Do-It_Yourselfer

[Natural Gass]

I'm thinking of building a guitar.

I already have my 2 dream guitars - Gibson LP and Fender Strat. Now I'm thinking of doing the old EVH best of both worlds. A strat body and fender neck with a gibson humbucker in the bridge position.

The other idea I'm kicking around is to build something like a telecaster.

I'm pretty handy with wood and electronics so I think it would be fun. Plus I would have a new guitar for something less than retail price.

Anyone here built their own guitars or have any advice?

[Halion]

Good luck but keep in mind that
1) there's no such thing a Strat Paul for a reason.
2) every choice you make is gonna make the guitar lean more towards one kind.

[jdier]

Sounds like a really fun project. Be warned though, that you will likely not save any money. It can be expensive to build a guitar.

I mentioned this somewhere else some time ago, a really nice project would be a tele with a 4 wire humbucker in the neck and a single coil in the bridge... either use a mini toggle or a 5 way switch to split the humbucker... This would give you the tele sounds that your current stable doesn't do and also provide the Keith Richards Blues Tele sound. Just a thought.

Have fun.

[apl]

Man, Nat, are you in luck. Turns out the best $300 guitar on the planet is a KIT!

You can get it with 2 humbuckers, or even 2 humbuckers with a single coil in between. There are a dizzying array of electronics, and body and neck wood and inlay options, too. There are a lot more options available than they list on their website. On their discussion board you can see lots of pix of kits that have been built.

[Light]

Well, I make at least some of my income building guitars.

First of all, do not for a second imagine that building your own guitar will save you money. It almost certainly will cost you at least as much as buying a guitar, as the parts and the woods are expensive, particularly if you have to pay retail. The other concern, of course, is if you will be happy with the results. With a kit, you have a good chance, but I have met very few people who are happy with the first guitar they have built. Guitar building is very different from ANY other kind of woodworking. The tolerances we have to work to in order to make a guitar play well are much tighter than any other kind of woodwork, except maybe boat-builders. I never measure anything to less than 1/32, and usually I am measuring to either 1/64 or even to 1/1000. And unless you make gun stocks, you will probably have hard time making the neck.

A kit, actually, is usually the best way for most people to start. Most of the difficult stuff (fret slotting, neck shaping, etc.) is taken care of for you, which saves you a great deal of stress.

You could also go with a neck and body from someone like Warmoth or American Guitar Works. They will make you a Strat body with just about any pickup combination. They you are just responsible for assembly. I would advise you have the neck set done by a professional, but it is up to you.

The first thing you should do, however, is get some books. Stew Mac has lots of books, and you should start by reading at least some of them.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

[DJL]

Originally Posted by apl

Man, Nat, are you in luck. Turns out the best $300 guitar on the planet is a KIT!

You can get it with 2 humbuckers, or even 2 humbuckers with a single coil in between. There are a dizzying array of electronics, and body and neck wood and inlay options, too. There are a lot more options available than they list on their website. On their discussion board you can see lots of pix of kits that have been built.

How hard was it to put that kit together... do you need any special tools and etc... and about how many days did take (not counting painting days) to finish the project? I'm guessing you like the playing action and tone a lot too? Thanks

PS... I see they have a bass guitar kit too. http://www.carvin.com/products/part.php?ItemNumber=BK4 kool.

[apl]

Originally Posted by DJL

How hard was it to put that kit together... do you need any special tools and etc... and about how many days did take (not counting painting days) to finish the project? I'm guessing you like the playing action and tone a lot too? Thanks

PS... I see they have a bass guitar kit too. http://www.carvin.com/products/part.php?ItemNumber=BK4 kool.

I haven't built one, but I've taken enought strat types apart and put them back together to know it's not all that difficult. I could put it together in two laid back evenings. Finishing takes a while because you have to let stuff dry. The tung oil finish is easiest.

If you go to their BBS and post a question about kits, you'll get a lot of feedback.

Playability and tone are way good.

[apl]

Here's a thread with your very questions.

[60's guy]

Originally Posted by apl

Man, Nat, are you in luck. Turns out the best $300 guitar on the planet is a KIT!

I'll second that! As to ease....no special tools or wiring skills are required. The put together and setup time is short. The majority of time involved is dependent on what you decide for body and neck finishing.

I chose the tung oil route...had it done in four days. The swamp ash body is the way to go IMHO. It's a fun and very simple project.

[DJL]

Thanks everyone.

