Fostex Model 80 1/4" reel2reel 8 trk QUESTIONS!!!

[K.C. Maloney]

Hey, all.

I recently lucked out big time! I was talking to a friend of mine I hadn't seen for a while a few weeks ago. We got to talking about recording, as I am just starting out as a sound engineer. One thing led ot another and he mentioned that he had some 8-track reel to reel that had been sitting in his apartment for a few years now (a friend of his owed him money, gave him the 8trk instead); he said he had no idea how to use it and wanted to see someone put it to good use. Needless to say, I jumped on the idea. He agreed to GIVE it to me, for free! I didn't really think he would just give it to me, but sure enough he called me a few days ago and asked if I wanted to come pick it up. SCORE!!

Anyways, I have it all set up, cleaned, demagnetized, and it's working like a charm and giving me that warm analog sound that my mostly digital (Digi002) setup sorely needed. I have a few questions, though, as I am having a tough time getting any solid info on it using the internet. I did buy the manual off of ebay (PDFs on a CDR), but I just had a few general questions in the mean time (manual hasn't come in the mail yet).

First off, how the hell are you supposed to align the tape heads? I am very familiar with aligning 24 track Studers and Otaris; I've had to align those machines WAY too many times. Since I know how important proper alignment is, it's really bugging me to not know how to do it with my 80. I'm not asking for a detailed, step by step description. I just want to know where I am supposed to make the adjustments because I haven't found any place on the machine that could possibly be for aligning, unless the front panel buttons do more than they look like they do. Can anybody tell me where to start? I'm not gonna attempt alignment until I recieve the manual in the mail, but I just want to know where (or how) the alignment is done.

Also, some of the LED meter lights for a few of the tracks have burnt out. Are these replaceable somehow? Can anybody suggest a decent place (around the Los Angeles area, preferrably) where I can get it serviced? I don't trust just any audio repair shop (even "official" repair shops) because I've had way too many bad experiences in the past.

Besides the stuff I just mentioned, can anybody think of anything I should know about this machine? Any comments or suggestions on how to get the most out of this machine would be GREATLY appreciated.

Who else owns a Model 80 around here?

[billisa]

Congratulations. Fostex made some great Reel-to-Reel machines. The main Fostex office is in CA, (Norwalk?). I'd give 'em a call and see if they can help. Also, there's the analogue forum on this board, and I've heard a number of people there have Fostex's.

[xstatic]

I started with one of those exact reel to reels years ago. Really not a bad little machine at all for what it is. I am not sure, but i thought those little model 80's were "self aligning" heads and weren't supposed to be screwed with. Secondly, mine had the exact same meter problems. I am no tech, but when I tried to get a quote on getting the meter stuff worked out the quote was insanely high. To the point where I would rather spend that mopney buying another machine for parts and try it myself rather than pay for the repairs. They said something about the way the meters were pu into the machine and the rarity of the parts. Personally, I didn't go for that, but the company I took it to was the local Fostex authorized repair service in my area. I really wish I still had my little Fostex. With all the expansion my studio has gone through, I would love to have my little Fostex and the cheezy little mixer that went with it to hang on my wall as a reminder of how far I have come Good luck and have fun

[A Reel Person]

That's a couple hundred less than I paid!!!

Fostex headquarters are in Norwalk, CA, so that's probably your best bet.

Yeah, that's very cool!

[xstatic]

The last time I had to call Fostex (6 months or so ago) it was not a very happy dealing with them.

[K.C. Maloney]

Fortunately, I got the manual for the model 80 yesterday so now I can rest easily. I figure, the meters aren't that big of a deal; I have metering on my mixer, and various rack gear; as long as I keep it all at unity, I should have an accurate playback meter. Plus, I found out that the Model 80 does indeed require head alignment. The alignment controls are located under a panel on the back. It works just like any tape machine's alignment, which is good. The only crappy part is that I had to spend $90 to get the correct MRL tape. But, I figure since I got the whole thing for free, $90 can't hurt, especially when it's something as important as alignment; besides, it's not like I'm using it as the hub of my recording setup. I just want to be able to record certain tracks with analog and then dump them back into pro tools. It will be great to record my drum tracks with the M-80 for that sweet warm tape compression and then record them back through my TC A/Ds at 24 bit. I've been experimenting with this method and it's sounding really nice. I didn't know how poor quality the A/Ds on the Digi002 rack were until I upgraded to external A/Ds. The change wasn't EVEN subtle. Good A/Ds can make a world of a difference in your sound.

Anyways, I'm happy. I don't even want to start calling Fostex because I'll know I'll just get frustrated. I'll be content with what I have (for the moment, of course).

[PowRGnome]

I recently came into an 80 for cheap and I've been trying to get it to work. Meters are fine, I have a manual that talks about calibration, fine, and I can use my Nord MicroModular to generate test tones. My problem is that the metal roller that is under the head assembly but not attached to it, on the right side, does not roll and allow the tape to go during play and record, but the unit does fastforward and rewind just fine. I'm pretty sure that the thing should be rolling, but if it was not meant to roll my next guess would be that the big plastic and rubber roller to the right of it is pressing against it too hard. Either way I need to get this straightened out, and any help would be much appreciated.

Jon Mullen

[A Reel Person]

Forgive me for being so presumptuous.

First of all, neither of the tape guides, left or right of the head should spin.

Second, by your description, what I believe you are talking about is the "tape lifter". The tape lifter assembly should not spin, either, but it should move up/down in conjunction with the pinchwheel.

