The Boomer

[igore]

I am in need of some serious advice regarding speaker placement. My problem is that I have relatively good quality speakers (Studiophile BX8's) attached to a relatively quality subwoofer (Studiophile SBX) but I have not been successful in getting these elements to integrate properly.
It sounds pretty good, but not great and I've tried a whole lot to get where I am now. I've moved the sub from center ground (against the wall in front of the keyboard) to left corner, to right corner, to it's current position which is the right rear placement. The reason I've moved it so much is that I know what it is capable of and have not been able to achieve that. Like, for example, It is very easy to hear it reproducing ideal bass frequencies (the deepest of deep)when my head is close to it, or when I'm positioned close to a wall or in a corner. But when I'm sitting dead center in front of my keyboard, the bass sounds shallow and weak. I've played with the switches and knobs on the back of all this equipment, and I feel that I've got a pretty good grasp on those adjustments. Except for the phase knob. What is it? How do I utilize it? I've experimented a lot with it, but I can't hear much difference.
I'm not sure if this is a placement issue, an eq issue (involving the back panels of the speakers) or if I need to put up some auralex foam. Does anyone have any suggestions?

Also, I'd like to follow up with some pictures. I tried to attach them but apparently they're too large. How do I get around this?

[mshilarious]

Originally Posted by igore

I'm not sure if this is a placement issue, an eq issue (involving the back panels of the speakers) or if I need to put up some auralex foam. Does anyone have any suggestions?

Probably what you need is not foam but bass traps. Search this board for more info.

The phase control probably won't help that much, but give it a shot. Here's a nifty article on sub placement:

http://sound.westhost.com/subcon.htm

[Ethan Winer]

Igore,

> when I'm sitting dead center in front of my keyboard, the bass sounds shallow and weak. <

I agree with MS that you need real bass traps, not foam. You may also be able to improve things with better positioning.

If you tell me the dimensions of your room I'll suggest where to place the main speakers and sub. In the mean time, see the Acoustics FAQ, second in the list on my Articles page:

www.ethanwiner.com/articles.html

It explains a lot of these issues in detail.

--Ethan

[igore]

I really appreciate the responses. First off, I have a feeling that the article on the sub conundrum has the potential to be very helpful to me. However, my knowledge and understanding of this topic (1/2 wave (cancel!) 3/4 wave (-3db) etc.) is not quite there yet. I don't understand how decibels interact with octaves and other seemingly essential things. Can someone recommend a better starting point? thanks.
In regards to Ethan, the room is 12'x12' and 9' tall. I sit dead center, about 4' feet back from one of the walls; facing it. What do you suggest?

[60's guy]

igore,

If you go here:

http://www.johnlsayers.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=630

You can download Barefoot’s calculator for positioning monitors. Sorry..I can’t recall if you need to be a signed member to do so.

In any case…bass trapping / absorbers aside…it does provide you with a decent indication where your monitors need to be placed within your particular room. It is also important that you input the correct coefficients for your particular walls. Dig deeper into the site to obtain the info you need for those values. Be advised that the low freq cut-off value of your monitors is of importance.

I can attest to the fact that this helped me immensely to obtain a better monitoring perspective than I had seen prior, but I still seem to experience some difficulty with bass and mid response. Then again...I'm 55 yrs old and don't quite hear as well as I used to. LOL!

I had downloaded Ethan’s Mode calculator many months ago. Only as today had I actually employed it because I was experiencing difficulties at certain freqs (real or imagined). Your post picqued my interest.

Do yourself a favor and check out Ethan's videos. Sine wave importance or non-importance...the clips are well worth viewing.

My particular room dimensions are 14’ wide x 24’ length x 8’ ceiling ht. I have to say that I am still a bit insecure with my interpretations of the data, but overall I feel that my room isn’t as bad as I had imagined, however I now see that I may require some effective bass trapping….purchased or home built.

Without providing further details of my room…I am most interested in Ethan’s response to your post… and curious of his opinion as to my room dimensions.

p.s. Thank you Ethan. I have learned much from your site and videos.

p.p.s. I’m in Ellington, CT

Randy

[Ethan Winer]

Igore,

> my knowledge and understanding of this topic (1/2 wave (cancel!) 3/4 wave (-3db) etc.) is not quite there yet. <

It's not as complicated as it might seem at first. I'm not a math guy at all, and if I can understand it so can you. I agree with Randy that you'll benefit from watching the two videos on my company's web site. The Videos page is linked under Acoustics Info.

> the room is 12'x12' and 9' tall. I sit dead center, about 4' feet back from one of the walls <

Being 12x12 and thus square is a problem, and that's not helped by having a 9 foot ceiling since all three dimensions have 3 as a common denominator. But there's nothing you can do about that, so don't waste energy worrying about it!

The ideal place to sit in that room is where your ears are 4-1/2 feet back from the front wall. You're pretty close to that already, so the 1/2 foot change won't make much difference. But try it anyway. And you're already centered left and right, which is good. So for that room you won't be able to improve things much further by positioning alone. I'm not sure where's the best place for a subwoofer in a square room. I have mine in one of the front corners, and it's fabulous there, but my room is larger, has better dimensions, and has a lot of bass trapping. So...

Since you can't do anything about the dimensions, the next step is bass traps, and also some mid/high frequency absorption at the first reflection points on the side walls and ceiling. These are all described in the FAQ I linked above.

--Ethan

[Ethan Winer]

Randy,

> My particular room dimensions are 14’ wide x 24’ length x 8’ ceiling <

That's a lot better than most rooms in homes I see. The ratio is not ideal, but it's not terrible either, and at least you have enough length and overall volume.

> I now see that I may require some effective bass trapping <

Even the best proportioned rooms need bass trapping.

> I’m in Ellington, CT <

And as a 60s guy in his 50s you're also my age. If you're ever in my neighborhood, or want to make a special trip, you're most welcome to stop by for a visit any time.

--Ethan