Tube Mic vs Reg Condeser w/ Tube Preamp

[Les W]

Can you get the condeser w/ tube pre to give a similar sound??

I notice the tube pre have a tube setting knob so...I am just curious

If this is sowouldn;t that make the Condenser + Tube Pre more versatile??
Les

[c7sus]

What pre are you talking about? What is a "tube setting" knob? Sounds like something on a cheap "tewb" pre.........

In which case I'd say a well-made tube mic through a well-designed and constructed SS pre would probably sound better.

And probably so would a decent SS condensor.

[Les W]

I mean tubes like the Presonus TUBEpre and the DMP3 is the same way I THINK...

[Mark7]

There's no tube in the DMP3. It's solid state alll the way.

[Treeline]

The DMP3 has its own sound - I like it because it is quiet, consistent and extremely versatile, and its bang for the buck quotient is head and shoulders above anything else I've seen out there. I think of it as "the SM57 of preamps." I don't think I'd ever use the word "tube" in the same paragraph, though - except perhaps for this one.

[darrin_h2000]

Good as it is the DMP3 is a chip pre...solid state implies transistors.

[BlindCowboy]

I have yet to have a single good experience with the Presonus Tewbpre. The one thing I can look at in my stuff and say, "That was a waste of money."

[Adzzz]

I'm gonna hafta agree with Blind Cowboy on this...Presonus in general has been a big soft-on for me. Right up there with *some* of the Behringer stuff and Nady gear...

[Robert D]

Originally Posted by darrin_h2000

Good as it is the DMP3 is a chip pre...solid state implies transistors.

Discreet implies transistors, solid state implies non-tube. To further confuse the issue, there are discreet IC's, which refers to the fact that they won't tell your wife what you've really been up to in the studio, or something like that.
RD

[Robert D]

Originally Posted by Les W

If this is sowouldn;t that make the Condenser + Tube Pre more versatile??
Les

Yes, I would a agree that if your gonna put one tube somwhere in your studio, it will be more versatile in a pre than in a mic. For one, it can then be used with different mics. For two, it has a gain knob to drive the tube harder or softer as you wish. A tube in a mic is biased and driven to be totally in the linear portion of the curve. In a pre you can drive the tube however you want.

RD

[tdukex]

No, the DMP3 is not a 2B pre.

[Les W]

thx you guys I learned a lot. I think because of the VU meters i assumed the DMP3 was a tube

[chessrock]

Originally Posted by Robert D

Discreet implies transistors, solid state implies non-tube. To further confuse the issue, there are discreet IC's, which refers to the fact that they won't tell your wife what you've really been up to in the studio, or something like that.
RD

Aren't IC chips just a bunch of transistors in silicon?

[punkin]

Seems like the DMP3 has it in this comparison...anyone using the M-Audio "TAMPA" unit? The S/PDIF feature looks promising as well? A few bucks more seems to get you quite a bit more gear.


sjl

[c7sus]

Originally Posted by chessrock

Aren't IC chips just a bunch of transistors in silicon?

I like those lime Tostitos chips in Pace Medium Picante sauce.

Mmmmmmmmmmm!

And the jar makes a really nice bong later!

[punkin]

ummm....huh?

Who me?

[phaqu]

I only have 1 tube mic to base my opinion on so....Seems to me that a tube mic will soften up,round out, a harsher(brassy...cant think of a descriptive term) vocal track before it gets to the pre to be amplified. SS mics have a little more of a tendancy to be less......forgiving (even when ran through a good tube pre). If Im tracking someone with an edgy voice, I grab the tube mic first. ( Thats if they have a decent singing voice, otherwise I put a 57 or 58 or RE20 on them)

[Richard Monroe]

Yo Les! To summarize the above, There are "real" tube preamps that use big mucking power tubes, and "tewb" pres, which send part or all of the signal through a little tube in the front end of the amp, usually with an adjustable amount of tube effect. Tubes are used in preamps and mics to introduce distortion. In a guitar amp, that effect is obvious. In a mic pre or mic, the effect is intended to be more subtle. It decreases the accuracy of the signal, like airbrushing a Playboy centerfold so we don't see her stretch marks. There's lots of things in sound that you really don't want to hear. This effect is called "warmth" when we like it, and "muddy" when we don't. Once upon a time, *all* preamps and *all* condenser mics had tubes in them, and the world got along just fine.

In general, if you are buying a cheap preamp, a solid state pre is a better choice, and very few serious audio enginerers have much use for a "tewb" amp of any description. At best, it's an effect you use occasionally for something unusual, usually meaning that you can't get enough gain without dialing up some distortion. At worst, the signal is always running through that tewb, and you always have useless, nasty, distortion (and noise).

Real tube amps are often wonderful things, and they don't come cheap. The Groove Tubes "The Brick" is one of the cheapest real tube amps, at about $500. Really good ones are more likely $1000-$2500 per channel, and are to die for. If you aren't ready to spend at least $500 per channel on a preamp, I recommend solid state. I agree with a lot of people that the DMP3 is one of the cheapest preamps that doesn't basically suck. I'm saving my dinero now for a real tube pre, most likely a Pendulum MDP-1, which I love. Best of luck.-Richie

[dgatwood]

Originally Posted by Robert D

Discreet implies transistors, solid state implies non-tube. To further confuse the issue, there are discreet IC's, which refers to the fact that they won't tell your wife what you've really been up to in the studio, or something like that.
RD

Ii think you mean discrete. Discreet is a division of AutoDesk that makes consumer video software....

[soundchaser59]

Originally Posted by Robert D

Discreet implies transistors, solid state implies non-tube. To further confuse the issue, there are discreet IC's, which refers to the fact that they won't tell your wife what you've really been up to in the studio, or something like that.
RD

Ok, I'll sign up for Electronics 101 here.....

Then why have I recently seen a (guitar accessory) described by the manufacturer as "discrete analog"?? Is it not possible to have a "discrete" circuit that does not have any transistors in it?

And you are saying it is possible to have a solid state circuit with no transistors in it? If "solid state" implies only "non-tube" and "discrete" implies "transistors" then what is it that replaces the tube in a solid state device?

[soundchaser59]

Originally Posted by c7sus

I like those lime Tostitos chips in Pace Medium Picante sauce.

Mmmmmmmmmmm!

And the jar makes a really nice bong later!

Do you need a bong because you eat Pace?

Or is the bong the reason why you believe Pace is edible?

[soundchaser59]

Having recently done my own basement testing with (Mackie) solid state pre's and a modest starved plate tube pre (not a hi voltage pre like the Brick, darn it!), I have to say that Richard is, once again, right on the money.

I like the sound of the tube pre exactly because of that tiny bit of distortion it lets me mix in to the signal. But it is noisy. It's useful in mixes where the sound is full and loud and fast and the noise floor will not be heard. It really made my guitar cab mics come alive. The RE20 loves it! I suspect the RE20 and the 414 would absolutely shine thru a Groove Tubes hi voltage pre!

But for music where I need dead silence, like a solo acoustic guitar or a soft solo vocal, the tube pre I have is too noisy. I switch over to the solid state pre and it is extremely quiet, even with extra gain.......but.....I dont like it because it makes me work harder to get a sound I can live with, because it is more honest, more accurate, and ergo less forgiving.