[AaronK]

i will uphold what Halion said. there is no stratpaul for a reason.

I've tried and tried to work with a HB in the bridge or a strat for a long time now. Although some like it, I think it's basically a bastardized sound that is not nearly as good as the regular old strat or les paul. you might get good tone, but it's not *distinctive* is what i'm saying.

hope im not offending those that swear by a HB in the bridge of a strat

[foo]

I have a custom built 'superstrat'.

It is the third guitar I had built. I used it to play professionally for several years.
It has 2 splittable humbuckers and a middle single coil, and it's set up so one master switch can go between seperate 'Fender Strat' wiring and 'Gibson 335' wiring ( so you can 'preset' for example a Fender rhythm sound and a Gibson lead sound with only one toggle switch to change)
Here's some of the things you need to know:

1. It will not be cheaper
2. It will not play or feel like you expect
3. To get the strat 'twang', it has to have a bolt on neck
4. You can get the middle/bridge pickup strat sound (and it's really nice!)
5. You can get all three humbucker sounds (bridge, neck and both)
6. The strat middle/neck sound is similar (and okay) but not the same.
7. It is extremely versatile.
8. The Stevie Ray neck pickup sound is very similar (and good) but not quite the same.

All pickups are Seymour Duncan. The neck is a Custom humbucker, the bridge is a Mag (SH-3 I think), and the middle is an Alnico II vintage strat pickup.

As a comparison, I own a '64 Strat and a '62 Gibson 345, both of which sound great.

My suggestion would be to find a guitar that you really like the way it plays with the pickup configuration you like, and then install better pickups, hardware etc. to get where you want to be.

[apl]

Originally Posted by foo

1. It will not be cheaper
2. It will not play or feel like you expect

Not meaning to be contentious, but the Carvin kit is cheaper, and it plays awesome.

[Light]

Originally Posted by apl

...but the Carvin kit is cheaper, and it plays awesome.

That depends entierly on how well you put it together.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

[WinstonCowboy]

I just wanted to comment on, "Light" You are deff an asset to this community...always giving thorough and informative posts...void of any B.S. I know I appreciate yer presence here.

You balance out my jackass antics; very nicely...keep it up.

Cheers to you.

"An eye for an eye..and soon the whole world is blind..."

[apl]

http://apps.carvin.com/cgi-bin/ubbcg...c;f=1;t=014963

http://apps.carvin.com/cgi-bin/ubbcg...c;f=1;t=014964

http://apps.carvin.com/cgi-bin/ubbcg...c;f=2;t=003450

[Light]

Originally Posted by WinstonCowboy

I just wanted to comment on, "Light" You are deff an asset to this community...always giving thorough and informative posts...void of any B.S. I know I appreciate yer presence here.

You balance out my jackass antics; very nicely...keep it up.

Cheers to you.

"An eye for an eye..and soon the whole world is blind..."

Thank you.

Another of my favorite Gandhi quotes, paraphrased slightly:

Where there is injustice, I have always advocated fighting. The question is, do you fight to change things, or do you fight to punish. I have always found that we are all such sinners that we should leave punishment to god, and if you really want to change things, there are better ways than killing someone.



Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

[Natural Gass]

Thanks for all of the responses.

No StratPaul? EVH took a Strat style Charvel body (2nd), slapped on a neck with jumbo Gibson frets, and directly mounted a PAF to the body in the bridge position, cranked the Frankenstrat through a Marshal and created one of the best rock guitar tones ever caought on tape.

I'm not sure what I want to do yet. What about a swamp ash tele-style body with custom rear-routing, a bolt-on neck with somewhat jumbo frets, a Gibson tune-o-matic bridge, and a vintage style Gibson pick-up in the bridge position?

It seems to me that a quality piece of wood and a quality pick-up are the key.

[mshilarious]

Originally Posted by Natural Gass

I'm not sure what I want to do yet. What about a swamp ash tele-style body with custom rear-routing, a bolt-on neck with somewhat jumbo frets, a Gibson tune-o-matic bridge, and a vintage style Gibson pick-up in the bridge position?

The lack of neck angle on a Tele will cause problems with a Gibson bridge. There would be a shim & some rework of the neck bolts required.

[ibanezrocks]

I was just wondering how easy it would be to make a neck through body guitar if you bought a neck like this one
wouldn't it just be gluing on some sides, routing it for pickups and controls and then finishing it? or is there something tricky im missing?

if it isnt that hard that would be pretty cool because you could make whatever shape of body and headstock you want (optional unshaped headstock on carvin)

[foo]

Originally Posted by apl

Not meaning to be contentious, but the Carvin kit is cheaper, and it plays awesome.