The pinchwheel and capstan are the first moving parts to the right of the headstack, and they should indeed be spinning.

If you, by chance, are threading the tape *on top* of the tape lifter, when the tape lifter actuates toward the head, it pinches the tape between the heads, often enough to prevent proper forward movement of tape.

When you thread the tape, the tape should travel: (from left to right),...
-DOWN, off the left side of the supply reel, while rotating in a COUNTER-clockwise motion,...
-UNDER the Left Tension roller,...
-OVER the Left Idler roller,...
-UNDER the Left tape guide,... (left of the headstack),...
-UNDER the Tape-Lifter, (not over, "between", or "through"),...
-UNDER the Right tape guide,... (right of the headstack),...
-BETWEEN the capstan and pinch roller,...
-OVER the Right Idler roller,...
-UNDER the Left Tension roller,... and
-UPWARD to the takeup reel, where it winds to the RIGHT side of the reel, turning in a CCW motion.

Try it that way.

Pls forgive me for being so presumptuous, but improper tape threading is a major cause of "malfunctions" for new users. /DA

[PowRGnome]

I wouldn't accuse you of being presumptuous, after all I am new to this. But I got the manual, and I know for a fact it's threaded correctly. I think the problem was what you refered to as the capstan. It was not spinning when I made the post. However, over the protests of my drummer, I laid my hands on the fucker and applied some pressure. Problem solved, it's not constantly spinning counterclockwise. Thanks anyway.

Jon Mullen

[A Reel Person]

The capstan should spin counter clockwise any time the right tension arm is lifted out of it's "home" position. If the capstan is not spinning, it usually indicates the capstan drive belt has gone bad.

The capstan belt is a high failure item, more common after this many years, & well known in analog circles. You always have to verify proper tape loading, & take nothing for granted. You've covered your basics very well.

The Model 80 will be a fine deck, once you get the capstan issue resolved. Good luck!!

[PowRGnome]

Did I say it's not spinning well? I meant it is. I got the Midas touch, baby, and a little shove in the right direction fixed it. I'm intrigued about these "self-aligning heads", though, mainly cause I can't/don't have time to find an MRL for it. Does anyone know anything about this? Can I just set the thing up and run with it?

Thanks,
Jon Mullen

[A Reel Person]

It was probably stuck from not being used for so long. This could also indicate a slightly worn capstan belt, but not to worry unless you have other noticeable speed related issues.

You can do simple layman's audio tests by recording a signal, and verifying you get basically the same tape levels on playback. This can be done with a keyboard or other sound source. With a capable mixer and proper signal routing, you should be able to send each track the same signal, and record 8 tracks simultaneously. Simple tests such as this will put the deck through it's paces.

You could reasonably expect the record/playback response to be relatively equal, with playback response possibly flagging a bit, but with gain still in the usable range. If you're real finicky about 0/0 match on record/playback response, a calibration with the proper MRL tape would be advised.

[PowRGnome]

My local guy (the only one who would own up to the task) has said it'll cost $125 to look at the thing and much more to align it if it can even be aligned. I think it's time to go DIY on this mother...

[hebjam]

Hi!
I just got A Fostex M-80 machine but I dont hear playback.
It moniters fine but when i disarm the track and play back i hear silence.
There is hiss though, which decreases when i press dolby so something is happening....

I'm using Basf Emtec 468 1/4" tape. What could it be?

Thanks!

[hebjam]

Anyone? Thanks!!!

[Pequ]

Dear Hebjam,

I responded to your question regarding the same problem in the analog forum: http://www.homerecording.com/bbs/sho...03&postcount=2

Hope you got it working.

BR, Pekka

[dkelley]

pardon my possible ignorance, and sorry for bringing up an old thread but you guys are talking about something that's relevent to me currently with my fostex model 80. I'm in the process of cleaning the thing up after not using it in forever and someone here said that you "align the heads" by adjusting pots on the rear panel of the deck.

Um, sorry again if this sounds stupid, but from my years of working with analog tape isn't the tape head alignment the actual physical positioning of the actual physical tape heads on the machine. Am I completely a dinosaur here or doesn't that have to be done with tiny screwdrivers on the actual tape head assembly?

What I believe you're actually talking about here with the pots on the back is calibrating the signal levels. That's obviously important too, but the alignment of the tape head is IMHO much more vital to the quality of the sound (it affects crosstalk, noise, and most importantly frequency response and signal level), and most machines need alignment done regularly.

Does the fostex model 80 have what someone above called something like auto-aligning tape heads or does it in fact need actual manual tape head alignment regularly?

And of course there's demagnetizing also but everyone's touched on that how I'd expect.

Thanks for clearing this up...

Cheers,
Don

[A Reel Person]

Alignment and calibration often get lumped in together and used interchangeably, though they are two distinct things. Of course, head alignment is a critical first step in it all, that if it's too far off will make your calibration adjustments all the more inaccurate.

Unfortunately, there is no "auto" alignment, though these types of machines had head mounts that were supposed to minimize slippage and movement of the head over time. Head alignment is always the best/first place to start, if you have proper tech skills and workbench to DIY. Sometimes in a layman's DIY world actual head alignment gets skipped, and calibration results are still ok.

[dkelley]

Originally Posted by A Reel Person

Alignment and calibration often get lumped in together and used interchangeably...

thanks! great info, makes me feel less stupid in what I've believed all my life and also teaches me something new.

Cheers!
Don

[Sonic Rat]

Hey heb....check to make sure the input monitor button isn't on during playback........that may be your problem...........