset of mastering and final mixdown....

burned new cd's and wow what a difference.....