Yep - kits are cheaper - and while I haven't seen a Carvin kit guitar, the Carvin stuff I have seen (inc the Carvin PA speakers I used to own) and a Carvin gtr amp were all really good.

But the original post stated:

"I'm thinking of building a guitar . . . I'm pretty handy with wood and electronics"

So I figured we're talking about really building it, not assembling a kit.

. . . and if that's the case, I stand by my original post.

And you weren't being contentious at all.

[apl]

Oh, sorry, I understand, now, foo. You're right, building and assembling are two different things.

And hey, ibanezrocks, I've seen some amazing guitars on the Carvin board built like you describe. The neck and its intracacies, fingerboard, frets, truss rod, etc., are the most challenging part of guitar building, and that Carvin neck you point out takes all that difficulty out of the process. But it still ain't a cakewalk. You can also call and ask about getting that in different woods, including their 5 piece (striped) version.

(Light, I don't mean it's trivial!)

[Light]

Originally Posted by ibanezrocks

I was just wondering how easy it would be to make a neck through body guitar if you bought a neck like this one
wouldn't it just be gluing on some sides, routing it for pickups and controls and then finishing it? or is there something tricky im missing?

if it isnt that hard that would be pretty cool because you could make whatever shape of body and headstock you want (optional unshaped headstock on carvin)

No, it is considerably more than just gluing on the wings. I build neck-throughs myself. It is a bit of a nightmare. They are about 25 times harder to finish than bolt or set neck instruments, because you have to finish them while they are together. Nightmare. Now, the Carvin neck saves you SOME of the neck shaping work, but you still have to shape the neck/body transition, at least a little. This is, by far, them most annoying bit of wood working on these things. The geometry of getting this bit right is almost impossible for me to explain, but it is a lot of picky, finicky, VERY annoying file work, always making sure you don’t fuck up the body with your file. This is also the one area of amateur guitars which is almost always lacking. I take that back, it is ALWAYS bulky and uncomfortable to play. I see guitars made by students in luthery schools, and they all have the same problems; Bulky, square, uncomfortable neck/body transitions. Even my first one had this problem, and I had my dad standing over my shoulder saying, "That is not right yet." Of course, my problem was that I was making a maple neck, and after three eight hour days trying to shape the fucker, I just gave up. Mahogany necks are much better, if you ask me. If I didn't like the guitars I am making so much, I would NEVER make another neck-through. Bolt-ons are MUCH, MUCH easier. Even set necks (which are still a pain) are easier.

Neck-throughs have other long term maintenance problems, as well. There is a lot of tension on the neck of a guitar, and though the light strings of electric guitars, and the monolithic construction of a neck-through's neck help, it is still a concern. Guys who repair guitars KNOW, for a fact, that every acoustic guitar ever made will eventually need a neck reset. It is a given. The neck angle changes, and the guitar needs to have that angle put back where it belongs. There is just no way around it. Well, on an acoustic, it is relatively easy (though time consuming). We know how to do it. But how do you take the neck of a neck-through electric if the angle changes? You can't, of course. So you need to be damn sure the neck is as stable as possible, and you need to do every-thing you can to keep that neck where it belongs. I use two carbon fiber rods which run the length of the neck, which actually run into the top of the guitar (I have a Les Paul thickness carved maple top on my guitars). This helps to resist the pull of the strings on the neck. A neck through has other advantages over acoustics in this regard. In order to sound good, an acoustic needs to be built rather light, with the result that the gluing surface available for the neck is rather small. There is no need for a gluing surface on a neck-through, as the neck is a monolithic piece from one end of the strings to the other. None the less, it is a concern.

Like I said before, buy some books. They will give you far better advice than a bunch of guys on the internet, even me. I mean, I am not going to spend a year or so writing and rewriting a post on a newsgroup. I would spend that much time writing a book which I would get paid for. Buy some books.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

[apl]

This came out nicely.

[Natural Gass]

Foo -

Since this would be my first attempt at building a guitar, I think I will go with a kit and call it "assembling" a guitar. I've been checking out bodies & necks at warmoth.com

I'll have to take a look at the Carvin Kits. The thing about warmoth is that I think they will custom route the body for ya. I'm into the Fender style body routed for a bid fat Gibson pick-up in the bridge position and basically nothing else.